Author Topic: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?  (Read 638 times)

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Offline viocjit

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Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« on: May 09, 2013, 09:03:13 AM »
I say that the Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law , I will explain why I think that.

1.I will quote a verses from the torah in Hebrew (Hebrew : ????).
2.I will quote the translations of this verse in 5 versions.
3.My commentary.

I will begin with (Leviticus 20:16).

Hebrew text : ?????????? ??????? ????????? ?????????????????? ?????????? ??????? ???????????? ?????????????? ????????????????? ????? ????????? ?????????? ??????

Translations :

1.King James Version (Protestant bible with some archaic therms) : And if a woman approach unto any beast, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the woman, and the beast: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

2.Revised standard version catholic version edition (Catholic) : If a woman approaches any beast and lies with it, you shall kill the woman and the beast; they shall be put to death, their blood is upon them.

3.Wycliffe Bible (Use some archaic therms) : A woman that lieth under any beast, be she slain together with it; their blood be on them.

4.Darby Translation (Protestant) : And if a woman approach unto any beast to gender therewith, thou shalt kill the woman and the beast: they shall certainly be put to death; their blood is upon them.

5.Orthodox Jewish Bible (Messianic Jewish) : And if an isha approach unto any behemah, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the isha, and the beast; they shall surely be put to death; their dahm shall be upon them.

My commentary : The Jews say apply the mosaic law but if a Jew see a woman practise this kind of sexual relation , he will kill the woman or not ? I think that no because the majority of Jews will be just shocked and don't apply the mosaic law like this is illegal to kill a woman for that in a lot of countries.

I will share with you others verses an other day.

NOTE : If the system of notation of verses used is the system used by Christians this is by convention.
I prefer use the Christian system of notation like this is more simple for the majority of people.

Offline Willie

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #1 on: May 10, 2013, 09:30:42 PM »
Despite their insistence that religious belief is necessary for developing good morals, for most religious people, the morality that comes from within themselves is much better than what their holy books teach. Perhaps their morals could be even better without the toxic influence of those books.


Offline viocjit

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #2 on: May 11, 2013, 08:37:13 AM »
Despite their insistence that religious belief is necessary for developing good morals, for most religious people, the morality that comes from within themselves is much better than what their holy books teach. Perhaps their morals could be even better without the toxic influence of those books.

Your conception of moral is interessant because I realised many times that these religious people don't apply all the moral from their holy book.
This verse from Leviticus is a good example.

Offline Willie

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2013, 10:55:54 AM »
Your conception of moral is interessant because I realised many times that these religious people don't apply all the moral from their holy book.
This verse from Leviticus is a good example.

Yes, it is a good example. That people tend to either rationalize away, or ignore completely, such ugly teachings in their professed religions demonstrates that their own internal moral compass is a better moral guide than their religion. How would they even be able to recognize the good bits of their religion's teaching (don't kill, don't steal, etc.) as good if not for some other moral reference with which to judge it?

The good morals of Christians, Jews, Muslims, etc. come from the same source as the good morals of us non-believers. We just don't feel a need to attribute our internal moral compass to supernatural beings or to credulous acceptance of ancient superstitions that are as apt to teach bad, or just silly, morals as good ones.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2013, 12:35:58 PM »
I say that the Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law

5.Orthodox Jewish Bible (Messianic Jewish) : And if an isha approach unto any behemah, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the isha, and the beast; they shall surely be put to death; their dahm shall be upon them.

My commentary : The Jews say apply the mosaic law but if a Jew see a woman practise this kind of sexual relation , he will kill the woman or not ? I think that no because the majority of Jews will be just shocked and don't apply the mosaic law like this is illegal to kill a woman for that in a lot of countries.
I assure you that in various parts of Israel, particularly ultraorthodox parts, a woman wearing a short skirt will be attacked - it happens regularly.

You do not seem to have researched how common bestiality is in Israel nor what the penalty is. I doubt the law would sentence anyone to death but I feel completely sure that, left to orthodox jews, it would be the death penalty.

I have not detailed access to the Torah and Religious laws but, I suspect that it will state somewhere that even an ultraorhtodox Jew must obey secular law. (The Bible certainly says Christians should obey secular law, and you quote from a Christian Bible.)
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline viocjit

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #5 on: May 11, 2013, 12:47:15 PM »
I will quote another verse in the Leviticus. This verse is about adultery. (Leviticus 20:10).
I will do the same thing for Leviticus 20:16.

Hebrew text : ???????? ??????? ??????? ??????????? ?????? ??????? ???????? ??????????? ???????? ????????????? ????????? ??????????????

Translations :

1.King James Version (Protestant bible with some archaic therms) : And the man that committeth adultery with another man's wife, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

2.Revised standard version catholic version edition (Catholic) : If a man commits adultery with the wife of[a] his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death.

3.Wycliffe Bible (Use some archaic therms) : If a man doeth lechery with another man’s wife, and doeth adultery with his neighbour’s wife, both the adulterer and the adulteress die they by death. (If a man doeth lechery with another man’s wife, yea, if he doeth adultery with his neighbour’s wife, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall be put to death.)

4.Darby Translation (Protestant) : And a man that committeth adultery with a man's wife, who committeth adultery with his neighbour's wife, -- the adulterer and the adulteress shall certainly be put to death.

5.Orthodox Jewish Bible (Messianic Jewish) : And the ish that committeth adultery with the wife of another ish, even he that committeth adultery with his neighbor’s wife, the no’ef (adulterer) and the no’efet (adulteress) shall surely be put to death.

My commentary : Again that is an evidence that Jews don't apply the mosaic law.

NOTE : If the system of notation of verses used is the system used by Christians this is by convention.
I prefer use the Christian system of notation like this is more simple for the majority of people.

Offline viocjit

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #6 on: May 11, 2013, 12:53:02 PM »
I say that the Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law

5.Orthodox Jewish Bible (Messianic Jewish) : And if an isha approach unto any behemah, and lie down thereto, thou shalt kill the isha, and the beast; they shall surely be put to death; their dahm shall be upon them.

My commentary : The Jews say apply the mosaic law but if a Jew see a woman practise this kind of sexual relation , he will kill the woman or not ? I think that no because the majority of Jews will be just shocked and don't apply the mosaic law like this is illegal to kill a woman for that in a lot of countries.
I assure you that in various parts of Israel, particularly ultraorthodox parts, a woman wearing a short skirt will be attacked - it happens regularly.

You do not seem to have researched how common bestiality is in Israel nor what the penalty is. I doubt the law would sentence anyone to death but I feel completely sure that, left to orthodox jews, it would be the death penalty.

I have not detailed access to the Torah and Religious laws but, I suspect that it will state somewhere that even an ultraorhtodox Jew must obey secular law. (The Bible certainly says Christians should obey secular law, and you quote from a Christian Bible.)

The Ultraorthodox are a particular case (they are fundamentalist) I speak about the majority of jews.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #7 on: May 12, 2013, 04:46:54 AM »

The Ultraorthodox are a particular case (they are fundamentalist) I speak about the majority of jews.

The majority of Jews also believe that whilst on earth you should obey the laws of man. The laws of man do not have the death penalty for the crimes you give.
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Online 12 Monkeys

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Re: Why Jews don't apply a part of mosaic law ?
« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2013, 11:32:07 AM »
 Christians do not apply the rules God has imposed on them either,only in rare cases where we judge the killers(or whatever) as insane.
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)