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General Religious Discussion / Re: Determinism vs Free Will.
« Last post by lectricpharaoh on Yesterday at 04:37:41 PM »
Throw Quantum mechanics into it then we have free will but so what?  Whether I am on a predictable path and feel I have free will or if quantum mechanics would make a different outcome allowed if the universe was replayed.
Quantum mechanics doesn't introduce free will into the system.  It introduces uncertainty.

The distinction between a truly deterministic system and a chaotic one isn't actually meaningful.  In the latter case, we can't predict everything because of inherent randomness, while in the former, we can't predict everything because we're limited in the amount of knowledge we can obtain about the system, much less process.

What we can do is make predictions that are less than 100% certain by assessing probabilities.  The more macroscopic the scale, the more likely these predictions will hold.  For example, if I try to predict the exact position of an electron, I'm highly likely to be mistaken.  On the other hand, if I predict that a ball will fall towards the ground when I drop it, my correctness is virtually assured.  Even in the second case, though, it is conceivable that enough virtual particles could appear above the earth to create a strong enough gravitational pull to cause the ball (and everything else on the planet, plus the planet itself) to fall towards it.  It's also staggeringly unlikely, since it relies on the synchronicity of an effectively uncountable number of unlikely events.

The easiest thing, and most practical one in my opinion, is to acknowledge that while free will doesn't exist, we can behave as though it does.
Of course it's not a real religion. There's only one real religion, right? &)
Bummer - sounded like a religion I could get behind  8)

California court rules that Sun Worshipping Atheism is not a religion and requires no accommodation.

Marshel Copple is the sole follower of “Sun Worshipping Atheism,” a belief system the former corrections officer created that advocates sleeping at least eight hours a day, daily fresh air, frequent exercise, having a job, social interaction, and skepticism.

However, his beliefs on sleep conflicted with his work as a corrections officer, which required him to be available to work eight hours of overtime if needed and up to 16 hours in the event of a prison riot, reported The National Law Review.

Copple asked to limit his shifts to eight hours a day as a religious accommodation, which the Department of Corrections denied.

So he resigned and filed a lawsuit claiming religious discrimination, failure to accommodate, and constructive discharge.
General Religious Discussion / Re: Determinism vs Free Will.
« Last post by One Above All on Yesterday at 04:21:17 PM »
From a scientific PoV? No problem. From an atheistic PoV? No problem either. Probably because neither of those things are concerned with determinism or free will.
From a human PoV? It matters a lot, because the illusion is more vivid than our perception that we experience things in real time.
EDIT: Nevertheless, as jaimehlers said, to the best of our knowledge, we live in a stochastic universe. It has elements of randomness and elements of determinism. Free will, however, by its very nature, is impossible to verify. Again, as jaimehlers said, just going back in time would change outcomes.

Ironically, the only way you could verify free will would be if we lived in an apparently deterministic universe (meaning going back in time wouldn't affect anything) and when we went back in time, things would change.
General Religious Discussion / Re: Are atheist humanist?
« Last post by junebug72 on Yesterday at 04:19:11 PM »
I had a bad fucking day.  This newer perception of mine is getting me through it.  No gods no spirits needed. Well I could use some tequila but it might get wild up in here if I did that.  I would swallow the worm.

General Religious Discussion / Re: If I could disprove the bible 100%
« Last post by wright on Yesterday at 04:08:46 PM »
Aside from the massive historical and ideological commitment to Christianity, evidence of the sort the OP describes would be up against institutions like the Catholic Church. Now there's a juggernaut that's been putting down competition for centuries, even if they have started losing ground in the last dozen or so decades.

If the Catholic clergy were convinced this new discovery was a real threat, you'd see serious effort expended to discredit it and its discoverers. They can't declare inquisitions and holy wars by themselves any more, but I bet they'd do anything and everything short of that.

I swear, one day, when I am tired of working for a living, I am going to follow my daddy's footsteps into the family con artist business and start a religion.[1] Because, clearly, you can fool most of the people, most of the time. Just look at skeptic, PB, Brando, Jst and even OCG. There's money to be made, fleecing the sheeple.
 1. Jag and Astreja will join me as my sacred prophetesses. One and jaimehlers will maintain our web presence. Nam will be our studly manservant/bodyguard and epidemic can sweep the temple and keep up the grounds. We will get rich, rich, rich. :angel:

Dibs on the landscaping, if I'm not too old by then![2] I want in on any religion that has our Forum Trinity of UnGoddesses involved!
 2. I'll send you a resume, I gots experience!
General Religious Discussion / Re: If I could disprove the bible 100%
« Last post by lectricpharaoh on Yesterday at 04:05:34 PM »
Well in my hypothetical they are not discarded books but rather recently discovered books with names dates and verifiable contemporary validation from unbiased sources.
Your books are rejected, because..  y'know...  Satan.
General Religious Discussion / Re: Are atheist humanist?
« Last post by junebug72 on Yesterday at 03:52:03 PM »
I like heathen. Sounds like more fun than either atheist or humanist. Like being a drunk sounds like more fun than being an alcoholic, or a problem drinker. ;)

Since you put it like that hell yea!
What you say? Are you implying that black women talk a lot? Huh? [Stereotypically bugging virtual eyes, doing virtual neck thing and waving virtual finger.]

Actually, no. I was referring to just you but now that I think about it...


General Religious Discussion / My sacrifice means more than a gods death
« Last post by junebug72 on Yesterday at 03:50:04 PM »
I really just want to amp up the views. I am serious.  They can have me.   

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