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71
General Religious Discussion / Re: God Strikes Again
« Last post by velkyn on January 19, 2018, 10:44:52 AM »
If theists will offer excuses why they would not help clear land mines e.g. we can't test god, then they don't actually believe since their bible says that testing god is no problem (see: Doubting Thomas).   
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Chatter / Re: Am I doing anything that bothers anyone in posts here?
« Last post by jdawg70 on January 19, 2018, 10:35:20 AM »
From my perspective you are not doing anything bothersome, no.

But every time I see your username I think of really slow x86 processors, which is a form of being bothered.
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General Religious Discussion / Re: God Strikes Again
« Last post by YouCantHandleTheTruth on January 19, 2018, 10:25:38 AM »
Add to the test about 500 clergy, priests, pastors, bishops and of course the television preachers. Wonder how their scores would fair?

That's a really good question.  I'm sure most would come up with some excuse not to do it.  Or if they did it and failed they'd say that the tests aren't conclusive. 

I'm sure most Christians see us as party poopers and very negative people for not believing, and as angry people.  I think our anger is really directed not at them. but the charlatans that do damage by robbing people of money.  There are so many, like the Joel Osteens, Jim Bakkers, etc.  Then there are the people that say they can move things with their mind like James Hydrick or Uri Gellar who are exposed as frauds by James Randi.  Thank goodness there are people as bright as Randi who can expose them and prevent more people from being defrauded, at least those who will listen.

My sister in law was talking last night first about some faith healer who can heal people across the country (it was just bizarre) and that he had healed many people for no cost (I forgot the guy's name).  Then she talked about people who can move things with their mind.  For the healer I asked why he doesn't go into children's hospitals and didn't get an answer.  For the people who can move things with their mind I asked her why they wouldn't go to Vegas and become billionaires and she asked how moving things with your mind could make them rich.  I stated the obvious in playing roulette and moving the ball to a color or number, or slot machines and moving all the spaces to diamonds.  Then she said "maybe they don't do it for the money."  Then I showed her the James Randi - James Hydrick video on YouTube and she conceded that was a good point, and she had never heard of James Randi's $1 million paranormal challenge, etc.

I appreciate whoever first brought up the James Hydrick - James Randi story on here, because that's really been helpful.  It's hilarious that it was broadcast on national TV and hosted by Bob Barker.
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / Re: not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by velkyn on January 19, 2018, 09:29:37 AM »
thanks, jdawg, that was exactly it, the white arrow was clicked the other way.  Wonder how I did that. 
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / Re: not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by jdawg70 on January 19, 2018, 09:28:20 AM »
velkyn -

Perhaps it's this:


There is a white arrow in the upper right of the site.  If it's pointing down then it's hiding some stuff - click it and you should see your avatar and stuff like unread messages should show up.

Not sure why you're not seeing the top logo.  If you can't see the image I've inlined in this post, then I think it has something to do with your connection and this particular image host.
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / Re: not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by Nick on January 19, 2018, 09:05:33 AM »
Mine is fine.  Have you been pissing off the gods?
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / Re: not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by stuffin on January 19, 2018, 08:32:20 AM »
I'm getting all that
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / Re: not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by One Above All on January 19, 2018, 08:32:13 AM »
Seems fine on my end. Are you using an adblocker? It could have erroneously blocked some content here.
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General Religious Discussion / Re: God Strikes Again
« Last post by stuffin on January 19, 2018, 08:26:57 AM »
Because in some way you don’t actually believe any of this stuff.  Your model of reality is exactly the same as ours, which is a model without demons or gods.

I'm trying to wrap my head around this and I'm not sure I have it. On the one hand, mostly I think xians are superstitious thinkers, persuaded more by comforting interpretations of their experiences than objective data, easily rewarded and punished by artificially imposed values, and believers in some kind of magical reality they can't quite grasp but believe to have experienced.

On the other hand, they wear seat belts and eat their veggies.

It seems to me they believe only a portion of the faith-based claims they're introduced to, but those they believe, they genuinely do.

I watched a heart-wrenching thread on my homeschool forum started by a woman who asked for prayers for her son who was diagnosed with cancer. They had faith and believed god was in control and said thanks, no thanks to conventional medication. Things got better for a time and she praised god. Things got worse and she got worried but still praised god. By the end, they had missed their opportunity to address his cancer medically and she was praying for a miracle. I can't imagine a mother like that wouldn't do what she believed was the best thing for her child. Most of us homeschoolers aren't like the ones in the news. She was one of those who put her kids first and worked hard to give him an education better than the one he could have had from local schools. I guess that's why I can't wrap my head around the idea that xians don't really believe the claims of their faith. I see actions that suggest they genuinely believe the claims of their faith, even to the detriment of the very ones they love the most.

It would be very interesting to put this to the test.  Have a study of around 500 Christians who insist they believe in the claims of the Bible and give them lie-detector tests, truth serum or put them under hypnosis.  Ask them about 20 or so questions about miracle claims in the Bible and see how they do on the tests.  I'm sure some would pass because they've convinced themselves the claims are true, but you'd find, as you're saying, that many were hiding the truth.  The overalll numbers from the test would be very interesting.  How many would subject themselves to such a test though if they feared the results would go public?  I doubt very many - many wouldn't have the courage of their convictions.

I don't see this as much different than many couples that claim to be happy and/or monogamous.  On the outside, they may be hosting parties, lovey dovey in public and displaying an image for their friends and family.  But privately, they're struggling, angry at each other, etc.

Being a Christian, or a religious person in general, isn't a whole lot different.  I still really appreciate the way Daniel Dennett describes it - many Christians "believe in belief.  They feel it's a good thing to believe."  So they do it, thinking this makes them better people.

Add to the test about 500 clergy, priests, pastors, bishops and of course the television preachers. Wonder how their scores would fair?
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Forum Questions & Suggestions / not seeing quite a bit of stuff
« Last post by velkyn on January 19, 2018, 08:26:36 AM »
I'm not seeing the welcome velkyn stuff at the top.  Also not seeing the unread messages stuff at the top.  No idea why.   I haven't been seeing the top logo for a while now.  I'm guessing just some strangeness with the forum as usual.
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