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Chatter / More red than blue, blue leads how? US elections.
« Last post by eh! on October 22, 2016, 05:00:49 AM »
I keep hearing how blue is front but about every map shows more red?

Can a US person explain.

eg, scroll to map at bottom;
General Religious Discussion / Re: For The Atheists: If God Told You...
« Last post by wheels5894 on October 22, 2016, 03:28:00 AM »
How does jeebus do away with the old laws when he "said" he wasn't???

This question of Jesus somehow 'doing away' with the old Torah is something of a misunderstanding of the texts. In the Sermon on the MOunt in Matthew, Jesus says he has come to complete the Law (Torah) and continues that not a 'jot or tittle of the Law will be altered. As a practicing Jew, Jesus is clearly statuing that the Law stands and should be followed.

In fact it is not until Acts 15 - the confrontation of Paul and Peter - that an 'agreement' is made in which Gentile converts need to accept the whole of the Torah but merely refrain from eating blood and meat offered to idols. This is an agreement between those we call apostle and not anything that Jesus ever signed up to.

Skep, where's you evidence on this, please?
General Religious Discussion / Re: For The Atheists: If God Told You...
« Last post by eh! on October 22, 2016, 01:11:38 AM »
How does jeebus do away with the old laws when he "said" he wasn't???
General Religious Discussion / Re: For The Atheists: If God Told You...
« Last post by skeptic54768 on October 22, 2016, 01:09:38 AM »
A question for Skeptic, bearing in mind that most of my answer to his question has already been said.

So, Skeptic, Vishnu appears to you and tells you that only be converting to be Buddhist could you avoid oblivion, what would you do. After all, no one knows there is a god and, more importantly, which god it is. So what if it turns out it is not the god you were expecting?

My first instinct would be to think it was a demon. But if somehow someway I knew with 100% certainty that Vishnu was "the true god" then I suppose I would become a Buddhist.
General Religious Discussion / Re: For The Atheists: If God Told You...
« Last post by skeptic54768 on October 22, 2016, 01:06:40 AM »
^^^ heh.  That's is what Skep is likely thinking.  Alas, all his efforts end up showing that he is quite a twit and coward.  I wonder, did he pray really really hard and was sure that we'd answer the way he was hoping?

Answer I was hoping for? I did not expect you guys to post that you would become hardened criminal rapists, nor did I expect you guys to post that even if you were considering it.

I just felt like asking a question. The question nor the answers prove/disprove God's existence, so there is nothing to be cowardly over.
General Religious Discussion / Re: For The Atheists: If God Told You...
« Last post by skeptic54768 on October 22, 2016, 01:02:17 AM »
You were an atheist once, right? How would you answer your questions?

As long as you've been here I'm pretty sure you know the answers to your questions that members will give.

Simple waste of time.

I would do the same thing you guys were saying. I would stay the same and not become evil incarnate.

I was asked this question by an atheist: "If a person kills a few people and he's going to Hell anyway, what's to stop him from killing 100 people or 10 million people?" I did not have a good answer to this question, and then I started thinking about my OP question.

I think it's very possible that this line of thinking is what created the Jesus myth, and stories like the woman about to be stoned for adultery.  Let he without sin cast the first stone.  So the idea is that everyone messes up and sins - but what does Jesus tell that woman?  Go, and sin no more.

So, that gives hope to the person who's killed a few people.  Before the invention of Jesus wiping away sins, there's no incentive for him to stop killing.  Once Jesus comes along and the story is built around him, now there's a reason to stop killing.  You can be forgiven those past transgressions, so long as you "sin no more."  So it seems to add to the argument that the Jesus myth was created to control behavior moving forward.

No, that story shows us Jesus doing away with the old laws and ushering in the new laws, considering the perfect sacrifice was almost complete.
I don't think OCG is trying to "sell" us an excuse but give context to explain what was going on in his head 20 years ago without typing for an hour.  It's not easy giving up Christianity.    It's easier to interpret the bible so it fits.  His generation was raised to fear god.  It had to be more complex than what he shared with us, IMHO.

You guys make good arguments. :)  And jamie, I wish that that thread was on a part of the forum that non-Christians could participate in, then you could join and tell him that!

... *sigh* Think I was being a bit too harsh and confrontational there?  I just get conflicted and frustrated about all this and I guess my frustration is coming through into my posts by being a bit attacking when I don't mean to.

as my esteemed colleagues here have indicated, no you weren't too harsh or confrontational.   It is a common tactic of theists of whatever sect to whine about how non-theists of their kind as being too harsh, or not respectful enough or some such excuse to try to convince their opponent that they are somehow wrong if they dare point out the theist's failures.  Notably, they don't actually have evidence that their claims are true, but that you are somehow not playing "fair" with showing your evidence. 

tell ol' Razz to bring it on if he thinks he can be "tougher".

Honestly I would, and I very much appreciate all your guys support.  However, it may have to wait a bit—someone pointed out that it's off topic and we were already warned in that thread to stay on topic, so the discussion belongs in its own thread.  So I'll either wait until someone makes a new thread, or I'll just quote the past posts and make my own thread on the topic as a starting point from there.  Assuming Razz joins it, which he hopefully will...
General Religious Discussion / Re: Street epistemology
« Last post by velkyn on October 21, 2016, 07:30:21 PM »
not sure where you're going with this exactly...

for a people who claim that they have faith, they sure spend a lot of time looking for evidence
General Religious Discussion / Re: Problems with the Moral Argument for God
« Last post by velkyn on October 21, 2016, 07:28:44 PM »
T has shat on the chess board and flown away??

nah, he was here today.  As usual, we have a Christian who is sure that he has the answers, and then when shown the failure of his arguments, he lurks around.  I wonder if he's praying extra hard for his god to give him a zinger of an answer. 
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