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Nope, I say "it works" meaning "my business works" and im not talking about the "business proposition" is what one would be believing before seeing but the business itself. A proposition or business model is all words and numbers, its not a business yet, so you cant really see the business yet because it isnt there yet, but would you believe the business?

You really need to stop changing the definition of the term "believe" b/c here you are talking about faith - believing even though you have no good reason to. That's what you're talking about right? You want the people you approach to just believe they can "earn" and start working, right?

Secondly, what is a business without numbers, propositions, models, databases, or information? You can say to me, "It sells itself!" all day long and it would be utterly foolish to believe (and invest $10k) without having seen any results or demonstrable evidence.

Would you do it if you dont believe it will ever work?(question unanswered)
If you would still do it despite the fact that you dont believe it would ever work out then thats weird. Really?

As Ive said "If you dont believe you can, You cant coz you wont"

As I said before, testing is different than believing - and you keep switching the definition of "believe" midstream (which is a logical fallacy). On one hand you keep referring to believing something when you have no good reason to, and on the other you are referring to placing tentative trust in something (one's self, the evidence, etc).

Testing is already the act of doing it, still comes around the question would you waste your time testing something you believe wont ever work?

Once again, stop using two different definitions for the same term "believe". It is irrational and therefore invalid.

Second, IF (and only if) I somehow became interested in your business proposition, AND I had not been given sufficient reason to move forward with a preliminary trial of the model (ex - XYZ multi-level-marketing-scheme) then no, I wouldn't waste my time. This is what you are missing. Placing tentative trust in a specific phenomena, or merely having an hypothesis, (such as a business model) and then TESTING that hypothesis (with the willingness to drop it quickly should it fail scrutiny) is NOTHING like the faith (believing before seeing) you keep talking about. They are entirely different, and that is your fallacy.

Actually, In my way, dont propose the business, i just explain the system and what the result would be, the guy sees the system and asks if he could be part of it and how, if he doesnt ask that, i wont bother asking him if he wants to be part of it. Its easier and much more productive to work with people who are interested, faster results.

HAHA, of course it's easy to sell people when they're gullible and don't do their homework. Duh! But these people to which you are selling the business model would be fools if they didn't ask questions and gain some accurate information regarding the model (and it's success rate, or lack thereof). Now, if you are selling a business model that doesn't require an initial investment (i.e. - the stakes aren't that high) then SO WHAT! But this now has nothing in common with your Jesus analogy. There's nothing to put your trust in (no person), except an old book you believed from the outset (not like your business model which requires placing trust in the demonstrable business and persons). And your religion requires full-commitment from the outset (life altering dedication) without of which there is the threat of eternal torture. Are you threatening to torture people if they don't accept your business proposition? Again, you have a false analogy. You are not comparing apples to apples here.

Then dont put their money at risk in the first place, when they put out their money, give them products and services that is Value For Their Money, so ROI is immediate, no risk, not Foolish.

Now when it comes to Jesus, i wonder why your reply is so Jesus-centric, what do you have against the man really?

Because that is the analogy you are trying to draw!! You are trying to argue that your "believing before seeing" in business is just like your "believing before seeing [evidence]" in Jesus, but they are nothing alike. Are you giving your business proposition to people via the avenue of a mere written document? Are you requiring that they accept it, or reject it, through telepathy? Are you claiming that your business model is the ONLY WAY that works? Are you threatening torture if they reject it? No?

This is why you are have a false analogy and should just drop it now, b/c it fails miserably to accurately reflect how your religion (which was once my religion for nearly 20 years) operates. It is nothing like a demonstrable business. It makes extraordinary supernatural claims (nothing like a business) and requires dedication for life (not like business).

The Bibles words i treat as a system for my life to follow, i believe it so i do it and it works.
Some would go all too philosophical and ask if "would you kill your son if god asks you to?"
Im saying that kind of remark shows they just dont get it. Its simply an extreme example of obedience.

Let me ask you something. If I joined your business but only followed part (less than half) of the things I was supposed to be doing in the business, would I still be considered as a "true believer" in the business? What if I just ignored things in the business that were inconvenient to me, things that seemed irrational or too difficult (like cold calling, cold selling, or email spamming, etc)? Would I still be all good in the business?

This is what you are doing with Christianity. Do you practice slavery? Do you stone your unruly children? Do you stone homosexuals? Have you sold all of your possessions to follow Jesus? Do you love your enemies and do good to those who persecute you? The bible is not your guide. Only part of the bible you choose to follow (the bits you find convenient and that make you feel comfortable), but that is cherry-picking, not truly following. If you did that in business, your business would fail. But the most interesting part about it is that you have no Jesus, around here, telling you what to do. You just have an ancient book that a bunch of other people in your family/society believe, and that you assumed was true without checking it out first. Again, that is nothing like good business.

Is it a good thing to be gullible and practice credulity?
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