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Alzael



    Posts: 3577
  • Darwins +112/-23

Here's another one for you. Complete and total atheist with his tail between his legs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&v=w-v1Fppjlvc&NR=1

From the video.

"And I checked into Whatley hospital in Texarkana, Texax in February of 1975.  I checked in with electrolytes, which means that the chemicals in my body were so far out of balance that they had to give me IVs to build me up.  "

This is pure gibberish. One does not "check in" with electrolytes. Electrolytes are a natural part of the body process. The closest condition that he could mean is a water-electrolyte imbalance. However the symptons that he describes do not match up with such a thing. And it certainly is not a condition that requires surgery. Either he's lying about what was wrong with him initially, or he's a terrible doctor.

"At that time of my life, I was atheist.  I was hard core atheist and was living for myself.   Atheists are self centered, they live for themselves. "

This statement is not only wrong, it's stupidly wrong. This does however sound exactly like what Christians try to claim about atheists.


[color=blue"]I knew I had a condition which is that was called Acute hemorrhagic narcotic pancreatitis.  You don’t live with this disease.  You could live with pancreatitis.  You could even live with Acute pancreatitis, but you do not live with Acute hemorrhagic narcotic pancreatitis.  Dunkon had told my two sons that I would be dead before morning."


Not true. While it certainly is a serious condition, the mortality rate (even in the seventies) was not extremely high and mostly due to complications with the surgical treatments than the disease itself (as per Wikipedia). Also interesting to note this from the medical section of the Free Dictionary "a condition due to autolysis of pancreatic tissue caused by escape of enzymes into the substance, resulting in hemorrhage into the parenchyma and surrounding tissues. Seen most commonly in dogs, rarely in horses and pigs."

While we're on the subject, this supposedy hit him and was threatening to kill him within the space of about four or five days, which is much faster than this normally works. Also while he doesn't (conveniently) describe the symptoms that he had what he does say about what happened to him does not really seem to measure up.

"I was laying there, a professed atheist.  I didn’t believe in God.  I believed in the power of the universe because I’ve seen it.  As a physician, I’ve dealt with life and death.  I believed in something, but don’t talk me about God. And surely don’t talk to me about resurrection, virgin birth or these type of things because I am in research and science.  The Majority of PHDs in research and science don’t believe in God.  They do not believe a supreme being.  They are beginning to believe there is an order in the universe because the further along we go, we see the order. "

These are not really the typical words of an atheist.

"But it is very difficult to be an atheist when you are lying on the death bed, because you began thinking "what if these people are right?" "

This is a common "foxholes" argument used by Christians. Matched alongside Pascal's Wager. Again this does sound like the thought process of an atheist. What it sounds more like is that he did have a belief in some kind of god, just not a defined religious god.

"When I was lying on my death bed and knowing that I was going to die, guess who I thought about?  I thought, "what if Ron is right? What if there is a Heaven and a Hell."  Almost immediately the most pressing thought in my mind is how do I get saved.  What is saved? How do I get saved? "


Again, Pascal's Wager. He came to Christianity out of fear. Not out of any genuine belief.

"There are people that talk about a light, or floating above, a feeling of warmth or love.  I didn’t feel any of that.  I felt none of that.  I felt untold terror, untold terror.  I knew that if I went all the way, if I slipped all the way, I would never get back.  In my being of beings I knew that.  So I fought all night long.

They told me later on that I not only pull the mattress cover off the mattress, I put the mattress upon me.  I had to stay, I had to wait till Ron got there.  Whatever he had to do, I had to wait.

But again when I would leave my body, I would be going down into deep dark terror.  My skin began to get cold.  Not the kind of cold you feel when you walk out in the air, no, this was bone chilling cold.  And I could feel the coldness began to come up my legs.

Again I would begin to leave my body and would be in the darkness, in that void.  I remember one time entering back my body, I felt my body thud, my physical body thud.  Believe me, believe me, that was the most horrifying terrifying experience that I had ever encountered.  "


This indicates nothing but the possibility of a bad dream, or a hallucination brought on by his condition. This is especially true in comparison to how sketchy the rest of what he's said has been.

"I fought all night long.  The next morning around 9:30 or 10 o’clock, Ron came in.  He said, “Dr.  Whitaker, what do they say are your chances?”  I said, “Ron, they tell me I have none.” He said, “Now is the time.” I said, “You're right.”

Before, I had cursed him, I had spit on him, but now it was the time because I had to have whatever he had.  I had a short period of time left on earth and I didn’t have any idea when I might make that trip and go all the way.  "


Note the bold. This is interesting because previously he says this about Ron.

"I would debate him and I liked him, because he did what he said he was going to do.  He was the only one that I saw that profess to be Christian and lived what he said he was going to do.  I really respected him.  I didn’t believe what he said but I respected him.  "

This presents two very contradictory views as nowhere in his narrative is it ever indicated that he had ever been unkind to Ron in anyway. However now he had suddenly been cursing and spitting on him. Thinking back this narrative seems like it was actually done by two different people and pieced together. It's very inconsistent.

It's basically the testimony of a man who saw something while he was ill and feverish (that is very poorly described) who already had some semblance of a god belief, that became a believer after he miraculously survived from a condition that a lot of other people survive from that hit him much faster than it normally would and behaved differently from the condition he claimed to have. Then while he was sick and feverish a man came to him and told him to pray and accept god, despite the fact that his mind is confused and highly vulnerable....... do I need to go on?
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Bad Pear Nailed it. Great job. April 04, 2012, 11:44:13 AM
Zankuu For doing the dirty work for us. Nice dissection/refutation. April 04, 2012, 11:31:52 AM