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Every choice is going to depend on the factors that work their way into that (emotions, desires, principles, morals, etc.).

A choice can only depend on factors that are a part of the person making the choice.

But Gill - I'd like to hear your answer to Az's question.

That perception makes sense if your considering a person from the outside, observing them.   But from the 'inside looking out', so to speak, you have the awareness of choice, and the ability to reason and imagine the outcomes.  Then you'd be making a choice not based on something real always,  although maybe a very good prediction, but still an imagined possibility.

Unless you want to claim that imagination and reason is caused by determined physical forces. If so, well then, the idea that 'God is imaginary' would be also be, therefore people who believe such would be no more incorrect to believe such than people who don't, since both ideas were determined.  That doesn't make any sense. 

The very fact that people can perceive a reasoning to be flawed is evidence that they are not bound completely by determinism.    For what would be the logic of a universe which determines the evolution of conscious being that comes to be aware that determinism itself could be flawed?  It would seem then that the deterministic universe would undermine itself.

Okay then Gill.

Imagine that on two seperate occasions you find yourself in exactly the same circumstances, facing exactly the same decision.  Do you make the same choice each time, or a different one?

If the decision can be different in exactly the same circumstances.....how is that not random?

If the decision will be the same every time.....how is that not deterministic?

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Azdgari Well put. December 19, 2011, 11:21:51 AM