Poll

What is your religious position?

gnostic atheist - I know for certain that there are no gods.
159 (16.5%)
gnostic monotheist - I know for certain that only one specific god exists.
94 (9.7%)
gnostic polytheist - I know for certain that there is more than one god.
4 (0.4%)
gnostic pantheist - I know for certain that that everything is god.
12 (1.2%)
gnostic deist - I know for certain that there is a god that started the universe but does not actively meddle with it or us.
6 (0.6%)
agnostic atheist - I do not know for certain, but I think there are no gods.
279 (28.9%)
agnostic monotheist - I do not know for certain, but I think only one specific god exists.
21 (2.2%)
agnostic polytheist - I do not know for certain, but I think there is more than one god.
4 (0.4%)
agnostic pantheist - I do not know for certain, but I think that everything is god.
24 (2.5%)
agnostic deist - I do not know for certain, but I think there is a god that started the universe but does not actively meddle with it or us.
36 (3.7%)
ignostic atheist - While the concepts of god(s) are meaningless, it is likely that there are no gods.
87 (9%)
ignostic monotheist - While the concepts of god(s) are meaningless, it is likely that only one specific god exists.
2 (0.2%)
ignostic polytheist - While the concepts of god(s) are meaningless, it is likely that there is more than one god.
1 (0.1%)
ignostic pantheist - While the concepts of god(s) are meaningless, it is likely that that everything is god.
10 (1%)
ignostic deist - While the concepts of god(s) are meaningless, it is likely that there is a god that started the universe but does not actively meddle with it or us.
7 (0.7%)
apnostic atheist - I don't care if there are any gods, but I guess there are no gods.
37 (3.8%)
apnostic monotheist - I don't care if there are any gods, but I guess only one specific god exists.
1 (0.1%)
apnostic polytheist - I don't care if there are any gods, but I guess there is more than one god.
0 (0%)
apnostic pantheist - I don't care if there are any gods, but I guess that everything is god.
7 (0.7%)
apnostic deist - I don't care if there are any gods, but I guess there is a god that started the universe but does not actively meddle with it or us.
7 (0.7%)
Any type of henotheist - There (may be/is only) more than one god, but I think of only one specific god.
6 (0.6%)
I am a god!  [checks self in mirror and grins]
82 (8.5%)
Missionary.
30 (3.1%)
So! Many! Choices! (Karma Sutra)
50 (5.2%)

Total Members Voted: 628

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Offline Hermes

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What is your religious position?
« on: August 15, 2008, 05:27:17 PM »
This is the third time this poll has been run.  For reference, here are the other ones;

Old WWGHA forum (older version of this poll; comments retained)
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forum/index.php?topic=10315.0

AtheistThinkTank (similar version to the one posted here)  99 votes!
http://www.atheistthinktank.net/thinktank/index.php?topic=1618.0

This poll covers the number of deities (if any) you personally think exist and how strongly you consider that number is valid.  It does not cover how you act, believe, or think toward yourself, others, or the world in general.

Examples;

1. Gnostics and agnostics

For the purpose of this poll, gnostics claim knowledge and agnostics say knowledge is not possible.  Note that this form of gnosticism is different from the gnostic mystery religions!

Someone who knows for a fact that a god came here in a UFO and is the only god, and someone who knows for a fact that the God of Abraham is the one true and only god would both answer Gnostic Monotheist.  Next year, if both became uncertain -- did not know for a fact -- they would both become Agnostic Monotheists.  In each case, they would not likely share much else.

2. Agnostic theists

Someone who does not claim knowledge in a deity is possible would be an agnostic.  The same person may also be an atheist, or any of the theists (monotheists or deists or ...).  Religious beliefs are not the same as claims to definitive knowledge of the correctness of those beliefs.


Henotheism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henotheistic

Kama Sutra
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2995/Kama-Sutra-photo-book



Edit: Poll edited to use proper capitalization; "Gnostic Monotheist" ==> "gnostic monotheist".
Edit: Removed "(Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)" from tail end of title.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2010, 11:24:42 PM by Hermes »
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #1 on: August 15, 2008, 05:29:01 PM »
Not ideal ... but it's up here again!

Let the voting begin!
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #2 on: August 15, 2008, 05:32:23 PM »
Question: Are Abrahamic religions Hentotheist religions (not monotheist)?

Reason why they are; The OT talks about other gods and does not disallow them from being possible ... just not to be worshipped.  As such, the followers of the Abrahamic religions should acknowledge that other gods exist (if theirs does) and then state that they worship one even though that is the case.  (One or a pantheon of co-mingled gods depending on sect.)
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #3 on: August 15, 2008, 09:43:23 PM »
FWIW: I'm JustMe from the old board and from ATT.  I dragged my feet getting an account on the new system, and someone else picked JustMe here.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Vynn

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #4 on: August 15, 2008, 10:08:34 PM »
FWIW: I'm JustMe from the old board and from ATT.  I dragged my feet getting an account on the new system, and someone else picked JustMe here.

Hermes is more unique. More unique is better.  8)

Offline xphobe

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #5 on: August 15, 2008, 10:10:03 PM »
I hate to pick nits, but as I have said in other threads, I'm a bit anal about one point: agnosticism is not "I do not know", but rather "It is impossible to know".  I am an agnostic atheist: It is impossible to know for certain whether a god exists, but I don't believe there is one.
I stopped believing for a little while this morning. Journey is gonna be so pissed when they find out...

Offline Vynn

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #6 on: August 15, 2008, 10:11:21 PM »
I hate to pick nits, but as I have said in other threads, I'm a bit anal about one point: agnosticism is not "I do not know", but rather "It is impossible to know".  I am an agnostic atheist: It is impossible to know for certain whether a god exists, but I don't believe there is one.


Fucking ditto!!


Which makes it impossible to be a gnostic atheist!!!!!!!!!

Offline xphobe

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2008, 10:21:30 PM »
heh... it appears one person so far would argue that point : )
I stopped believing for a little while this morning. Journey is gonna be so pissed when they find out...

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2008, 10:24:14 PM »
I hate to pick nits, but as I have said in other threads, I'm a bit anal about one point: agnosticism is not "I do not know", but rather "It is impossible to know".  I am an agnostic atheist: It is impossible to know for certain whether a god exists, but I don't believe there is one.

Agreed.  I knew it when I wrote it.  Huxley's definition is correct (he coined the word).

So, knowing what I know, why did I use the wrong definition?

I'm trying to keep the number of options down.  The list is over 20 items long now, plus a few throw-aways.  There are (???) agnostics that are less absolute on the possibility of knowing.   If I were to use the word "impossible", I'd be cutting out those that are less interested in if it is possible or not.

Adding in another flavor would expand the list by 5 options...something I almost did this time to accommodate all versions of Henotheism (though I gave them the shaft and only have one option for Hentotheists).
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2008, 10:26:15 PM »
Note: If anyone can tell me how to edit these polls, I'd be glad to accommodate the Huxley-defined agnostics and add 5 more options.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #10 on: August 15, 2008, 10:27:41 PM »
(The definition for Deists isn't exactly right either.  I chose the definition for that for similar reasons.)
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline xphobe

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #11 on: August 16, 2008, 12:07:24 AM »
Note: If anyone can tell me how to edit these polls, I'd be glad to accommodate the Huxley-defined agnostics and add 5 more options.

Actually we had the ability to edit polls until yesterday, but thanks to the deceitful tactics of Muslim pig-jizz Shakaib, that option has been taken away from us.

Thanks Shakaib, for f*cking it up for us honest atheists.  Way to be a witness for Allah.
I stopped believing for a little while this morning. Journey is gonna be so pissed when they find out...

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #12 on: August 16, 2008, 05:05:44 AM »
Shakaib?  A new one or one of the old guard with a new name?
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #13 on: August 16, 2008, 05:17:05 AM »
FWIW: I'm JustMe from the old board and from ATT.  I dragged my feet getting an account on the new system, and someone else picked JustMe here.

Hermes is more unique. More unique is better.  8)

The mythology on Hermes is interesting.  I have a series of books from Joseph Campbell and there are a few mentions of him.   From Homer;

Quote
"For then she bare a son, of many shifts, blandly cunning, a robber, a cattle driver, a bringer of dreams,  [15] a watcher by night, a thief at the gates, one who was soon to show forth wonderful deeds among the deathless gods. Born with the dawning, at mid-day he played on the lyre, and in the evening he stole the cattle of far-shooting Apollo on the fourth day of the month; for on that day queenly Maia bare him."

To Hermes
http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/ptext?doc=Perseus%3Atext%3A1999.01.0138%3Ahymn%3D4

The part that follows about getting a tortoise to sing is bizarre.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline xphobe

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #14 on: August 16, 2008, 08:43:20 AM »
Shakaib?  A new one or one of the old guard with a new name?

New one.  Unfortunately he makes Afadly look like a Rhodes Scholar...  ???
I stopped believing for a little while this morning. Journey is gonna be so pissed when they find out...

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #15 on: August 16, 2008, 09:53:46 AM »
Shakaib?  A new one or one of the old guard with a new name?

New one.  Unfortunately he makes Afadly look like a Rhodes Scholar...  ???

That's a shame.  Afadly has some intelligence, and it's applied to shoring up his dogma.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline ChrisPeaTu

Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2008, 06:45:23 AM »
I am gnostic towards most but agnostic towards at least one.
One can hold different views with regard to different definitions of god.
What is life?
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It is the little shadow which runs across the grass and loses itself in the sunset.
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Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2008, 07:44:04 AM »
I am gnostic towards most but agnostic towards at least one.
One can hold different views with regard to different definitions of god.

Agreed.   I chose my answers based on an absolute sense; agnostic atheist and ignostic atheist.  I'm willing to have some of the more absurd deities explained to me in such a way that they aren't bat _hit crazy.

Yet, if one definition of a deity is shown to make sense on some level that does not all the sudden drag on the BS versions of the same deity for free. 

For example;

Theist: "Do you believe in love?"

Me: "Believe?  No.  Love is real.  It can be detected in an MRI."

Theist: "God is love!  When you feel love, that's God!"

Me: "And nothing else?"

Theist: "Nope.  Just love.  Nothing else."

Me: "Good, then by definition I think that that specific god exists."

Theist: "Fantastic!  You're now a Born Again Christian!  Here's a Bible!  Praise Jesus!  A miracle will occur in your life and you won't go to Hell!"

Me: "Er ... no.  You've just swapped words around and made them meaningless."

Theist: "You do believe in love, don't you?"

Me: [facepalm]
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #18 on: August 27, 2008, 06:45:38 AM »
*BUMP*
« Last Edit: September 24, 2008, 01:04:40 PM by Hermes »
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Hermes

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« Last Edit: September 24, 2008, 01:13:32 PM by Hermes »
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline ;)

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2008, 01:14:43 PM »
Quote
I am an agnostic atheist: It is impossible to know for certain whether a god exists, but I don't believe there is one.

Definitely gotta go with that one!
Although i couldn't resist throwing a missionary in there ::)

And that Karma Sutra book is ... interesting to say the least ;)
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Offline Goodkat

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2008, 01:17:05 PM »

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #22 on: October 02, 2008, 05:20:20 PM »
*bump!*
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Sota

Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #23 on: October 02, 2008, 06:05:29 PM »
I figured this would be a popular thread...  But I'm agnostic atheist I guess.  It makes the most sense, and leaves a little room if someone happens to prove anything.

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #24 on: October 02, 2008, 06:25:44 PM »
I figured this would be a popular thread... 

I've run this poll a few times.  The previous ones were more popular.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline Sota

Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #25 on: October 02, 2008, 06:27:13 PM »
I figured this would be a popular thread... 

I've run this poll a few times.  The previous ones were more popular.

I see.  Still, it's a bit surprising that one of the biggest questions you could ask on this site has only been answered by a few...

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #26 on: October 02, 2008, 07:22:28 PM »
Unfortunately, the forums here were reset a while ago...and the votes in that poll were wiped.  From memory, I think it was up to about 120~140.  Not valid as research, but for these forums not bad either.

For reference, here are the other ones;

Old WWGHA forum (older version of this poll; comments retained)
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forum/index.php?topic=10315.0

AtheistThinkTank (similar version to the one posted here)  91 votes!
http://www.atheistthinktank.net/thinktank/index.php?topic=1618.0
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer

Offline spider

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #27 on: October 02, 2008, 07:46:00 PM »
Soooo.... who voted for gnostic atheism?   Are they rounding up on the Dawkins scale?   Or do they seriously know there is no god and by what means?

I'd like to know, because I do get into gnostic atheist moods and if there's a justification for that, I should cultivate it.

I selected agnostic atheist.  I'm so boring. 

Offline Hermes

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Re: What is your religious position? (Now with *Henotheism!* ... hmmm.)
« Reply #28 on: October 02, 2008, 08:09:07 PM »
I understand the gnostic atheist vote(s).  Why mince words?

That said, I'm a gnostic atheist IRT specific deity claims; ex: omnimax deities.  Otherwise, I'm an agnostic atheist; 'show me or blow if you don't have facts'.
Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons. --Michael Shermer

The history of religion is a long attempt to reconcile old custom with new reason, to find a sound theory for an absurd practice.  --Sir James George Frazer