(Yaay! I didn't even mention Jesus in my explanation! [I'm responding as I read])
Ha, your explanation of the Trinity (or 2/3s of it) made me smile. You're not going to like this answer, but, as much as I love logic, there comes a point when you have to accept that you need faith. That said, I will try to explain as much as possible. First, you're taking this out of context. You can't just pull one thing out (try avoiding fallacies such as this please). It might be easier for me just to start at the beginning and explain everything versus this skip-over-half-of-the-Book thing. God made people w/ the ability to choose. He wanted to have people He could love and that would love Him. I don't know about you, but I would want someone choose to love me, and not have him love me only because I'm making him. Same deal w/ God. So, people unfortunately didn't choose God. They chose what God had defined as "sin". There was the same deal w/ the angels and some of them *cough satin cough* also chose sin. So, since satin "tricked" them into sin, he got them. Punishment for sin was death and hell. Couple thousand years later, God sent Jesus (half God, half man) to not sin, yet still die and go to hell to take the place of sinners. Now we don't have to go to hell.
So, that's why He did it. I get what you're trying to say about like, but why would He die because of His own rules, right? I have a question. lol. Have you ever read/watched Chronicles of Narnia, because they explain lots of this quite well...
In the end, God is so infinitely more than I am, so I can't know exactly what went through His brain... and neither can YOU.
If you have any questions/critiques/etc, feel free; I tried my best to stay on topic (I think I did, right?)
"if you are a Christian attempting to rationalize this, stay ON TOPIC, keep at least some sort of constant stream of thought and do not pull things out of where." In return, please avoid using logical fallacies (contextomy). Thanks!
If god makes a creation with the ability to love, it's the same fucking thing in the end as making a creation that automatically loves him. If god were actually real, who would turn against him and why? Very very FEW people. But guess what, in the bible they do it because....it's in the bible and the bible does not contain a whole lot of logical consistancy. In the modern world, ie. today, the god of the bible behaves exactly as if, golly gee, he DOESN'T EXIST. Why the change of heart if people are just getting worse? Lame, very lame. Plus, what else is god up to if we are a lost cause? The Satin thing makes even less sense. Why does god allow Satin to continue ot exist or exist in the first place....or hell to exist. Never mind. Ignore this. It's not my point at all.
The first half of that rant is not important. Not to mention it was still a very lame excuse for the incest, murder, genocide, rape, etc. in the OT. But ok ok, let's just say my mind has been molded to think that is ok and I accept the OT a totally moral and sensible....
So....I need faith eh? Oh I'd love to have faith and boy would I take that leap if not for the observation that....there's nothing to have faith in.
And the next most popular word in the Christian vocabulary: context. Look buddy, I know what the trinity is and I'm not taking what is implied by the Jesus story out of context. Please show me how it's out of context....
Again here we go with the 'everybody has the ability to choose' thing. Great great. So god makes everybody with the ability to choose and love him or not. First, why does god need to experience or be the recipient of the utterly human experience of love? Second, why does god not just make a being that would not be spoiled by being pre-programmed to be his friend and pal? Third, why does god bother with free will supposedly, if we still have to obey him to get the good side of things? Forth, why does god seem to have all these HUMAN weaknesses and emotions (numero uno: love)?
You don't know about me....but you can speak for how you would feel if you were god....but then neither you nor I know what's going on in gods "brain"? (eggs, sunnyside up?) How hypocritical of you. How hypocritical of all you Christians to say you can't even begin to understand your mysterious god yet still have the balls to offer up even the slightest explanation of what he wants....
NOW TO THE REAL POINT:
All you did was smirk and then go off to dribble some of your stories on me. I know them. I know what they're all about. I don't need you to explain them to me again.
How about I make my point in a different manner:
I buy you some nachos with cheese (I HATE nachos) and give them to you because I'm just that nice. I then turn my back and continue watching Ghostbusters. I give you no instructions on eating the nachos, I just let you be....but don't spill any cheese on my damn carpet. I also give you switch-blade. So, after the first bite, you spill cheese on my carpet. I let it fly. After the second bite, you turn around with the switch-blade and stab me in the spine. Damn I'm real pissed now. But I'm such a nice guy, and I always want you to have nachos to eat even though I know you'll spill cheese on my fucking carpet and plunge metal into my back. So now I want to forgive you for all you have done, so that you will have nachos forever more. I go out on the town and pick up this 18 year old chick on her way home from the movies with her friends. I'm so fucking hot she's glued to me right away. I knock this chick up. 9 months later, out pops what is now my son. I push this chick aside, fuck her and her feelings, she's just a woman. I give you my son. You take him in one hand, switch-blade in the other. I can totally see all this infront of me. You stab my son to death infront of me with the knife I gave you. You are now forgiven. I love you man. It was a long journey, but now I can finally forgive you for spilling chease on my carpet and stabbing me in the spine. Because you killed my only son.
For real, when you forgive someone, can't you just like you know, forgive them? Why do you have to have your son murdered by the people you want to forgive?
My analogy there was only part helpful to my point. It fails to highlight the even greater absurdity the senario brings on when GOD is me in the story and all his abilities are taken into account.
THE REAL POINT PART TWO:
Jesus undeniabley has something to do with god right? Something higher than the rest of us. Jesus has the most faith in his own religion because balls to bones, if anyone knows it's true, Jesus the Christ(ian) bloody well does. In fact he doesn't have 'faith' when he exists, he KNOWS without a doubt. And so does god.
So the messiah, prophesized and SENT ("sent" conveys a degree of PLANNING) to die to save us all is sacrificing what again? What's Jesus sacrificing? He knows he's going to die. He knows he's the son of god. He knows he's going to heaven....even if he has to "spend a couple days in hell"....which is a walk in the park if you're fucking Jesus and you know all will be well. Oh and by the way, "hell" varies in explantion from simple 'total absence of god' to literal 'pit/lake of fire'.... Well, Jesus IS lord so the mild definition can't apply. Jesus can heal and do all sorts of other miraculous stuff so a literal pit of fire is no biggy. Doesn't matter anyway, still not the point.
We are flawed and need to be forgiven. So Jesus comes down, does some wierd shit, says a couple nice things and then we kill him. Actually he doesn't "come down".... He spills out of a vagina like you know, every other human born before that. Now all the sudden god doesn't have to punish us.....because we killed him in human form. Ok, that plan doesn't make any sense. But why does the fact that god did that in the first place make any sense? If he wanted to forgive us, why not just do it? How does us killing his son display love any better? Why does love have to be a factor anyway? Expressing love is just as HUMAN and desiring it. Not that this matters because....
God has done nothing but draw a giant pointless circle with the Jesus story. He prophesizes a messiah, sends that messiah and 'feels good' about what that messiah "did". The point of it all is so we, also gods creation and plan, now don't have to suffer AT GODS hand because we fucked up and broke his rules.
Than factor in the time periods, the events that are said to take place, the fact that if god "doesn't keep his word", who's he being true to?, the idea that everyone has free will yet god has a plan and part of that plan included a human killing Jesus, the fac that god does not interact with humans in any way such as displayed in the bible now, the fact it's supposedly been 2000 years since the Jesus complex unfolded and it's still supposed to mean anything today, etc. etc. etc. etc.
Explanations? (on the topic of the Jesus complex) I know I went a bit off a first there but that was a response to something already off topic. Please stay on the Jesus complex topic.