Author Topic: Forum age limits and discussion policy  (Read 775 times)

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Offline Ambassador Pony

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Forum age limits and discussion policy
« on: January 02, 2009, 08:16:49 AM »
[modbreak]This thread was split off from hey there [#877].[/modbreak]

The reason for all the "is not!" "Is too" is because this newest theist member is a young boy. Children cannot be expected to understand these things, they don't have the knowledge. They also cannot be expected to have the capacity to process new information, they don't have the perspective. This child has most likely been conditioned for severel years by a religious institution, and a few days of written exchange are a drop in the bucket compared.

The age limit for the forum needs to be bumped up.

« Last Edit: January 02, 2009, 09:06:58 AM by Moderator_013 »
You believe evolution and there is no evidence for that. Where is the fossil record of a half man half ape. I've only ever heard about it in reading.

Offline gold_digging_ants

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2009, 08:25:25 AM »
Not all kids are as bad as this.  Eaterjolly is- if you'll pardon the expression- a saint compared to ichabencow.
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Offline Ambassador Pony

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2009, 08:34:06 AM »
Not all kids are as bad as this.  Eaterjolly is- if you'll pardon the expression- a saint compared to ichabencow.

What? You mean he is more coherent, right?

Of course people vary, but theist children indoctrinated by fanatics are almost always like this one. He hasn't the benefit of perspective or knowledge of the world he lives in. Only programming, and like microsoft, his programmers set it up so his programming is hostile to new foreign software.

The solution is to raise the age limit. Children with more of a capacity for rational discourse can find a kidz forum.

You believe evolution and there is no evidence for that. Where is the fossil record of a half man half ape. I've only ever heard about it in reading.

Offline Dissenter

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2009, 08:49:16 AM »
I just completed the feedback survey for the boards and I think my only criticism noted of WWGHA on the form is applicable here. 

From what I understand ichabencow is 14, and I personally know 10 year olds who could run intellectual circles around him. For this reason I don't think an age restriction would necessarily be the most approriate form of action against these sorts of posters.  My criticism in the feedeback form cited my frustration with the argumentum-ad-infintum angle that some of our theist friends seem to relish when backed into a corner (and sometimes without a corner even being in the vicinity).  Personally I would much prefer to see people, regardless of their age, being held more accountable for the claims to knowledge they make when posting here.  If they wish to make these claims then they should either substantiate them with appropriate evidence or be forced to retract their statement.  Short of them complying with this a brief holiday might be in order.  Perhaps someone such as ichabencow receving a couple of warnings and a holiday may at the very least make him question the way he needs to present an argument in order that others actually reflect upon it instead of dismissing it in the way his current batch of garbage has been.

Pardon me if I've overstepped my bounds here and I know this may sound a tad harsh, but these ridiculous arguments get nowhere and their prevelance seems to increase almost exponentially over time. Above all, they frustrate the utter piss out of me.

I think ichabencow illustrates the point beautifully.
What is above all needed is to let the meaning choose the word, and not the other way around.

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Offline Operator_013

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2009, 09:09:39 AM »
I've split this topic off from the original thread and moved it to the Suggestions & Feedback board.
« Last Edit: January 02, 2009, 09:12:16 AM by Moderator_013 »
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Offline Agamemnon

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2009, 09:10:06 AM »
...Personally I would much prefer to see people, regardless of their age, being held more accountable for the claims to knowledge they make when posting here.

I agree with this, somewhat.  Age does not equal maturity or IQ.  I have seen some forums where all posts from new members had to be submitted to moderators until such time as they were deemed to understand the forum rules.  This might be onerous for this particular forum, but I think some sort of training wheels are in order.  I know the forum has grown quickly, so that puts pressure on moderators if there are a lot of new members to monitor.  I think the moderators would need to come up with a new plan to handle this that suits them best.  If that happens to be an age limit then we shouldn't look a gift horse in the mouth.
So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.  --Bertrand Russell

Offline gold_digging_ants

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2009, 09:33:33 AM »
I'm against the idea of raising the age limit, for the reason already stated- there are 10 year olds that are far more rational than ichabencow.  I'd rather give more young people who are questioning their faith (in particular) an outlet- this has been extremely important for me (I'm not in my teens, but I imagine it could be more important for someone in their teens)

I think some sort of guidance for our younger members might be in order.  Whether moderators watching them more closely, some input from regular members, or perhaps some sort of form letter (similar to the "for Christians" section in the rules) explaining about argument, proper evidence, and conducting yourself properly on the forum (and perhaps also how to quote).  (That's not going to be great for people whose first language isn't English, but as we conduct ourselves in English, I can't see that that should be avoided)

The problem then is (I can't remember- I never pay much attention when I register for things)- do members have to disclose how old they are when they register (apart from being over 13)?
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Offline Agamemnon

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2009, 09:46:30 AM »
I'm against the idea of raising the age limit, for the reason already stated- there are 10 year olds that are far more rational than ichabencow.  I'd rather give more young people who are questioning their faith (in particular) an outlet- this has been extremely important for me (I'm not in my teens, but I imagine it could be more important for someone in their teens)

My first serious atheistic thoughts came to me in junior high school when one of my teachers assigned a project to read a passage from the bible and write an essay about it.  I refused, stating that I was an atheist.  So the idea of letting young people participate is probably more of a benefit than a liability.
So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.  --Bertrand Russell

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2009, 09:51:54 AM »
My first serious atheistic thoughts came to me in junior high school when one of my teachers assigned a project to read a passage from the bible and write an essay about it.  I refused, stating that I was an atheist.  So the idea of letting young people participate is probably more of a benefit than a liability.

I'd agree with that - lets face it, the theistic line tends to get pushed in school, I think that (no matter how annoying it may sometimes be) we should allow the youngsters to take part here.  If we can break the brainwashing early, or even just make them think about it a little, that would be a good thing.
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Offline Ambassador Pony

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2009, 10:40:20 AM »
Yes, yes, yes. We all know kids who are mature, intelligent...etc. And, yes they should take part but with an age appropriate group. The point of a Kidz forum is for kids of the same age group can discuss the same subject matter with one another. Let 14 year old secular prodigy, Jimmy, debate Ichabencow in that forum. I guarantee the mature intelligent kids have a greater chance of helping the deluded ones there.

They can always see one of us for mentoring, if they'd like. They can have access to PM functions, and also have their own "crib" for planning initiatives and such.

Give them a chance to work things out between themselves and have the adults to be accessible with advice and mentoring when requested.   


« Last Edit: January 02, 2009, 10:42:04 AM by Ambassador Pony »
You believe evolution and there is no evidence for that. Where is the fossil record of a half man half ape. I've only ever heard about it in reading.

Offline Agamemnon

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #10 on: January 02, 2009, 10:50:35 AM »
Yes, yes, yes. We all know kids who are mature, intelligent...etc. And, yes they should take part but with an age appropriate group...

Sounds like a decent solution to me.

I'm not sure what legal issues the forum might be subjected to with regards to minors, too.  Having a youth forum might help in that capacity.
So far as I can remember, there is not one word in the Gospels in praise of intelligence.  --Bertrand Russell

Offline Dragnet

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #11 on: January 02, 2009, 11:02:14 AM »
Yes, yes, yes. We all know kids who are mature, intelligent...etc. And, yes they should take part but with an age appropriate group. The point of a Kidz forum is for kids of the same age group can discuss the same subject matter with one another. Let 14 year old secular prodigy, Jimmy, debate Ichabencow in that forum. I guarantee the mature intelligent kids have a greater chance of helping the deluded ones there.

They can always see one of us for mentoring, if they'd like. They can have access to PM functions, and also have their own "crib" for planning initiatives and such.

Give them a chance to work things out between themselves and have the adults to be accessible with advice and mentoring when requested.   

I like this idea.
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Offline SimpleCaveman

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2009, 11:29:27 AM »

They can always see one of us for mentoring, if they'd like. They can have access to PM functions, and also have their own "crib" for planning initiatives and such.

Give them a chance to work things out between themselves and have the adults to be accessible with advice and mentoring when requested.   


This solution sounds good to me. Though, since I’ve never been a moderator, I can’t necessarily see the downsides.

A backup solution might be to require posting of ages if under 18 (semi-arbitrarily). I think it’s appropriate for older folks to be thoughtful of how we treat the younger members (if it stays as one forum). They may be intelligent and mature for their age, but they’re still kids. Abuse and ridicule are rarely appropriate, but especially not for kids. They get enough of that from other sources. Letting them participate could be okay, if there was a greater threshold of maturity required of those who converse with them.

Also, a greater threshold for their behavior as well. It is easier, one would hope, for younger members to say things they shouldn’t. Maybe they get more carried away, or understand less what’s appropriate. Giving them a nudge of advice in the border cases where one might let it go for an adult would be helpful to them.

Just my two cents.

Offline Inactive_A

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Re: Forum age limits and discussion policy
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2009, 07:29:00 PM »
Rather than changing the forum every time someone who does not find it suitable to their level of intellect, it would be better to hold everyone accountable for their actions and posts.  If they lack the maturity to participate on a forum populated by adults, then perhaps there are other less demanding venues for them.