Author Topic: random thoughts...  (Read 92 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline jynnan tonnix

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 2264
  • Darwins +212/-1
  • Gender: Female
random thoughts...
« on: August 09, 2018, 06:17:15 PM »
I was just listening to one of Seth Andrews' podcasts, "get them while they're young", and had a few thoughts.

One was about being Catholic, since the show mostly focused on the sort of  evangelical sects I'm not all that familiar with...and it seems to me that on the one hand, the Catholic faith (which I was raised with) is pretty insular, and doesn't focus a lot on bringing people in. It's also relatively liberal in some ways, like accepting evolution, etc, so even those who see the Bible as largely metaphorical can still feel comfortable. So many of those who call themselves Catholic also don't worry about the church's stance on birth control. In short, it's an easy religion, in some ways, to feel a part of while still being pretty reasonable.

Maybe that's partially why so many Catholics sort of drift away from their faith vs the more fundamentalist types who often find it a huge and traumatic process. I barely remember having anything like real faith, and had pretty much jettisoned all of it by the time I was 16 or 17, tops, yet, if asked, still identified as Catholic into my 50's. It makes me wonder, though Catholicism is still the largest Christian sect, how many of those who identify themselves as such actually subscribe to anything but the tiniest scrapings of the faith.

But how does that compare to those whose faith demands so many more ludicrous beliefs? I get the sense that since they are brought up so much more shielded from any contamination by "the world", that it's much harder to break away, but on the other hand, their beliefs are SO opposed to the most basic of science and reality in so many ways, that it seems a break would be so much more inevitable for someone with any sort of education...

So which way, in the end, manages to retain more of its numbers? The ones which gives them a relative freedom in their faith, such that they may never actually realize their beliefs are actually at odds with the church, or the ones which do everything they can to hold them, but which tenets are so at odds with reality that anything like real education is bound to at least open up possibly irreparable rifts in their faith?

Offline Nick

  • Laureate
  • *********
  • Posts: 13324
  • Darwins +399/-9
  • Gender: Male
Re: random thoughts...
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2018, 06:24:37 PM »
Agree 100% with your take.  Seems like it has drifted a lot to the "right" over the last 20+ years but still not forcing belief on the flock.  Their main problem seems to be coming from within with all the sexual abuse coming to light.  Plus the # of priests and nuns is the lowest it has ever been at least in the states.  Many parishes have priest who's English is hard to understand.  Change has to come if the church wants to remain relevant in the world of today.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline jynnan tonnix

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 2264
  • Darwins +212/-1
  • Gender: Female
Re: random thoughts...
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2018, 07:11:46 PM »
Agree 100% with your take.  Seems like it has drifted a lot to the "right" over the last 20+ years but still not forcing belief on the flock.  Their main problem seems to be coming from within with all the sexual abuse coming to light.  Plus the # of priests and nuns is the lowest it has ever been at least in the states.  Many parishes have priest who's English is hard to understand.  Change has to come if the church wants to remain relevant in the world of today.
I'm just as happy with it ceasing to be relevant, except I fear that too many people hard-wired for faith and looking for something stricter will end up migrating into more fundamentalist sects over here where they will end up being more of a threat. I don't think the Catholic church is in that much danger of becoming obsolete in a lot of places, though...I have a lot of extended (quite extended) family in Poland, for example, where almost everyone is Catholic, and almost no one seems to think of questioning it.

Offline YouCantHandleTheTruth

  • Postgraduate
  • *****
  • Posts: 930
  • Darwins +122/-0
  • Gender: Male
  • WWGHA Member
Re: random thoughts...
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2018, 08:46:42 AM »
It seems like Judaism has the same issue doesn't it?  A lot of culturally Jewish people? 

Offline Fiji

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1933
  • Darwins +169/-2
  • Gender: Male
Re: random thoughts...
« Reply #4 on: Yesterday at 12:02:22 AM »
If you look up faith figures of my country, you'll get something like 75 to 80% catholic.
The real figure is closer to 13-15%.
People simply don't get de-baptized ... If you no longer believe then some old dude splashing water on your head a few decades ago holds any meaning, so why bother doing what essentially amounts to a magic spell to get rid of the water splashage?
I too have never been de-baptized.
If there's ever a real world reason to do so (like the faith tax Germany has) but until then, nah, not gonna bother.

As for why evangelical sects seem to retain better ... Might that be sunk cost fallacy?
At some level, evangelicals are aware of just how nutty their beliefs are. So rather than admit, even to themselves, that they've been taken for a loop, they keep believing?
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 12:04:08 AM by Fiji »
2 Interwebs 7:42
And in the seventh year, thou shalt cast out the Nam from thine assembly for he haveth a potty mouth.