Author Topic: does promiscuity cause suffering?  (Read 2506 times)

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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #87 on: April 16, 2017, 09:45:23 AM »
I'm sorry that is as far as my knowledge goes.  I do wish I knew more.  I can only learn so much at a time. 

What I'm trying to say is that the brain responds to sex by releasing hormones that cause affection, pleasure and reward.  When that's gone I think we want more and more and more and more and more and more and more, etc, etc.  I think we grieve for it, long for it and that may cause some suffering, as in The Gawd's situation.  Grief is suffering.  I bet he still remembers the way she smelled, the touch of her skin, every little detail about his lost love.  That's all he thinks about, right?  That's why he can't focus on the other stuff.

My sincere condolences Gawd.  I can only say it does get better with time.  You have to try and focus on just doing little things, make your bed, brush your teeth, wash your dishes, mow your grass, trim the trees.  It will get better.   ;)
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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #88 on: April 16, 2017, 10:35:59 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.
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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #89 on: April 16, 2017, 11:31:38 AM »
I'm sorry that is as far as my knowledge goes.  I do wish I knew more.  I can only learn so much at a time. 

What I'm trying to say is that the brain responds to sex by releasing hormones that cause affection, pleasure and reward.  When that's gone I think we want more and more and more and more and more and more and more, etc, etc.  I think we grieve for it, long for it and that may cause some suffering, as in The Gawd's situation.  Grief is suffering.  I bet he still remembers the way she smelled, the touch of her skin, every little detail about his lost love.  That's all he thinks about, right?  That's why he can't focus on the other stuff.

Even with just what you know, could you say it's not the promiscuity that is the core of this suffering, it's the lack of chemical "high"?

Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #90 on: April 16, 2017, 11:36:57 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.

Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #91 on: April 17, 2017, 07:32:43 AM »
I'm out of time this morning but I have read the posts and will reply later on.  Work at 10am.
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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #92 on: April 18, 2017, 04:41:32 AM »
I'm sorry that is as far as my knowledge goes.  I do wish I knew more.  I can only learn so much at a time. 

What I'm trying to say is that the brain responds to sex by releasing hormones that cause affection, pleasure and reward.  When that's gone I think we want more and more and more and more and more and more and more, etc, etc.  I think we grieve for it, long for it and that may cause some suffering, as in The Gawd's situation.  Grief is suffering.  I bet he still remembers the way she smelled, the touch of her skin, every little detail about his lost love.  That's all he thinks about, right?  That's why he can't focus on the other stuff.

Even with just what you know, could you say it's not the promiscuity that is the core of this suffering, it's the lack of chemical "high"?

I think that's fair to say.  Isn't brain chemistry the core of everything we feel?
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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #93 on: April 18, 2017, 05:07:44 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.

Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

Are you admitting that you suffer?   Because that doesn't fly into the face of what I'm proposing.  It doesn't fly into face of the post you are referring to either.  You're longing for more and that's why you suffer.  That's what I just described to you, withdrawal.

Sex addiction is no different than drug addiction or gambling, you know.   I suggest asking a certified therapist this question.  It's not good to suffer.

You're being vague about just how promiscuous you are.  I'm reading it that way because I don't know what a venn diagram looks like.  I am left wondering if you are really promiscuous.  If you are toggling back and forth between a few women/men that are not suffering in your absence then I would not call that promiscuous I would call that polyamory.

Do you have concerns about the feelings of the people you're having sex with?  Do they suffer too, like you do? 
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Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #94 on: April 18, 2017, 08:45:17 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.

Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

Are you admitting that you suffer?   Because that doesn't fly into the face of what I'm proposing.  It doesn't fly into face of the post you are referring to either.  You're longing for more and that's why you suffer.  That's what I just described to you, withdrawal.

Sex addiction is no different than drug addiction or gambling, you know.   I suggest asking a certified therapist this question.  It's not good to suffer.

You're being vague about just how promiscuous you are.  I'm reading it that way because I don't know what a venn diagram looks like.  I am left wondering if you are really promiscuous.  If you are toggling back and forth between a few women/men that are not suffering in your absence then I would not call that promiscuous I would call that polyamory.

Do you have concerns about the feelings of the people you're having sex with?  Do they suffer too, like you do?
I am admitting that I suffer when I am NOT promiscuous. The very opposite of your proposal. When I am promiscuous I prosper. I didnt mention anything about being addicted to sex. The definition of promiscuous found at dictionary.com or merriam-webster.com works fine for my definition.

 



a diagram representing mathematical or logical sets pictorially as circles or closed curves within an enclosing rectangle (the universal set), common elements of the sets being represented by the areas of overlap among the circles.

My sex life and promiscuity would almost completely overlap being that I have only been in one committed relationship ever, and the rest of the time I have been multiple (excluding the occasional drought).

I am not sure what "feelings" have to do with the topic.

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #95 on: April 18, 2017, 09:08:41 AM »

I think that's fair to say.  Isn't brain chemistry the core of everything we feel?

I interpret this comment as conceding your point that promiscuity causes suffering, and recognize instead that suffering is a complex issue, experienced as the result of many other, many unrelated, variables. Is that accurate?

Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #96 on: April 20, 2017, 04:03:36 AM »
Gawd that's not the opposite of my proposal.  You can't have withdrawal if you don't drink the juice.  Heroin addicts suffer when they don't get their fix too.  Are you saying the heroin has nothing to do with it?

Albeto yes that's correct.  I still consider promiscuity one of those variables.  I consider child abuse, in it's many forms, the top variable. 
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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #97 on: April 20, 2017, 11:59:19 AM »
Albeto yes that's correct.  I still consider promiscuity one of those variables.  I consider child abuse, in it's many forms, the top variable.

So after four pages, you've quietly changed your mind. Care to share what did it for you?

Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #98 on: April 20, 2017, 03:44:41 PM »
Gawd that's not the opposite of my proposal.  You can't have withdrawal if you don't drink the juice.  Heroin addicts suffer when they don't get their fix too.  Are you saying the heroin has nothing to do with it?

I dont know what this means. Please explain.

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #99 on: April 20, 2017, 08:29:36 PM »
She's saying that if you never had sex, you wouldn't go through withdrawal.
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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #100 on: April 21, 2017, 06:17:15 AM »
Albeto yes that's correct.  I still consider promiscuity one of those variables.  I consider child abuse, in it's many forms, the top variable.

So after four pages, you've quietly changed your mind. Care to share what did it for you?

I mentioned child abuse in the OP albeto. &)
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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #101 on: April 21, 2017, 11:04:22 AM »

I mentioned child abuse in the OP albeto. &)

Perhaps you don't understand my question. In your OP, you suggested suffering was caused by promiscuity. Now you're denying that, saying instead that brain chemistry due to withdrawl is the cause of suffering. I'm asking what changed your mind. Was it an argument here? A train of thought you had while pondering the points made? Some new information you found elsewhere?

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #102 on: April 21, 2017, 11:11:07 AM »
She's saying that if you never had sex, you wouldn't go through withdrawal.

So... promiscuity doesn't cause suffering; not having sex does?

Unless you've never had sex?

So if you've had sex, then promiscuous behavior would be the best way to avoid suffering, lol!




Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #103 on: April 22, 2017, 04:58:20 AM »
She's saying that if you never had sex, you wouldn't go through withdrawal.

I still don't get the "withdrawal" portion of it. It has nothing to do with withdrawal, unless those teens who are virgins, but are just becoming sexual beings and such things occupy many of their thoughts are also going through "withdrawal"

Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #104 on: April 22, 2017, 05:32:56 AM »

I mentioned child abuse in the OP albeto. &)

Perhaps you don't understand my question. In your OP, you suggested suffering was caused by promiscuity. Now you're denying that, saying instead that brain chemistry due to withdrawl is the cause of suffering. I'm asking what changed your mind. Was it an argument here? A train of thought you had while pondering the points made? Some new information you found elsewhere?

Perhaps.  In the OP I said promiscuity is a side effect of child abuse.  Now I'm thinking it may not always be child abuse but sometimes just a failure of teaching impulse control with a combo of genes that make impulse control difficult.

How important do you think impulse control is?

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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #105 on: April 22, 2017, 05:41:43 AM »
She's saying that if you never had sex, you wouldn't go through withdrawal.

I still don't get the "withdrawal" portion of it. It has nothing to do with withdrawal, unless those teens who are virgins, but are just becoming sexual beings and such things occupy many of their thoughts are also going through "withdrawal"

Why don't you tell me?  I'm not a mind reader and I don't think you are promiscuous.  Sounds like you have a harem without marriage. 

Does any of those women deserve to be loved by one man?  What benefit do the women in your life have?  Do they know you have other women? 

Are you suggesting you are suffering from puberty, lol?
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Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #106 on: April 22, 2017, 06:11:14 AM »
She's saying that if you never had sex, you wouldn't go through withdrawal.

I still don't get the "withdrawal" portion of it. It has nothing to do with withdrawal, unless those teens who are virgins, but are just becoming sexual beings and such things occupy many of their thoughts are also going through "withdrawal"

Why don't you tell me?  I'm not a mind reader and I don't think you are promiscuous.  Sounds like you have a harem without marriage. 

Does any of those women deserve to be loved by one man?  What benefit do the women in your life have?  Do they know you have other women? 

Are you suggesting you are suffering from puberty, lol?

The problem you are running into is the amount of assumptions you are making, either knowingly or unknowingly.

For the purpose of this discussion Merriam Webster defines promiscuous as:

3
:  not restricted to one sexual partner


Dictionary.com defines it as:

1.
characterized by or involving indiscriminate mingling or association, especially having sexual relations with a number of partners on a casual basis.


These are fine for my purposes although the indiscriminate portion can be discussed. If you have a different definition of promiscuous then you should let us know because it is likely outside of the mainstream.

When you ask about love and that rather loaded question you are introducing factors that have nothing to do with what your original assertion was.

As for suffering, again you are the one suggesting there is suffering going on, not me.

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #107 on: April 22, 2017, 06:17:18 AM »

I mentioned child abuse in the OP albeto. &)

Perhaps you don't understand my question. In your OP, you suggested suffering was caused by promiscuity. Now you're denying that, saying instead that brain chemistry due to withdrawl is the cause of suffering. I'm asking what changed your mind. Was it an argument here? A train of thought you had while pondering the points made? Some new information you found elsewhere?

Perhaps.  In the OP I said promiscuity is a side effect of child abuse.  Now I'm thinking it may not always be child abuse but sometimes just a failure of teaching impulse control with a combo of genes that make impulse control difficult.

How important do you think impulse control is?

that wasn't your claim here.  You tried this in the abortion thread and your claims weren't supported there either.
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Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #108 on: April 22, 2017, 07:08:48 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.

Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

You said you suffer not me.  I posted and defined promiscuous a few pages back. 

I said I wasn't a mind reader and asked the questions I think will help me understand what you are saying. 
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Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #109 on: April 22, 2017, 07:49:38 AM »
I suspect that what The Gawd was saying and what junebug heard might be two different things.

Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

You said you suffer not me.  I posted and defined promiscuous a few pages back. 

I said I wasn't a mind reader and asked the questions I think will help me understand what you are saying.

"When I am not sexually active" is the key phrase. If I am sexually active then I am not suffering. When I am sexually active I am also being promiscuous. This flies exactly opposite to what your initial assertion was. You see how, no?

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #110 on: April 22, 2017, 10:57:28 AM »
If going without food leads to suffering, then by Junebug's logic, it is food as a general topic that causes suffering, rather than the absence of food.
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Offline Mr. Blackwell

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #111 on: April 22, 2017, 02:44:18 PM »
If going without food leads to suffering, then by Junebug's logic, it is food as a general topic that causes suffering, rather than the absence of food.

Yeah but food is kind of necessary for an individual to live while sex is not necessary for an individual to live. Someone could live an entire life without ever having had sex and suffer no physical consequences or withdrawals[1]. If a baby is born and never fed, it won't live long so I don't think that analogy fits.

However, sex is an activity that causes certain chemicals in the brain to light up. Once someone has had a taste of that experience and liked it, it is entirely possible that they may become addicted to that activity. Once addicted, if that person does not get enough sex to keep them satisfied, they may experience withdrawal like symptoms. If the addict is not in a monogamous relationship with a "steady" go to source for their fix, they may look elsewhere for another fix. Or several sources for their fix, just in case one or more sources run dry.

Some people.
 1. Kinda of hard to suffer from withdrawal from something you have never experienced.
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Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #112 on: April 22, 2017, 06:08:50 PM »
If going without food leads to suffering, then by Junebug's logic, it is food as a general topic that causes suffering, rather than the absence of food.

Yeah but food is kind of necessary for an individual to live while sex is not necessary for an individual to live. Someone could live an entire life without ever having had sex and suffer no physical consequences or withdrawals[1]. If a baby is born and never fed, it won't live long so I don't think that analogy fits.

However, sex is an activity that causes certain chemicals in the brain to light up. Once someone has had a taste of that experience and liked it, it is entirely possible that they may become addicted to that activity. Once addicted, if that person does not get enough sex to keep them satisfied, they may experience withdrawal like symptoms. If the addict is not in a monogamous relationship with a "steady" go to source for their fix, they may look elsewhere for another fix. Or several sources for their fix, just in case one or more sources run dry.

Some people.
 1. Kinda of hard to suffer from withdrawal from something you have never experienced.

But one doesn't need to have had sex to develop an insatiable apatite for it. So you may be looking for your "fix" without ever having had any. So the drug analogy doesn't quite work.

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #113 on: April 22, 2017, 06:36:09 PM »
But one doesn't need to have had sex to develop an insatiable apatite for it. So you may be looking for your "fix" without ever having had any. So the drug analogy doesn't quite work.

this is an interesting point.    Being that orgasms don't need a partner, and can happen whilst one is dreaming/asleep, does this qualify as having sex or not? 
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Offline The Gawd

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #114 on: April 22, 2017, 08:05:57 PM »
But one doesn't need to have had sex to develop an insatiable apatite for it. So you may be looking for your "fix" without ever having had any. So the drug analogy doesn't quite work.

this is an interesting point.    Being that orgasms don't need a partner, and can happen whilst one is dreaming/asleep, does this qualify as having sex or not?

I would say no. I think a 2nd being is needed.

Offline junebug72

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Re: does promiscuity cause suffering?
« Reply #115 on: April 23, 2017, 08:05:03 AM »
Yes. Basically, I suffer when I am not sexually active. A venn diagram with my sexual activity and promiscuity would be almost a perfect circle. This seems to fly in the face of what JB is proposing. My question would be how would JB account for my suffering? How would she explain my lack of suffering when I have varying partners?

You said you suffer not me.  I posted and defined promiscuous a few pages back. 

I said I wasn't a mind reader and asked the questions I think will help me understand what you are saying.
"When I am not sexually active" is the key phrase. If I am sexually active then I am not suffering. When I am sexually active I am also being promiscuous. This flies exactly opposite to what your initial assertion was. You see how, no?

It does not fly in the face of withdrawal.  Your suffering sounds like withdrawal. 

Are the women in your life suffering too?  You know when you're not sexing them up? 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2945841/

For instance, some patients present with clinical features that resemble an addictive disorder—i.e., continued engagement in the behavior despite physical or psychological consequences, a loss of control, and a preoccupation with the behavior.

You said:
Hmmm...

All I know is when I am not sufficiently sexed I cannot get my life in order. Work slips, personal relationships slip, my house slips... everything gets worse. Since I have only ever been in one serious relationship ever, my entire sex life is promiscuous. How does JB's opinion coincide with my reality?

That is, i.e negative consequences.
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