Author Topic: ID slowly withering... sort of  (Read 806 times)

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Offline screwtape

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ID slowly withering... sort of
« on: July 11, 2014, 07:27:45 AM »
I'm not getting too excited here.  According to this article
http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2014/06/intelligent-design-slowly-going-out-of-style/372454/

... acceptance in godless evolution is up 6 points from 2004 to 19%.  19%.  About 1 in 5 people.  feh.

It also says ID is down 7 points from 38% is in 2010 to 31%.

But creationism, straight up 6-10 thousand year old universe creationism, is over 40%.  A goddamned plurality.

It is depressing they made a distinction between ID & YEC.  They both really mean the same thing.  81% of Americans reject science.

It makes a man weary. 
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 07:45:15 AM by screwtape »
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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #1 on: July 11, 2014, 07:36:53 AM »
It makes a man weary. 

Don't worry; you'll get there eventually. You'll finally be able to really join the first world.

It is depressing they made a distinction between ID & YEC.  They both really mean the same thing.  81% of Americans reject science.

Small typo: it's 71%.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #2 on: July 11, 2014, 07:39:16 AM »
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Online One Above All

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2014, 07:42:12 AM »
Small typo: it's 71%.

100-19 = 71?

Whoops. I added up 31% (ID proponents)+40% (YEC proponents). :P
Sorry.

An actual typo I noticed now after re-reading your post:
It also says ID is down 7 points from 38% is 2010 to 31%.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2014, 07:46:27 AM »
Whoops. I added up 31% (ID proponents)+40% (YEC proponents).

ah.  probably more accurate than the 19%.  The 10% difference, I would guess, are the "no opinions". 

other typo fixed.  thanks.
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Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2014, 07:57:01 AM »
On the bright side, the U.S, is actually #1 in this area. Most of the rest of the world is lagging far behind in stupidity. At least on this one subject.

Which just goes to show, when provided with inadequate amounts of misinformation, people can, and do, reach accurate conclusions.
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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2014, 08:10:44 AM »
The 10% difference, I would guess, are the "no opinions". 

Those are most likely either "oppressed" theists or actually oppressed atheists.
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Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2014, 01:09:50 AM »
Didn't read a single post on this thread, but seeing as I am new and cannot make my own post...here we go!

I am here to revive ID...oh man, you a##holes had it coming...

Ok, so...grass.  Ya, pretty boring stuff, right?  We walk on it, spit on it...grass.  Interesting thing is, grass hasn't always existed...in fact, grass only showed up around 70 million years ago.  A long time ago for sure, but pretty late in the game if you ask me...

Genesis 2:5...now just how in the hell did a bunch of middle eastern shepherds know that the earth didn't have grass over 70 million years ago?  Like that?  Well, I'll raise you.  The good book makes the claim that grass did not grow because it had not yet rained...according to the book, rain first appeared when the flood occurred....still with me? 

So, let's ignore the "time" issues creationists & evolutionists have with each other...let's just talk events...

1) No grass
2) Cataclysmic event
3) Grass

Which side do those 3 successive events support?  Both.

Biblical: no grass -> flood -> grass
Evolutionary: no grass -> mass extinction of dinosaurs -> grass

Now seeing as we have no idea how the dinosaurs actually went extinct...I'm going to go with the shepherds that mysteriously knew there used to be no grass and say the dinosaurs died in a global flood (most likely caused by a meteorite strike).

This begs the question...is the evolutionary timeline incorrect?  Or, more shockingly, is the genesis account 70 million years old?

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2014, 01:25:25 AM »
Genesis 2:5...now just how in the hell did a bunch of middle eastern shepherds know that the earth didn't have grass over 70 million years ago?  Like that?

It actually says this:

Quote from: Genesis 2:5
When no bush of the field was yet in the land and no small plant of the field had yet sprung up—for the Lord God had not caused it to rain on the land, and there was no man to work the ground,

It says nothing about 70 million years, and speaks of both bushes and grasses rather than just grass.  It also says that there'd been no rain on land yet.  But rain's been around since there've been clouds.  Hell, other planets in our solar system even have rain.

Well, I'll raise you.  The good book makes the claim that grass did not grow because it had not yet rained...according to the book, rain first appeared when the flood occurred....still with me?

Sure, and that's silly, because rain predates life on Earth by a large margin.

So, let's ignore the "time" issues creationists & evolutionists have with each other...let's just talk events...

Ignoring inconvenient facts is generally helpful for the ID crowd.

1) No grass
2) Cataclysmic event
3) Grass

Which side do those 3 successive events support?  Both.

Biblical: no grass -> flood -> grass
Evolutionary: no grass -> mass extinction of dinosaurs -> grass

When you cut out all the facts like that, they almost seem similar.  Then again, things tend to seem similar when you deliberately ignore the things about them that are different, don't they?  The question then becomes one of motivation:  Why ignore what you do?

Now seeing as we have no idea how the dinosaurs actually went extinct

Actually we do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater

It's one of those inconvenient facts that creationists like yourself like to cut out, I suppose.

...I'm going to go with the shepherds that mysteriously knew there used to be no grass and say the dinosaurs died in a global flood (most likely caused by a meteorite strike).

Of course you will, and reason be damned.

This begs the question...is the evolutionary timeline incorrect?  Or, more shockingly, is the genesis account 70 million years old?

Or...crazy thought...can we selectively ignore both (1) facts about real-world geological history, and (2) inconvenient elements of the creation story in question, such that they almost seem to line up?  Why yes, we can!

Very, very unimpressive.  C-, even by creationist standards.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 01:29:34 AM by Azdgari »
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Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2014, 01:34:27 AM »
Oh this is going to be fun, twit. :D *excited*


"It says nothing about 70 million years"
The 70 million years comes from your camp.

 "and speaks of both bushes and grasses rather than just grass."
 Your camp doesn't mention bushes, guess my camp has more information. 

"It also says that there'd been no rain on land yet.  But rain's been around since there've been clouds.  Hell, other planets in our solar system even have rain."  Did you know there was no grass 70 million years ago?  I doubt it, so, pray tell, how do you know there was rain?  Oh right...clouds...because clouds always bring rain... #facepalm


Next quote :D

"Sure, and that's silly, because rain predates life on Earth by a large margin."  Ah yes, more baseless conjecture...did you come out of the womb this dense or were you trained?  Because you are quite incredibly dense...yes, quite incredibly. :D

"Ignoring inconvenient facts is generally helpful for the ID crowd."  Now which facts did I ignore?  Pretty sure I was using your facts against you...while quoting verbatim from a book that is known to be thousands of years old.  Guess you are so dense you think the only facts are the facts that you enjoy...not so, my dear watson, not so. :D

"When you cut out all the facts like that, they almost seem similar.  Then again, things tend to seem similar when you deliberately ignore the things about them that are different, don't they?  The question then becomes one of motivation:  Why ignore what you do?"

Again, still curious on where I am missing facts...I am particularly focusing on one event...the appearance of grass...which happens to coincide with the dinosaur extinction.  You really are a bona fide idiota.

"Actually we do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater"

And this is where I stop reading your post.  You used wikipedia as a source?  Obviously you don't have an education.  Next please!


Offline SevenPatch

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2014, 01:56:35 AM »
"Actually we do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater"

And this is where I stop reading your post.  You used wikipedia as a source?  Obviously you don't have an education.  Next please!

Coming from a person who uses an ancient book written by ignorant goat herders.  Not sure if you could be more ironic.

Exactly what kind of discussion do you hope to have if you plan on using argumentum ad hominem as your go-to argument?
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Online Azdgari

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2014, 02:08:23 AM »
The 70 million years comes from your camp.

Actually it came from your post.  You said this (emphasis mine):
Quote
now just how in the hell did a bunch of middle eastern shepherds know that the earth didn't have grass over 70 million years ago?

Here you state, as a given within your question, that the Earth didn't have grass over 70 million years ago.  You were the first to post, and you were the first to state it.  Don't backtrack from it now.

I don't know if you're new to internet forums, but they have the inconvenient tendency to record your words for later retrieval, such that it's difficult to lie about them.  I'm fairly sure that your post was recent enough that you can now go back and edit it, but even that's problematic, because I've quoted most of it in parts of my previous post.  And both are time-stamped, as would your edit be.  Honesty would be a better policy than what you're doing here.

Your camp doesn't mention bushes, guess my camp has more information.

Except that there isn't any reason to think that it's true.  Truth has never been the creationist movement's strong point, mind you.  Even less so since it tried to rebrand itself as ID.

"It also says that there'd been no rain on land yet.  But rain's been around since there've been clouds.  Hell, other planets in our solar system even have rain."  Did you know there was no grass 70 million years ago?  I doubt it, so, pray tell, how do you know there was rain?  Oh right...clouds...because clouds always bring rain... #facepalm

Actually I know there was rain because there are a plethora of buried sandstone river channels in the geological record[1]; these rivers required water sources higher up topographically, and water does not flow uphill on its own.  It must be transported upward by evaporation.  And the resulting clouds had to rain, or there would be no rivers.

"Sure, and that's silly, because rain predates life on Earth by a large margin."  Ah yes, more baseless conjecture...did you come out of the womb this dense or were you trained?  Because you are quite incredibly dense...yes, quite incredibly. :D

Not baseless at all.  Generally speaking, the natural factors that cause rain are the the presence of oceans, the sun, and a rotating Earth.  These all necessarily existed before life could arise on Earth.  Hell, even your Bible has them existing before life does, because it makes sense to set a stage before placing actors on it.

Also, clastic sediments (those transported by flowing water) and their metamorphosed counterparts exist in the geological record well before any multicellular life is present.  Since a water cycle (ie. rain) is required for flowing water to occur, this means that rain at the very least predates multicellular life.

"Ignoring inconvenient facts is generally helpful for the ID crowd."  Now which facts did I ignore?

You ignored facts about time.  You even stated that you were doing so.

Pretty sure I was using your facts against you...while quoting verbatim from a book that is known to be thousands of years old.  Guess you are so dense you think the only facts are the facts that you enjoy...not so, my dear watson, not so. :D

Perhaps you should re-read your post, then.  You yourself said you would be ignoring any facts concerning time.

Again, still curious on where I am missing facts...I am particularly focusing on one event...the appearance of grass...which happens to coincide with the dinosaur extinction.  You really are a bona fide idiota.

You are ignoring facts about anything beyond your focus.

"Actually we do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater"

And this is where I stop reading your post.  You used wikipedia as a source?  Obviously you don't have an education.  Next please!

I am using it to help educate you.  It's a good first stop for those like yourself who havn't been exposed to these sorts of topics before.  If you dispute the information in that article, you might want to look to the bottom of the page where its information is sourced.  If you would prefer scholarly articles, then I suggest you research them yourself.  Wikipedia is usually a good starting point for those.

I must say, our most active hard-core creationist on here - skeptic54768 - has far superior scholarship to your own.  It's still abyssmal, of course, but he at least tries.
 1. Crosscutting river channels with several cycles of deposition between them - not from a single event.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 02:12:04 AM by Azdgari »
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Online Azdgari

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2014, 02:18:58 AM »
"Actually we do:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicxulub_crater"

And this is where I stop reading your post.  You used wikipedia as a source?  Obviously you don't have an education.  Next please!

Coming from a person who uses an ancient book written by ignorant goat herders.  Not sure if you could be more ironic.

Exactly what kind of discussion do you hope to have if you plan on using argumentum ad hominem as your go-to argument?

The funny thing is, I could definitely provide him with a half-dozen scholarly articles on the topic.  I still have access through my university's library for now, despite having graduated.  But I'd have to upload them to ftp or something in order to make them available here, or E-mail them to mister Tilde here directly.  He's done nothing to earn that kind of effort.
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Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2014, 03:46:50 AM »
*ahem* *cracks knuckles*

"Coming from a person who uses an ancient book written by ignorant goat herders.  Not sure if you could be more ironic.

Exactly what kind of discussion do you hope to have if you plan on using argumentum ad hominem as your go-to argument?"

Funny how you demean the books in the Bible, but if you were to find some crackpot ancient egyptian papyrus you would at least give it the respect of age & history.  Anyways, yea, the bible is a source when talking about religion, idiot.  And no, wikipedia is never a good idea, unless you are looking up the cast of Scrubs.

As far as my argument here...I couldn't make a new post as a new user...so I came here to make my proclamation...quite a hefty discovery if you ask me, and who cares if you asked me or not...this actually does demand attention.

"I must say, our most active hard-core creationist on here - skeptic54768 - has far superior scholarship to your own.  It's still abyssmal, of course, but he at least tries."

Let's get something straight...I am smarter and more creative than you are.  I don't use the "appeal to authority" fallacy, as does nearly every imbecile i've met on this planet.  I don't give a crap who said it, if it is true, it is true and otherwise it is not.  Will my opinions change whilst on this board...I certainly hope so, else this was an enormous waste of my time.  But, will my core opinions change?  Not likely, not without incredible evidence and sound logic. 

Now to Azdgari....har har har...wait till it dawns on you what I am saying here...it will take some heart to face it :D

Ok, so this is supposed to be "common" knowledge.  Hell, I knew about it and I grew up in the bible belt.  Grass hasn't always been here on earth...it showed up really late, end of the age of the dinosaurs late.  Now, we haven't known this for very long...took a lot of human history to get to a point where we could even scientifically ask/answer that question.  So, let me ask you this...how in the hell could you predict that grass wasn't here on the earth when other living things were?  Please, tell me.  That is such a strange prediction for shepherds to be making, indeed.  What's worse, is that both of the timelines predict a global disaster around the time that grass began to appear... w. t. f.

See, I have you atheists to thank, I never even knew that Genesis mentioned anything like that.

Now, please tell me you got it this time.  I've been keeping it in layman's terms and everything!  Don't make me go dry schola on yo a##.


Offline Willie

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2014, 09:06:08 AM »
Tilde, please learn to use the forum's quoting feature. It's not always easy to follow who said what in your posts.

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Online Azdgari

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #15 on: July 12, 2014, 09:56:20 AM »
Let's get something straight...I am smarter and more creative than you are.  I don't use the "appeal to authority" fallacy, as does nearly every imbecile i've met on this planet.  I don't give a crap who said it, if it is true, it is true and otherwise it is not.  Will my opinions change whilst on this board...I certainly hope so, else this was an enormous waste of my time.  But, will my core opinions change?  Not likely, not without incredible evidence and sound logic.

Your self-applause is unimpressive, especially in light of the poor quality of your posts.  It is, however, classic Dunning-Kruger:
http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolved-primate/201006/when-ignorance-begets-confidence-the-classic-dunning-kruger-effect
Quote
The Dunning-Kruger effect describes a cognitive bias in which people perform poorly on a task, but lack the meta-cognitive capacity to properly evaluate their performance. As a result, such people remain unaware of their incompetence and accordingly fail to take any self-improvement measures that might rid them of their incompetence.
http://www.spring.org.uk/2012/06/the-dunning-kruger-effect-why-the-incompetent-dont-know-theyre-incompetent.php
Quote
Unfortunately the problem is that incompetent people have probably been getting this type of feedback for years and failed to take much notice. Despite failing exams, messing up at work and irritating other people, the incompetent still don’t believe they’re incompetent.

Given your attitude, it is very unlikely that anyone is capable of convincing you that you're wrong about anything.  Too much arrogance.

Now to Azdgari....har har har...wait till it dawns on you what I am saying here...it will take some heart to face it :D

The fact that you laud your intelligence while failing to even figure out who said what (you responded to something I said and then said "now to Azdgari...") reinforces the Dunning-Kruger diagnosis.

Ok, so this is supposed to be "common" knowledge.  Hell, I knew about it and I grew up in the bible belt.  Grass hasn't always been here on earth...it showed up really late, end of the age of the dinosaurs late.  Now, we haven't known this for very long...took a lot of human history to get to a point where we could even scientifically ask/answer that question.  So, let me ask you this...how in the hell could you predict that grass wasn't here on the earth when other living things were?  Please, tell me.  That is such a strange prediction for shepherds to be making, indeed.  What's worse, is that both of the timelines predict a global disaster around the time that grass began to appear... w. t. f.

It says there was a time where neither grass nor rain existed on Earth, yet other living things did.  It was wrong about that.  As I mention above, you are not likely going to be willing to admit this.  You've come here with too much attitude to be able to be honest about being wrong.

Grass has existed for the entirety of human existence.  The Bible says that it hasn't.  It's wrong.  Ho-hum.

See, I have you atheists to thank, I never even knew that Genesis mentioned anything like that.

The contents of Genesis are impressively accurate if you remove all of the inaccurate parts.

Now, please tell me you got it this time.  I've been keeping it in layman's terms and everything!  Don't make me go dry schola on yo a##.

You've done nothing to earn this attitude, Tilde.  But if you'd like to use scientific terminology, I'm sure my education as a geologist will help me keep up.
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Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #16 on: July 12, 2014, 10:43:01 AM »
Do you want to know why I am so arrogant?  It's because I want you to continue fighting on your side.  If I come at you with soft words, you maybe would start to change your thinking, but I don't want that.  I want to crush you because of how many people you have crushed.  This thereby cancels most of your post that you wasted talking about some idiot effect.  I can't stand "principles" like that...reminds me of the peter principle...all of which is complete malarkey.

Now, let's get back to your hammering...

"It says there was a time where neither grass nor rain existed on Earth, yet other living things did.  It was wrong about that.  As I mention above, you are not likely going to be willing to admit this.  You've come here with too much attitude to be able to be honest about being wrong.

Grass has existed for the entirety of human existence.  The Bible says that it hasn't.  It's wrong.  Ho-hum."

Let's dissect how stupid your post is...

First, both camps agree that there used to be no grass.  AGREE OR DISAGREE?  (This is how I have to argue with dense morons...step by idiot step).

The correct answer: Agree.

Second, the rain issue, well it is just what the Genesis account says, which the Genesis account is actually what remains of an extremely ancient oral tradition.  I, for one, study history in its entirety instead of picking and choosing what I read based upon religious bias.  You, on the other hand, are such a twit that you can't appreciate the age of the document & tradition.   <<That makes you a neanderthal and a barbarian.  Why don't you just join forces with the Taliban or Isis?  You can run around destroying priceless artifacts and ancient shrines just because you disagree with other people.  People like you are the sole problem of this world.


Back to your idiot argument..."It says there was a time where neither grass nor rain existed on Earth, yet other living things did.  It was wrong about that."  It was wrong about what?  And, some proof?  You are using uncommon knowledge, and if you had an education you would know that you are to supply references whenever something is not common knowledge...geez, you are a simpleton.

"Grass has existed for the entirety of human existence.  The Bible says that it hasn't.  It's wrong.  Ho-hum."  No, what the bible says is that in the beginning of the earth, there was no grass.  But, of course you are too dense to read what is right in front of your face, aren't you?  And, I bet that you will respond with something equally moronic to all of your previous posts.

I don't enjoy being better than you...I love it.

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #17 on: July 12, 2014, 11:05:05 AM »
If you aren't going to address my points, but instead just sling insults and lie about my character, then there's little to add.  Just another vacuous troll.
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Offline voodoo child

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #18 on: July 12, 2014, 11:14:59 AM »
The classical man is just a bundle of routine, ideas and tradition. If you follow the classical pattern, you are understanding the routine, the tradition, the shadow, you are not understanding yourself. Truth has no path. Truth is living and therefore changing. Bruce lee

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #19 on: July 12, 2014, 11:16:37 AM »
Tilde,

I agree with the point you are trying to make but I do not agree with the way you are going about it. That is certainly not a Christian attitude. We are all equal creatures in God's eyes.

With an attitude like yours, you will get banned fast.
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Offline shnozzola

Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #20 on: July 12, 2014, 11:16:50 AM »
Quote
oh man, you a##holes had it coming.
Quote
Oh this is going to be fun, twit.
Quote
You really are a bona fide idiota
Quote
Anyways, yea, the bible is a source when talking about religion, idiot.
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I don't use the "appeal to authority" fallacy, as does nearly every imbecile i've met on this planet.
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Don't make me go dry schola on yo a##.
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This thereby cancels most of your post that you wasted talking about some idiot effect.
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(This is how I have to argue with dense morons...step by idiot step).
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You, on the other hand, are such a twit that you can't appreciate the age of the document & tradition.
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geez, you are a simpleton
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Back to your idiot argument.
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And, I bet that you will respond with something equally moronic to all of your previous posts

There are wiser ways to debate, my friend.
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Online Azdgari

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #21 on: July 12, 2014, 11:20:23 AM »
I agree with the point you are trying to make

You agree that grass is 70 million years old?

but I do not agree with the way you are going about it. That is certainly not a Christian attitude. We are all equal creatures in God's eyes.

Thing is, he's not here to make a point, skep.  He said so himself.  He's here to "punish" people he disagrees with.  No religious or ideological viewpoint is entirely clean of folks like him.  Every creed has people who act like this.  Sadly, it seems to be a part of the human condition.

With an attitude like yours, you will get banned fast.

When he does, he will consider it a victory.  This is typical behaviour of ideological trolls.
The highest moral human authority is copied by our Gandhi neurons through observation.

Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #22 on: July 12, 2014, 11:37:44 AM »
[Nothing of consequence removed]

GB Mod
« Last Edit: July 13, 2014, 06:17:14 AM by Graybeard »

Offline Tilde

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #23 on: July 12, 2014, 11:51:42 AM »
Oh hey, Azgari...just to be clear here...i am agreeing with mainstream science...and thereby you are not.

I am agreeing that grass is 70 million years old, dinosaurs went extinct at about the same time by a meteorite strike.  If you have any issue with those statements, shut up because the whole world is against you.


Now, where I differ is here: Based on the number of far-reaching flood myths all sharing similar traits...i believe that meteorite strike caused our infamous global flood.  You don't have literally thousands of flood myths telling the same damn story from across the entire globe from people groups who had no contact with each other and it just be some bedtime story...I really really wish you knew how to apply critical thinking as opposed to pre-conceived notions...



Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #24 on: July 12, 2014, 12:09:26 PM »
You won't be posting here very long troll,so you better hit us with it good
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Offline SevenPatch

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2014, 12:33:26 PM »
You won't be posting here very long troll,so you better hit us with it good

The sad part is, his delusional mind will keep right on thinking he is smart and has any clue about anything.
"Shut him up! We have a lot invested in this ride - SHUT HIM UP! Look at my furrows of worry! Look at my big bank account, and my family! This just HAS to be real!" - Bill Hicks

Offline Foxy Freedom

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #26 on: July 12, 2014, 12:49:34 PM »
I want to crush you because of how many people you have crushed.

I don't enjoy being better than you...I love it.



Oh hey, Azgari...just to be clear here...i am agreeing with mainstream science...and thereby you are not.

I am agreeing that grass is 70 million years old, dinosaurs went extinct at about the same time by a meteorite strike.  If you have any issue with those statements, shut up because the whole world is against you.


Now, where I differ is here: Based on the number of far-reaching flood myths all sharing similar traits...i believe that meteorite strike caused our infamous global flood. You don't have literally thousands of flood myths telling the same damn story from across the entire globe from people groups who had no contact with each other and it just be some bedtime story...I really really wish you knew how to apply critical thinking as opposed to pre-conceived notions...


1) your delusion

2) your delusion

Oh hey, Azgari...just to be clear here...i am agreeing with mainstream science...and thereby you are not.

I am agreeing that grass is 70 million years old, dinosaurs went extinct at about the same time by a meteorite strike.  If you have any issue with those statements, shut up because the whole world is against you.

Let's get something straight...I am smarter and more creative than you are.  I don't use the "appeal to authority" fallacy, as does nearly every imbecile i've met on this planet. I don't give a crap who said it, if it is true, it is true and otherwise it is not.Will my opinions change whilst on this board...I certainly hope so, else this was an enormous waste of my time.  But, will my core opinions change?  Not likely, not without incredible evidence and sound logic. 

3) your contradiction and your delusion

I bet you are not smart enough to identify your mistakes.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 01:12:37 PM by Foxy Freedom »
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Offline SevenPatch

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #27 on: July 12, 2014, 01:04:37 PM »
Coming from a person who uses an ancient book written by ignorant goat herders.  Not sure if you could be more ironic.

Exactly what kind of discussion do you hope to have if you plan on using argumentum ad hominem as your go-to argument?

Funny how you demean the books in the Bible, but if you were to find some crackpot ancient egyptian papyrus you would at least give it the respect of age & history. 

What is really funny, is your cognitive bias for which you are completely oblivious to.  I in no way demeaned the books in the Bible, while you demean ancient Egyptian texts by referring to them as "crackpot".


Anyways, yea, the bible is a source when talking about religion, idiot.  And no, wikipedia is never a good idea, unless you are looking up the cast of Scrubs.

Yet another straw-man argument.  I never said the Bible couldn't be used a source when talking about religion, but that is not how you are using it in this discussion.  No, you are using it as a source regarding the relatively recent origin of grass post-dating a natural disaster while ignoring the fact that you are cherry picking this information as part of your confirmation bias. 

As far as my argument here...I couldn't make a new post as a new user...so I came here to make my proclamation...quite a hefty discovery if you ask me, and who cares if you asked me or not...this actually does demand attention.

Whiff ... Swing batter batter.  My question went right over your head didn't it, I'll put it in layman's terms for ya.

What discussion do you hope to have if you attempt to diminish the persons character rather than addressing the argument itself?   By attempting to diminish the persons character without ever addressing the argument itself you only prove that you have no rebuttal to the argument.  In all of your replies so far, you have yet to offer any serious arguments, while only seeking to insult, in short you are trolling which is against forum rules.
"Shut him up! We have a lot invested in this ride - SHUT HIM UP! Look at my furrows of worry! Look at my big bank account, and my family! This just HAS to be real!" - Bill Hicks

Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: ID slowly withering... sort of
« Reply #28 on: July 12, 2014, 01:19:17 PM »
Oh hey, Azgari...just to be clear here...i am agreeing with mainstream science...and thereby you are not.

I am agreeing that grass is 70 million years old, dinosaurs went extinct at about the same time by a meteorite strike.  If you have any issue with those statements, shut up because the whole world is against you.


Now, where I differ is here: Based on the number of far-reaching flood myths all sharing similar traits...i believe that meteorite strike caused our infamous global flood.  You don't have literally thousands of flood myths telling the same damn story from across the entire globe from people groups who had no contact with each other and it just be some bedtime story...I really really wish you knew how to apply critical thinking as opposed to pre-conceived notions...

A meteor hitting the planet big enough to cause lots of flooding? The flood would be the least of everyones worries. The years of persistently cold and cloudy and rainy days, which would come after the deluge of hot falling rocks in at least some of those story areas, methinks they would be the bigger story line.

In 1816, a huge volcano in Indonesia (which blew up in 1815) causes the northern hemisphere to have a summer with not warm weather. It snows in July and August in Ohio. Nobody could grow food. It was pretty bad. Nobody bothered mentioning any floods because that would have been normal.

You are saying that all the flood stories around the world are from the same flood. And ignoring that there are huge floods periodically in various parts of the world (less so now than before we had dams) and that every frickin' culture that gets semi wiped out by a flood is going to have a flood story, just for the heck of it.

A giant flood have totally destroyed the cave paintings in France. They date back to 35,000 years ago or so.

There are flood stories among some NW U.S. Indians, based on the flooding caused when natural landslides opened up the canyon and allowed Lake Missoula to flood across eastern Washington and help carve the Columbia River Gorge on its way to Oregon. This happened several times as the lake got dammed up and then broke through again. We have tons of geological evidence for this event that is not inconsistent with the Indian stories. No meteors were involved.

Find me some geologists who agree that there was one large flood event x number of years ago, find some more that have found where a large meteor hit in the recent past (a few thousand years ago) and find more evidence than just cultural stories, and you may have a winner. I asked an American Indian friend, who is one of the keepers of her tribes oral history, if it included any unbelievably large floods. Nope. And their story goes back somewhere around 7,000 years, as far as they can tell, by counting generations and such.

I have no idea where you are using "critical thinking" and coming up with only one possible answer at the same time. Yes, there may indeed have been this biggie meteor that hit and caused similar flood stories around the world. And maybe the reason the christian story is so idiotic is because the authors all got hit in the head by falling rocks from the meteor strike. But until you can find some well-grounded scientific evidence that such an event took place, you are not doing any critical thinking. You are only making wild-assed guesses.
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