Wait a minute--Lukvance, you think we don't want miracles to be true
? We are just disagreeing to be difficult?
First of all, that is not why we don't believe in miracles--because we "don't want" them to be real or true. Whyever would we not want miracles to be real? Who would not want there to be magic? Everyone wants there to be magic!
If magic and miracles were real and actually helped sick people better than medicine, that would mean that we atheists, for some strange reason, don't want people who are sick to get well. Not even ourselves and our own loved ones. That is ridiculous. Of course we want people to get well. That is why we support what works--medical science.
It works way better than praying for miracles from supernatural beings. Praying does not work at all--people who pray have identical health to people who do not pray. So, we don't want people to waste time and money doing stuff that does not work at all. You have told us that miracles are not cures, Lukvance. I agree with you there. Prayers are not cures either.
I believe in what works and what is proven to be real. If praying to god worked as well as medicine, I would be the first person on my knees.
I have had many health problems, including a high-risk pregnancy. I have never prayed and I got well-- through medical science.
I have known many seriously ill people in poor countries. Nobody prayed more than they did-- and most of the folks were devout Catholics. Praying to the right god and everything. And they still suffered and died. Their babies suffered and died. They prayed and got zilch.
If god answered their prayers, then everyone was praying to god for death and for god to make their babies die. Because that is the answer god gave them--the same answer most everyone has gotten all through human history without medical science. Death. Early, painful, death.
Hell, if prayer worked, the illness and death toll among religious folks would be almost non-existent. And the illness and death toll around the world among atheists who never pray would be off the charts. (Isn't that strange? Wonder why we atheists who never pray-- and even blaspheme-- are as healthy and live just as long as our religious relatives and friends?)
Praying clearly does not save lives or heal disease as well as medicine, or we would not need medicine. Praying, ie, doing something that does not work, is clearly stupid. I try (often failing) to avoid knowingly doing as many stupid things as possible.
But let's say for the sake of argument that we don't want miracles to be true
. And that is why we don't believe the clear and obviously true evidence. Why would that even matter? Do miracles and magic only happen because people believe in them? What people want to be true has zero effect on reality.
It would make no difference in the world if every last person on the planet thought that miracles were real. God would have to keep track of how many people believe in miracles and then adjust his behavior accordingly. If so, he is not god. God presumably does the number of miracles he wants to do, less than 1% or however many, no matter what people think.
It does not matter what people believe about god. If god has to wait for people to believe
in miracles before he can do a miracle, he would be like Tinkerbell in Peter Pan, becoming stronger and more effective as more people believe
Is god truly that dependent on human belief? It certainly seems that way, since he has to wait around for people to pray to him in just the right way. And then he does a miracle or not (mostly not) anyway, regardless of the prayers.
If nobody ever prayed to god the right way, if there were no Catholics on earth, would there be then no more miracles? Or would god just suck it up and keep on plugging away, doing his less than 1% quota for the Hindus and Muslims instead of the Catholics, like a worker going through the motions at a job they hate?