Author Topic: The serial nature of a god who works through science.  (Read 98 times)

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The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« on: July 28, 2014, 02:54:40 PM »
I have heard it said that god works miracles through people.  In essence Heart bypass surgery is a miracle from god using scientists as his tools.

If science is devinely inspired why does god do this in a serial manner.

1) 1,000,000 years ago god taught a guy name of Grog to make fire.  Reducing parasites and dissease.
2) 500,000 god inspired Ug to make a spear.  Making the hunt for food safer and more productive
3) 200,000 years later he taught Arrrg to tip a spear with a stone tip.  Opening wider wound channels improving the hunt further.
4) 30,000 years ago we were given the arrow.  allowing fat hunters to kill beasts at a distance:)
5) 12,000 years ago we got inspired again and started growing food. 
6) 6,000 years ago Then things get rolling invention of casting metals (god starts inspring people. gold, copper bronze... each with properties that improved life a little.
7) God then gives us the written word about 3,000 years ago and things really start to rock.
8) Astronomy
9) Alchemy lead to actual science.
10) ...

1000) For some reason somewhere around the late 1800's about a century + ago god decides to tell us about dissease
10,010) 10,000 inventions later god inspires us how to do heart bypass, start curing cancer, ...


If God inspires us to these above miracles can you postulate a reason for the escallating nature of his devine inspiration?  Why he give us these mundane miracles that seem to be found at the hands of scientists and inventors?  Why not give us the miracle right from the beginning, and avoid all the lives lost due to starvation for 900,000 years while he witheld agriculture.

Even in a young earth scenario god witheld the latest and greatest inventions until the last century leaving us 5,800 years with out a cure for polio, small pox and defenseless agains Malaria.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 02:59:03 PM by epidemic »

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2014, 03:04:16 PM »
God didn't tell Grog to make fire... he set it up so that Grog would see lightning hit a tree and catch it on fire, and then he set it up so that Grog would notice that certain types of rocks scraping together make sparks.   God set that up by evolving the tree from pre-plant organisms millions and millions of years earlier.

Because... um... it just um... all makes sense because we can't make sense of the mind of God!

Look Epidemic, we know God is real because he wrote this perfect book called the Bible.  We know the Bible is real because in it, it says that it can't contradict itself, and we know that it's inspired by God because it tells us it is.  And we know God is real because the Bible says so, and we know the bible is real because God inspired it.

So f--- you... that's why you're wrong!  You're wrong you're just wrong...

Wait, let me come at you with PROOF that God is real.

Go look outside.  Did you look?  Convinced yet?

My awesome arguments are awesome because my arguments say that they are awesome.
You can't spell BELIEVE without LIE...  and a few other letters.  B and E and V and I think E.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2014, 03:12:52 PM »
Good questions, epidemic. Too bad you won't get any good answers. God has his schedule. He's busy.  Other planets to manage, dontcha know. He can only pop in once every few hundred or few thousand years.

Except for the constant appearances in the brains of schizophrenics, in the dreams of people who already believe while they are under anesthesia, on toast, on a map of Africa, on moldy walls, on tortillas, and on dog anuses.  &)
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #3 on: Yesterday at 07:36:09 AM »

Wait, let me come at you with PROOF that God is real.

Go look outside.  Did you look?  Convinced yet?

My awesome arguments are awesome because my arguments say that they are awesome.

I just went outside,  I was amazed, I saw randomness and chaos.  Air banging against leaves bugs bouncing off cars, dragon fly laying eggs on the hood of my car because it looked like the surface of water to him.  Off in the distance I saw people scurrying around in cars most on mundane insignificant missions to buy a new video or a new blouse to go with their shoes.  I was hailed on by solar radiation and I expect some of my cells were damaged by it.

I did not see god, I saw nature, i saw randomness seeking order.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #4 on: Yesterday at 07:56:54 AM »
I just went outside,  I was amazed, I saw randomness and chaos.  Air banging against leaves bugs bouncing off cars, dragon fly laying eggs on the hood of my car because it looked like the surface of water to him.  Off in the distance I saw people scurrying around in cars most on mundane insignificant missions to buy a new video or a new blouse to go with their shoes.  I was hailed on by solar radiation and I expect some of my cells were damaged by it.

I did not see god, I saw nature, i saw randomness seeking order.

Right. And that randomness goes to the very core of how the universe works at the deepest level without causality. Natural radioactive decay and the path of light through gratings, are two well known examples. No design, no designer, and no cause are needed for the universe.
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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #5 on: Yesterday at 08:42:37 AM »

Wait, let me come at you with PROOF that God is real.

Go look outside.  Did you look?  Convinced yet?

My awesome arguments are awesome because my arguments say that they are awesome.

I just went outside,  I was amazed, I saw randomness and chaos.  Air banging against leaves bugs bouncing off cars, dragon fly laying eggs on the hood of my car because it looked like the surface of water to him.  Off in the distance I saw people scurrying around in cars most on mundane insignificant missions to buy a new video or a new blouse to go with their shoes.  I was hailed on by solar radiation and I expect some of my cells were damaged by it.

I did not see god, I saw nature, i saw randomness seeking order.

Ok, but, did you like, look at a double rainbow?



Woah, that's so intense.  It's a double rainbow all the way. OH MY GOD OH MY GOD OHOEMOWMEO WOW! WWWOOOO!

Rainbows are proof that god loves us so much he won't drown a few million of us again... it's a covenant between us and god, and at the end of it, if we guess the right thing to believe, we get a mansion in heaven with streets of gold and our relatives are all there but they look young and we can still recognize them and the creepy uncle who molested you but turned his heart to god is there too and it's all fun.

So yeah, if looking outside didn't work, try doing that again, and try looking at a rainbow this time.   It's evidence!  Evidence I tells ya!

Remember God PROMISED Noah "I'll never kill all humanity... BY FLOOD... *wink* again!"

Noah, "Oh well, that's good... wait a minute, that means you'll do it some other way?"

God, "I didn't say nuthin."
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 08:46:45 AM by YRM_DM »
You can't spell BELIEVE without LIE...  and a few other letters.  B and E and V and I think E.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #6 on: Yesterday at 11:01:51 AM »
I give you a rainbow as a sign that I will never wipe out humanity by flood.

I really don't think I care how I get wiped out.  Flood seems about as good as any method.  I think I prefer flood to plague or fire.  A planet killer meteor might be ok.  But I think flood is kinda nice because you can say good by to your loved ones.

I vote for another flood before the choice of unknown method.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #7 on: Yesterday at 11:07:16 AM »
I suppose you guys know that after promising not to cause another flood, Yahweh did cause another flood "bigger than any since the beginning" in Exodus. Too bad Yahweh doesn't keep his promises.
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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #8 on: Yesterday at 11:11:57 AM »
which flood would that be?

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #9 on: Yesterday at 11:43:11 AM »
which flood would that be?

Against Pharaoh in Exodus 9:18 I will cause it to rain, with a heavy hail, such as has never been in Egypt since the foundation,...man and beast will die....( to 9:33) and the thunder and hail ceased and the rain no longer poured upon the earth.

It looks like Egypt missed Noah's flood so they had this instead.

I checked the original Hebrew. The word "cause to rain" in Exodus 9:18 is the same word as in Genesis 7:4 I will cause it to rain upon the Earth forty days and forty nights.
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 11:58:37 AM by Foxy Freedom »
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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #10 on: Yesterday at 11:54:35 AM »
which flood would that be?

Against Pharaoh in Exodus 9:18 I will cause it to rain, with a heavy hail, such as has never been in Egypt since the foundation,...man and beast will die....( to 9:33) and the thunder and hail ceased and the rain no longer poured upon the earth.

It looks like Egypt missed Noah's flood so they had this instead.

That's not true at all... my loving god is not contradictory when he loves us or drowns us or burns us for eternity.

It means that there was Noah's flood, 4,000 years ago, and then Egypt was founded after that... then AFTER the foundation, God did another flood but not such a big flood as the first time because god is perfect and doesn't break his word, the Bible says God is perfect and we know that's true because God wrote it... remember?

Are you slow Foxy Freedom?

Now we know that some satanist scientists claim that Egypt dated back before Noah's flood, but, those scientists are just tricked by satan and what happened is... we don't know if God sped up natural processes or not because we weren't there.

So I think what happened is that God sped up the speed of light and geological processes because the earth is only 6,000 years old.

This seems reasonable to assume because the Bible can't possibly be wrong, or contradict itself because, say it with me... GOD WROTE IT... and we KNOW he wrote it because it says so right THERE in the SAME BOOK.

Cha-ching... score another major debate victory for Christianity.

You guys are such dumbs.   Where are the moderator to score me the victory?
« Last Edit: Yesterday at 12:02:13 PM by YRM_DM »
You can't spell BELIEVE without LIE...  and a few other letters.  B and E and V and I think E.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #11 on: Today at 11:07:57 AM »
^^^^I love the part where god randomly speeds up and slows down natural processes to match what the bible says, based on the fact that most people nowadays accept the information scientists have discovered. No record of that ever happening in nature, or in human documentation. But we were not there, so we cannot say it didn't happen![1]

Like, yeah, there was evolution...grumble grumble...but it wasn't that slow, stupid evilution you satanic scientists are babbling about, what with your dirty old fossils and silly DNA evidence.  Because you weren't there, so you don't actually know, do you?

What happened was this really superspeedy godly hyperevolution that changed the handful of "kinds" of critters on the ark into all the millions of species we have today, and flung them all around the world to the correct habitats in a few thousand years. And people were there, but they didn't notice that animals were having babies of different species each generation. New animals, plants, fish and insects just magically appeared in forests, on islands, in deserts and on mountaintops. Every few weeks.

Because magical things were happening all the time in those days, and nobody wrote all that boring stuff down. People came back from the dead. The sun stood still. Giant dinosaurs walked the earth along side of people. God sped nature up and slowed it down. Ho hum.

People just recorded exciting, important stuff back then, because papyrus and clay was expensive. They wrote down the depth of the Nile river every year, and tax records, and love letters, and grocery lists to remind people how many slaves to pick up in the market...you know, really unusual stuff.

That's how we know for a fact that magical stuff happened. Because nobody noticed it. &)
 1. In other news, angels and fairies flew out of Vladimir Putin's butt last night. You weren't there, so you cannot say it didn't happen.
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #12 on: Today at 01:31:34 PM »
^^^^I love the part where god randomly speeds up and slows down natural processes to match what the bible says, based on the fact that most people nowadays accept the information scientists have discovered. No record of that ever happening in nature, or in human documentation. But we were not there, so we cannot say it didn't happen![1]
 1. In other news, angels and fairies flew out of Vladimir Putin's butt last night. You weren't there, so you cannot say it didn't happen.

Yeah, I don't know why more people don't understand that.   That's pretty cool about the angels and fairies.  I hadn't heard that, but, I'll be sharing it to prove my faith to more people.  You have no reason to lie to me, and what I read there from you is just as believable as what I read in the Bible.   The only thing is... can you verify to me that God inspired you to write that stuff about Angels flying out of Putin's butt?  I want to be scientific so I'm asking you to verify that God told you to say it.

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Like, yeah, there was evolution...grumble grumble...but it wasn't that slow, stupid evilution you satanic scientists are babbling about, what with your dirty old fossils and silly DNA evidence.  Because you weren't there, so you don't actually know, do you?

I think stuff like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiktaalik  Is all made up by satan to try to trick you out of believing in god.   We all know that the Grand Canyon was formed when more water than exists on all the earth drained off through some plug in the Grand Canyon that doesn't exist either.

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What happened was this really superspeedy godly hyperevolution that changed the handful of "kinds" of critters on the ark into all the millions of species we have today, and flung them all around the world to the correct habitats in a few thousand years. And people were there, but they didn't notice that animals were having babies of different species each generation. New animals, plants, fish and insects just magically appeared in forests, on islands, in deserts and on mountaintops. Every few weeks.

That's plausible.   Also the speeding up and slowing down of natural processes helps to explain why other societies were thriving at the exact same time as the worldwide global flood that covered every inch of land.

We know for sure that the worldwide flood happened, because God said so in his book that says he's real... so based on that, we work downwards and figure out why all the evidence makes it look like no worldwide flood happened at all... you're getting it.

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Because magical things were happening all the time in those days, and nobody wrote all that boring stuff down. People came back from the dead. The sun stood still. Giant dinosaurs walked the earth along side of people. God sped nature up and slowed it down. Ho hum.

People just recorded exciting, important stuff back then, because papyrus and clay was expensive. They wrote down the depth of the Nile river every year, and tax records, and love letters, and grocery lists to remind people how many slaves to pick up in the market...you know, really unusual stuff.

The important thing for you to understand here is that God can't be tested, so he has to trick any evidence that would prove him.   Let's say you were a prophet of God right?  And you wanted to prove that he was real...   and you wanted Yahweh to compete in some test against some other god... let's call him Baal.   Let's say you wanted God to light your altar on fire, and because Baal doesn't act for his followers, that PROVES he doesn't exist... well, God can't do stuff like that because God can't be tested.  Giving people proof would violate their free will.

So Yahweh can't participate in some contest to prove he exists, started by some guy, let's call him Elijah, and after Yahweh provides proof, we happily bloodily slaughter all the prophets of Baal...

...wait, what?  That happened?

...well God can't give us evidence NOW because it'd violate our free will now, but he COULD give evidence THEN because his OBJECTIVE UNCHANGING GOOD MORALITY allowed for things like God vs God contests where the loser priests are butchered back then, but he changed the rules in his unchanging good nature.

Make sense?   You with me?

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That's how we know for a fact that magical stuff happened. Because nobody noticed it. &)

That's right.   Obviously people were afraid of persecution, so, they didn't write about the miracles outside of the guys who wrote the gospels a few decades after it happened.   A few decades is too short of time to get any details wrong in the bronze age, and they were the only ones brave enough to write about it, so, that's how we know it's 100% verified.

Stew on that atheists, when you're screaming of 3rd degree burns for eternity and I'm kicking back praising Jesus with great praise in my white robe and halo on streets paved from gold that God couldn't spare to help poor people in this world.

Hahah!  I win all debates!   I am a master debater!
You can't spell BELIEVE without LIE...  and a few other letters.  B and E and V and I think E.

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Re: The serial nature of a god who works through science.
« Reply #13 on: Today at 02:30:20 PM »
^^^^^Or something that rhymes with master debater.  :angel:
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.