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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #29 on: May 14, 2014, 11:31:56 AM »
I don't get any of this. i just worked my childhood away doing my bit to keep the family business afloat then left home early to help fund my sister thru college.

I'm sorry to hear that. It's admirable that you did what you had to in order to help your family.

i no zero of the pop culture of mine or any era...just work.

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i always see this kind of biz the thing of  lazy/loafers.

It's not like we play D&D or similar games 24/7. 


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We weren't the cool kids....

Neither was I or the rest of my group back in high school. It gave us something to do on Saturday nights since we were never invited to the cool kid's parties (the "Aristocracy" as we used to call them).
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: d&d
« Reply #30 on: May 14, 2014, 08:26:05 PM »
Magic Missile!
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Offline Willie

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Re: d&d
« Reply #31 on: May 14, 2014, 09:07:43 PM »
I've never played D&D, but I've considered it. What's it like?

It's like this. Yep, exactly like that. According to Jack Chick, anyway. And you know you can trust a guy who says that evolution is like this to give you the straight dope.

Offline One Above All

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Re: d&d
« Reply #32 on: May 15, 2014, 12:45:58 AM »
It's like this. Yep, exactly like that. According to Jack Chick, anyway. And you know you can trust a guy who says that evolution is like this to give you the straight dope.


Thank you, Willie. Now I have to get rid of my long-term memory.
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #33 on: May 15, 2014, 08:58:20 PM »
Well, I did some searching and it tuns out that the two individuals in my area who had placed ads are only looking to join D&D 4th edition groups.

Darned these kids and their new-fangled 4th editions. Why, when I was their age all we had was 3.5, and we were darned fortunate to have it! Grumble grumble...
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: d&d
« Reply #34 on: May 15, 2014, 09:06:53 PM »
Well, I did some searching and it tuns out that the two individuals in my area who had placed ads are only looking to join D&D 4th edition groups.

Darned these kids and their new-fangled 4th editions. Why, when I was their age all we had was 3.5, and we were darned fortunate to have it! Grumble grumble...

I remember having the Players handbook with the Demon Statue on the cover with the thieves trying to steal part of it...and old D&Ders stating the same thing about the Brown Book rules. Yes the 1974 Brown Books rules.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #35 on: May 15, 2014, 09:17:11 PM »
I remember having the Players handbook with the Demon Statue on the cover with the thieves trying to steal part of it...and old D&Ders stating the same thing about the Brown Book rules. Yes the 1974 Brown Books rules.

Yeah, they did. Rangers, paladins, illusionists and Druids were added... Alignments went from just Lawful, Neutral and Chaotic to adding Good and Evil to the mix. It was the Golden Age of D&D.
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Re: d&d
« Reply #36 on: May 15, 2014, 09:25:14 PM »
Still trying to get my head around. does this game involve strategy??
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #37 on: May 15, 2014, 11:57:44 PM »
Still trying to get my head around. does this game involve strategy??

During combat, yes. Each character has their own strengths, skills and abilities. A successful group knows how to work together to make the best use of them.

For instance, the wizard in a party might need a minute to use his magic against an opponent and is vulnerable to being attacked while he is concentrating on casting a spell (such as Lightning Bolt). The warrior might position himself between the wizard and the monsters to act as a human shield until the spell is cast. The cleric (think priest) of the group might use his healing magic on the warrior to keep him in fighting shape. The thief of the group might then use the opportunity to sneak in the shadows in order to backstab the monsters, creating a flanking position with the warrior which gives both of them bonuses during combat.
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: d&d
« Reply #38 on: May 16, 2014, 12:08:35 AM »
Arrrrrg listening to you makes me wanna play so bad hahaha. I forget how much I loved this game. I guess I'll get a magic the gathering fix this weekend while I wait for the opportunity to play d&d again.
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #39 on: May 16, 2014, 12:23:37 AM »
Arrrrrg listening to you makes me wanna play so bad hahaha. I forget how much I loved this game. I guess I'll get a magic the gathering fix this weekend while I wait for the opportunity to play d&d again.

Same here. Sadly, I think the majority of D&D fans have moved on from "old school" pen-and-paper to playing the online version for the PC. It's just not the same. :-\
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: d&d
« Reply #40 on: May 16, 2014, 07:13:20 AM »
I remember having the Players handbook with the Demon Statue on the cover with the thieves trying to steal part of it...and old D&Ders stating the same thing about the Brown Book rules. Yes the 1974 Brown Books rules.

Yeah, they did. Rangers, paladins, illusionists and Druids were added... Alignments went from just Lawful, Neutral and Chaotic to adding Good and Evil to the mix. It was the Golden Age of D&D.

Actually, I think 3.0 was the best version made and that came out well after I stopped playing regularly. Cleaned up a lot of unnecessary number crunching and conflicting rules, and made the characters more three dimensional. 4.0 is dumbed down in the extreme, and feel more like a late 90s computer game than D&D.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

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Re: d&d
« Reply #41 on: May 16, 2014, 07:23:37 AM »
How is the winner/s determined and how does a game end. how long does a typical. game go for??
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Offline One Above All

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Re: d&d
« Reply #42 on: May 16, 2014, 07:25:11 AM »
How is the winner/s determined and how does a game end.

IIRC it ends when the DM decides it does and/or when the players get through the dungeon or whatever.

how long does a typical. game go for??

Hours, I'd bet. Maybe days.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: d&d
« Reply #43 on: May 16, 2014, 08:32:57 AM »
How is the winner/s determined

It is not that kind of game.  You don't have winners and losers.  The best kinds of games are the kind where the players collaborate, not compete. You survive or you die.  You prosper or you do not.

Let me try to explain it better.  It is a fantasy game.  That is, you as a group participate in a fantasy.  The DM creates the world/ setting.  He sets the stage and fulfills the role(s) of the universe.  The rest of the players interact with it. 

The guys who invented d&d based it on Lord of the Rings[1], which is a good example of how a game scenario may play out.  You, the players, have adventures like the hobbits did. 

In some cases the DM says "this is your goal" in other cases, goals are entirely player driven ("I want to build a castle/ steal a gem/ marry the princess/ crush my enemies").  So, you sort of create a story as you go.  It is a lot like improv, only there are rules for resolving conflict.  If you wish to fight someone, there is a system to determine who wins the combat.  If you wish to climb a wall or avoid a trap, there are game mechanics for that, all of which involve rolling various dice.

A game that lasts more than one session is called a campaign.   In a campaign, you will have more than one adventure.  Later adventures are direct results of the prior ones. 

and how does a game end. how long does a typical. game go for??

It depends.  I ran a campaign that lasted for 10 years. A given game session would last 4-6 hours.  We would stop when we got tired or had a good place to leave off.

 1. though they lied and said they didn't.  but the facts are the facts
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Re: d&d
« Reply #44 on: May 16, 2014, 09:00:15 AM »
For fuk that's not even a game, its like theatre sports.


I'm gonna smack the next d&d person i see and screwtape it will be cos of your explanation .


this whole concept sux.


thanks for reply.
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Offline Boots

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Re: d&d
« Reply #45 on: May 16, 2014, 09:29:29 AM »
I remember having the Players handbook with the Demon Statue on the cover with the thieves trying to steal part of it...and old D&Ders stating the same thing about the Brown Book rules. Yes the 1974 Brown Books rules.

Yeah, they did. Rangers, paladins, illusionists and Druids were added... Alignments went from just Lawful, Neutral and Chaotic to adding Good and Evil to the mix. It was the Golden Age of D&D.

Actually, I think 3.0 was the best version made and that came out well after I stopped playing regularly. Cleaned up a lot of unnecessary number crunching and conflicting rules, and made the characters more three dimensional. 4.0 is dumbed down in the extreme, and feel more like a late 90s computer game than D&D.

Haven't you guys ever heard of Pathfinder?!?!

When Hasbro made the travisty that is 4th Edition D&D, a company called Paizo bought the rights to the 3.5 ruleset, and ran with it in the *correct* direction, making a game called Pathfinder.  After, what 5 years now (how long has it been???), Pathfinder is the #1 selling RPG, and D&D is 2nd banana (because, in reality, Pathfinder stayed true to D&D, and D&D became more Yu-gi-oh)

Go to paizo.com and check out Pathfinder.  It's exactly what you old-school gamers are looking for.  Paizo knows how to write stuff, they're a company of gamers.

They also have "Society Play" which is differnet, but also cool.  the Society games at GenCon are incredible.  Last year's GenCon (my third trip) was so much fun.

Hey eh!--meaning no disrespect, but screw you   ;D  my gaming table has over 30 degrees of black belt between the 5 of us, so come on over and try to smack us around.  The game's awesome.  Trying to explain it is like trying to explain Firefly ("it's an outer-space western!").  You can't understand how cool it is unless you experience it, and it may take a try or three before you "get it."
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Offline screwtape

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Re: d&d
« Reply #46 on: May 16, 2014, 10:53:22 AM »
For fuk that's not even a game, its like theatre sports.

Kind of.

this whole concept sux.

No, you're wrong.  It is awesome.
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #47 on: May 16, 2014, 12:46:46 PM »
Actually, I think 3.0 was the best version made and that came out well after I stopped playing regularly. Cleaned up a lot of unnecessary number crunching and conflicting rules, and made the characters more three dimensional. 4.0 is dumbed down in the extreme, and feel more like a late 90s computer game than D&D.

Oh, I absolutely agree about 3.0. As someone who always played a Fighter, the addition of feats was a godsend for a class that, imo, was severely limited in it's options.

What I meant was that AD&D seemed at the time to strike the perfect balance of playability without having to resort to purchasing dozens of "accessory" rule books (as with 3.0 and onward) in order to get the most out of the experience. All you really needed for AD&D was the Player's Handbook, the DMs Guide and the Monster Manual.

Right now, I must own at least fifteen 3.0 and 3.5 non-core rule books. Ah, the days of disposable income.... &)
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #48 on: May 16, 2014, 12:50:46 PM »

Haven't you guys ever heard of Pathfinder?!?!

No, but I am so definitely going to check it out now!

Thanks for this, Boots! :D
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Offline Boots

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Re: d&d
« Reply #49 on: May 16, 2014, 12:58:05 PM »

Haven't you guys ever heard of Pathfinder?!?!

No, but I am so definitely going to check it out now!

Thanks for this, Boots! :D

velkam.  :-)  it's funny you mention the options thing, because Pathfinder took the 3.0/3.5 ideas of options, and combined it with a 2nd edition concept of "kits" to create "archetypes" for all the classes.  You can play a straight-up fighter, for example, or choose a variety of archetypes (2-weapon fighter, pole-arm master, archer, etc)  they did a REALLY good job of balancing things, and of making sure that every (or almost every) level you gain has SOMEthing cool to offer.

Between archetypes, feat selection, traits (sort of "half-powered feats" everyone gets 2 to start play with), and race options, it's pretty damned sweet.
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #50 on: May 16, 2014, 01:04:39 PM »
velkam.  :-)  it's funny you mention the options thing, because Pathfinder took the 3.0/3.5 ideas of options, and combined it with a 2nd edition concept of "kits" to create "archetypes" for all the classes.  You can play a straight-up fighter, for example, or choose a variety of archetypes (2-weapon fighter, pole-arm master, archer, etc)  they did a REALLY good job of balancing things, and of making sure that every (or almost every) level you gain has SOMEthing cool to offer.

Between archetypes, feat selection, traits (sort of "half-powered feats" everyone gets 2 to start play with), and race options, it's pretty damned sweet.

You had me at "it's funny you mention the options thing". ;D

It looks like I'm just going to have to put off paying the utility bills this month... momma's got some shoppin' to do!
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Offline screwtape

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Re: d&d
« Reply #51 on: May 16, 2014, 02:50:22 PM »
Oh, I absolutely agree about 3.0. As someone who always played a Fighter, the addition of feats was a godsend for a class that, imo, was severely limited in it's options.

I'm torn.  On the one hand, it does offer differentiation for fighters with different styles.  But it also begs for a power gaming style, which I don't care for.

I will tell you what I miss from <3.0 editions is weapon speed.  I used to factor that in to initiative on the basis that the light, fast weapons might be able to get two shots in before the big slow ones.  So the lowest scores went first.  And as you went, you'd add 10 to your initiative.  If that was lower than any remaining scores, you would get to go again in numercal order.  So the guy with the dagger might be able to attack the guy with the two handed sword twice.  But not always.

What I meant was that AD&D seemed at the time to strike the perfect balance of playability without having to resort to purchasing dozens of "accessory" rule books

I banned all but the core books in my game.  I was kind of a tyrant.

 
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Offline jdawg70

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Re: d&d
« Reply #52 on: May 16, 2014, 02:54:48 PM »
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."

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Offline Boots

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Re: d&d
« Reply #53 on: May 16, 2014, 03:21:50 PM »
Oh, I absolutely agree about 3.0. As someone who always played a Fighter, the addition of feats was a godsend for a class that, imo, was severely limited in it's options.

I'm torn.  On the one hand, it does offer differentiation for fighters with different styles.  But it also begs for a power gaming style, which I don't care for.

I think you're always going to get that, to some extent.  however, you can build your character based on the concept FIRST, then make it work mechanically.   For example, I wanted to make a fighter who grew up as a street tough, so the weapon he was most familar with is the ubiquitous dagger.  I figured an agile 2-weapon fighter would fit that bill.  And now, at 7th level, I've got a very mechanically viable front-line fighter, who can do a lot of damage using only daggers.  You pay for that, though, because fighters typically aren't good at anything outside the battlefield.


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I will tell you what I miss from <3.0 editions is weapon speed.  I used to factor that in to initiative on the basis that the light, fast weapons might be able to get two shots in before the big slow ones.  So the lowest scores went first.  And as you went, you'd add 10 to your initiative.  If that was lower than any remaining scores, you would get to go again in numercal order.  So the guy with the dagger might be able to attack the guy with the two handed sword twice.  But not always.

I'm of 2 minds about that.  I do find that has a nostalgic charm to it--but it was also an unnecessary bit of complexity.  Whenever you add realism, you necessarily give up simplicity; conversely, in order to gain simplicity you must add abstraction (the hit point system is a perfect example).
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: d&d
« Reply #54 on: May 16, 2014, 09:30:01 PM »


I will tell you what I miss from <3.0 editions is weapon speed.  I used to factor that in to initiative on the basis that the light, fast weapons might be able to get two shots in before the big slow ones.  So the lowest scores went first.  And as you went, you'd add 10 to your initiative.  If that was lower than any remaining scores, you would get to go again in numercal order.  So the guy with the dagger might be able to attack the guy with the two handed sword twice.  But not always.

 

I hated weapons speed factors. I thought it so unneeded. Because a two handed sword had enough reach to balance it versus the dagger...and it slowed down already too long combat rounds.
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Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #55 on: May 16, 2014, 11:23:53 PM »
I'm torn.  On the one hand, it does offer differentiation for fighters with different styles.  But it also begs for a power gaming style, which I don't care for.

I loved it because I was finally able to play a nimble two-weapon Fighter who specialized in movement-based tactics and defensive fighting. Power gaming never even crossed my mind, although we had one player who was a one dimensional two-handed sword wielding tank who only took feats that increased his damage output.

Quote
I will tell you what I miss from <3.0 editions is weapon speed.
Wow, I completely forgot about that. I kinda liked it. It awarded those characters who wanted to try something different than the great sword/battle axe a reason to use lighter weapons.

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I banned all but the core books in my game.  I was kind of a tyrant.

I was the idiot who bought them all. :-[

Boots: I ordered the Pathfinder core rule book at my comic book shop. I should have it by Thursday. :)
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: d&d
« Reply #56 on: May 17, 2014, 09:04:25 PM »

« Last Edit: May 17, 2014, 09:07:49 PM by Hatter23 »
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Disciple of Sagan

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Re: d&d
« Reply #57 on: May 17, 2014, 09:33:42 PM »
The cosmos is also within us. We are made of star stuff.

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