Author Topic: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?  (Read 8363 times)

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Offline Defiance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #319 on: May 16, 2014, 06:15:00 PM »
Hey that's not what yo mama said last night!

Said god to Jesus.

Bada bing.
So now he had sex with with own mom, and is his own dad and son?

Incest overload.
"God is just and fair"
*God kills 2.5 million of people he KNEW would turn out like this in the flood*
*Humanity turns bad again, when God knew it would*
We should feel guilty for this.

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #320 on: May 16, 2014, 06:19:45 PM »
Well..... yes. you got a problem with that, close minded biggot?
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Offline Defiance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #321 on: May 16, 2014, 06:26:38 PM »
Well..... yes. you got a problem with that, close minded biggot?
No, it's ok as long as the person who says not to do something is the one who does it.

"God is just and fair"
*God kills 2.5 million of people he KNEW would turn out like this in the flood*
*Humanity turns bad again, when God knew it would*
We should feel guilty for this.

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #322 on: May 16, 2014, 06:48:06 PM »
Comes with the job.
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Offline Jehovah God

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #323 on: May 16, 2014, 07:11:51 PM »
"Impregnating a virgin in her sleep..... is that even legal?"


If me does it, it is.  You see pal, human laws don't overrule me or mine!  I created you pal, I get to knock up whoever the fuck I wanna!
« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 07:13:42 PM by Jehovah God »

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #324 on: May 16, 2014, 07:41:10 PM »
Not in my state, your holy rapist ass would get arrested. i think you been trying to knock your own hand up too much...not cool.
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #325 on: May 17, 2014, 11:50:11 AM »
I've already given you the process, on at least two occasions (and others have as well) and still you have ignored it. Furthermore, I have responded to your false analogy of "luck" (b/c it cannot be compared to an alleged existing "thing" called "God") and still you persistent in attempting to use it. Why are you so dishonest in your debate tactics?
What!?!? When!? What! Where? ARG I missed it?

Just to be clear and honest (no judgement or insults, please, we have enough of that) What exactly are you expecting from me? Discussion while. What do you want to discuss?
I want you to actually backup your claims that you made earlier with actual demonstrable evidence - not hear-say, not anecdote, not obfuscation, not vague notions which are nowhere near extraordinary, but clear independently verifiable evidence (just like could be done with planetary motion or my bank).


You did not miss it. You ignored it. I also mentioned these things in #68 AND in #98 (and elsewhere) about the kinds of evidence that YOU would accept for a salesman selling an alleged magic potion at the door. Others (such as nogodsforme) mentioned these types of things in similar fashion. You have been obfuscating and ignoring these posts the entire time.

All of this nonsense by you, and we haven't even gotten into what your bible says about you being able to actually demonstrate the miraculous (Mark 16, John 14, Matt 18 & 21).


Oh! You did not gave me the process. You told me what I must do. Even if the proof was already made earlier. You told me to prove that miracle exist without using the testimony of others. Let me enlighten you. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE.
It's like if you wanted me to prove that my mom love me without giving you testimonies.
And the truth is you know it is impossible without using testimonies that's why you never backed up your claims about Luck. You cannot prove that luck exist without testimonies. Stop being stubborn and move on.
You're worth more than my time

Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #326 on: May 17, 2014, 11:52:57 AM »
Lukvance -
This is a thread you started, so I think it's fair to ask:
What has the last few pages of conversation regarding luck have to do with "Why can't/wont god heal amputees?"
Is it time for you to fork this into a new topic or is the conversation eventually going to lead back to the actual topic of your thread?
You are right. I must put a stop on this non sense started by median. I wish we could remove all those posts about luck but I don't think we can.
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #327 on: May 17, 2014, 11:55:04 AM »
The guy just plays back his opponents argument replacing the you and me with me and you.... this is some weird shit.
i don't think luk is playing with a full deck of cards.
Thank you. How does this help the conversation?
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #328 on: May 17, 2014, 12:00:24 PM »
God in the historical documents you follow used to work outward miaracles but as of about 2000 years ago he just stopped doing anything verifiable.
Errr Not true look at post #50 and the following I posted. You will read that miracles are still happening and that they are verified very closely.
What about a "Tubercular peritonitis with complications for seven years, extreme emaciation and oscillating fever. Comatose when brought to Lourdes" person? She was cured. After praying God, not a magic pink unicorns, pixies or lucky leprechauns. God.
Now, I gave you the link to the report of the act. What else would you need?

Edit: I just read about the doctor who examined her : "Any doctors practicing in or visiting Lourdes may apply to become members of the Lourdes Medical Bureau. Additionally, nurses, physiotherapists, pharmacists and members of other allied health professions may apply to become members. Members are given (and invited to wear) a small but distinctive badge displaying a red cross on a white background surmounted by the word Credo ("I believe"). However, members of any religious affiliation or none are welcomed."
The Medical Bureau investigates the claim, by examining the patient, the casenotes, and any test results (which can include biopsies, X-rays, CT scans, blood test results, and so on). A full investigation requires that one of its members investigates every detail of the case in question, and immerses him/herself in the literature around that condition to ensure that up-to-date academic knowledge is applied to the decision. This investigator may also consult with other colleagues about the case.
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Offline Jehovah God

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #329 on: May 17, 2014, 03:12:34 PM »
Not in my state, your holy rapist ass would get arrested. i think you been trying to knock your own hand up too much...not cool.

Oh I'd get arrested?  You and what army punk?  Good luck wrapping those cuffs around my ghostly hands!  They'd just go right through!  As for knocking my sexy hands up, yeah, that's how it rains down there on Earth!

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #330 on: May 17, 2014, 03:37:59 PM »
No army required, a tazer will do it and that gadget from ghost busters.  you are old school remember your scripture you can be defeated by an iron chariot. How you gonna go against a modern tank special ed god.
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Offline median

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #331 on: May 17, 2014, 05:16:54 PM »
I've already given you the process, on at least two occasions (and others have as well) and still you have ignored it. Furthermore, I have responded to your false analogy of "luck" (b/c it cannot be compared to an alleged existing "thing" called "God") and still you persistent in attempting to use it. Why are you so dishonest in your debate tactics?
What!?!? When!? What! Where? ARG I missed it?

Just to be clear and honest (no judgement or insults, please, we have enough of that) What exactly are you expecting from me? Discussion while. What do you want to discuss?
I want you to actually backup your claims that you made earlier with actual demonstrable evidence - not hear-say, not anecdote, not obfuscation, not vague notions which are nowhere near extraordinary, but clear independently verifiable evidence (just like could be done with planetary motion or my bank).


You did not miss it. You ignored it. I also mentioned these things in #68 AND in #98 (and elsewhere) about the kinds of evidence that YOU would accept for a salesman selling an alleged magic potion at the door. Others (such as nogodsforme) mentioned these types of things in similar fashion. You have been obfuscating and ignoring these posts the entire time.

All of this nonsense by you, and we haven't even gotten into what your bible says about you being able to actually demonstrate the miraculous (Mark 16, John 14, Matt 18 & 21).


Oh! You did not gave me the process. You told me what I must do. Even if the proof was already made earlier. You told me to prove that miracle exist without using the testimony of others. Let me enlighten you. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE.
It's like if you wanted me to prove that my mom love me without giving you testimonies.
And the truth is you know it is impossible without using testimonies that's why you never backed up your claims about Luck. You cannot prove that luck exist without testimonies. Stop being stubborn and move on.

I've already told you that I reject others assertions about "luck" existing, just like I reject your assertion about miracles. So it sounds like all you have are CLAIMS about miracles, and nothing more, right? And you are practicing a double-standard because you are hypocritically taking someone else's word for it only when it pertains to your assumed theology and none other. That is the very pinnacle of intellectual dishonesty.

Just because someone SAYS a miracle occurred, doesn't make it true. Stop acting like you don't know this. False, mistaken, and inaccurate claims are extremely common among human beings (such as when people used to claim that Zeus made the lightening or that Mohammad rode to heaven on a winged horse). Why are you setting the bar so low for claims to the supernatural (with your assumed theology) but not applying the same low standard with other claims to the supernatural that contradict yours?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #332 on: May 17, 2014, 05:38:07 PM »
Oh! You did not gave me the process. You told me what I must do. Even if the proof was already made earlier. You told me to prove that miracle exist without using the testimony of others. Let me enlighten you. IT'S IMPOSSIBLE.
It's like if you wanted me to prove that my mom love me without giving you testimonies.
And the truth is you know it is impossible without using testimonies that's why you never backed up your claims about Luck. You cannot prove that luck exist without testimonies. Stop being stubborn and move on.


I've already told you that I reject others assertions about "luck" existing, just like I reject your assertion about miracles. So it sounds like all you have are CLAIMS about miracles, and nothing more, right? And you are practicing a double-standard because you are hypocritically taking someone else's word for it only when it pertains to your assumed theology and none other. That is the very pinnacle of intellectual dishonesty.

Just because someone SAYS a miracle occurred, doesn't make it true. Stop acting like you don't know this. False, mistaken, and inaccurate claims are extremely common among human beings (such as when people used to claim that Zeus made the lightening or that Mohammad rode to heaven on a winged horse). Why are you setting the bar so low for claims to the supernatural (with your assumed theology) but not applying the same low standard with other claims to the supernatural that contradict yours?
My mother loves me. She told me so. I don't need more proof I trust her.
I've met that girl, she had cancer in terminal phase. She was cured when the doctors couldn't cure her. She told me it was because of God. I believe her, I don't need more proof. I had a one on one meeting with God, I experienced a miracle. I don't need more proof. Stop being stubborn and Move on!
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #333 on: May 17, 2014, 06:11:45 PM »
Well..... yes. you got a problem with that, close minded biggot?
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #334 on: May 17, 2014, 06:15:29 PM »
Its clear to me that there is no further point in my engaging with you:
I look forward to such a debate. (World class response.
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Offline median

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #335 on: May 17, 2014, 06:15:56 PM »

My mother loves me. She told me so. I don't need more proof I trust her.
I've met that girl, she had cancer in terminal phase. She was cured when the doctors couldn't cure her. She told me it was because of God. I believe her, I don't need more proof. I had a one on one meeting with God, I experienced a miracle. I don't need more proof. Stop being stubborn and Move on!

That is called anecdote. Someone was sick with cancer and they got better. That is all the information you have. But you went beyond that by merely assuming (just like the girl did) what the cause of the cancer remission was. Except you do this dishonestly because you wouldn't believe that another persons religion (which contradicts yours) was actually true if they made a similar claim about their god healing them.

Once again, you are practicing a double-standard.

Pertaining love, your mother did not just tell you. She likely gave you lots of demonstrable and independently verifiable evidence of her feelings of care toward you. So you are drawing another false analogy.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #336 on: May 17, 2014, 06:42:36 PM »

My mother loves me. She told me so. I don't need more proof I trust her.
I've met that girl, she had cancer in terminal phase. She was cured when the doctors couldn't cure her. She told me it was because of God. I believe her, I don't need more proof. I had a one on one meeting with God, I experienced a miracle. I don't need more proof. Stop being stubborn and Move on!
That is called anecdote. Someone was sick with cancer and they got better. That is all the information you have.
No no no. Someone was sick with cancer, doctors couldn't do anything to cure her, she prayed GOD and then got better. That's the information I have.

Quote
Pertaining love, your mother did not just tell you. She likely gave you lots of demonstrable and independently verifiable evidence of her feelings of care toward you. So you are drawing another false analogy.
No no no the "demonstrable and independently verifiable evidence" are just hearsay according to your standarts. She (or me) is lying! And you weren't there when she told me she loved me. You don't know what happen before! I told you she told me and I believed her I didn't need more proof!
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you are practicing a double-standard.[...]you do this dishonestly
Really!? You really know me better than myself then. What a gift (and a curse) you must have.
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Offline median

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #337 on: May 17, 2014, 06:56:57 PM »
No no no. Someone was sick with cancer, doctors couldn't do anything to cure her, she prayed GOD and then got better. That's the information I have.

Correlation does not equal causation. You should know that.

No no no the "demonstrable and independently verifiable evidence" are just hearsay according to your standarts. She (or me) is lying! And you weren't there when she told me she loved me. You don't know what happen before! I told you she told me and I believed her I didn't need more proof!

NOPE. We do not just take people's word for it without actual evidence in such cases. You need to actually compare apples to apples. So stop with these false analogies. If the ONLY information you have from someone is that they SAY, "I love you", do you believe them? With your mother, there is demonstrable evidence that can be shown over a course of time that displays the concept of caring (i.e. - love), but you do not have that with an alleged miracle, or deity etc.

The second reason this is a false analogy (another logical fallacy) is that you are once again attempting to compare supernatural claims to natural ones - as if someone saying so is equally valid in ALL cases - when it's not. You really need to study logic and get up to speed here.

Quote
you are practicing a double-standard.[...]you do this dishonestly
Really!? You really know me better than myself then. What a gift (and a curse) you must have.

Answer the question honestly: Do you believe (as true and actual) the claims of all supernatural or extraordinary claims that you hear on the basis of hear-say alone?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #338 on: May 17, 2014, 07:08:05 PM »
No no no the "demonstrable and independently verifiable evidence" are just hearsay according to your standarts. She (or me) is lying! And you weren't there when she told me she loved me. You don't know what happen before! I told you she told me and I believed her I didn't need more proof!
NOPE. We do not just take people's word for it without actual evidence in such cases. You need to actually compare apples to apples. So stop with these false analogies. If the ONLY information you have from someone is that they SAY, "I love you", do you believe them? With your mother, there is demonstrable evidence that can be shown over a course of time that displays the concept of caring (i.e. - love), but you do not have that with an alleged miracle, or deity etc.
Yes I do have demonstrable evidence. The cancer was there and now its not. Doctors I trust can verify that the cancer is not there anymore.

Quote
The second reason this is a false analogy (another logical fallacy) is that you are once again attempting to compare supernatural claims to natural ones - as if someone saying so is equally valid in ALL cases - when it's not. You really need to study logic and get up to speed here.

Whose the illogical one. I used more than one example. Stop being stubborn and move on.

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Answer the question honestly: Do you believe (as true and actual) the claims of all supernatural or extraordinary claims that you hear on the basis of hear-say alone?
Yes, as long as they don't impact me.
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Offline Jehovah God

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #339 on: May 17, 2014, 07:28:38 PM »
No army required, a tazer will do it and that gadget from ghost busters.  you are old school remember your scripture you can be defeated by an iron chariot. How you gonna go against a modern tank special ed god.

Zap! Awww your tazer is done gone before you could fire!!  (I'm all knowing and this confrontation will be happening December 4, 2029), and it's landed in your eye! ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #340 on: May 17, 2014, 08:31:39 PM »
How come yr so scared of iron chariots and bronze age technology that could build a structure to reach heaven and let goat herders in to kick yr ass.


its in yr book.



don't sound very tough to me.  you sound more like a whiney bitch.
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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #341 on: May 17, 2014, 09:42:53 PM »
Jehovah God lukvance just smitted you, check yr darwins
.... isn't that blashemy? what are you gonna do about it?
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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #342 on: May 17, 2014, 11:14:42 PM »
How come yr so scared of iron chariots and bronze age technology that could build a structure to reach heaven and let goat herders in to kick yr ass.


its in yr book.



don't sound very tough to me.  you sound more like a whiney bitch.


It's very simple!  I lied about being scared of iron chariots!  Me being scared, and not to mention Jesus being abused on a cross is a verrrry good tool of manipulation to get people to kiss my feet and ignore the game that I'm playing, the fact that I created everyone to sin, the fact that Satan is my partner in crime...ohhhh my believers, they'll fall for anything as long as I got them under my control.  I've also got it fixed to where I'll betray them and Satan and send them all into Hell.  Ain't I a genius or what?????

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #343 on: May 17, 2014, 11:47:59 PM »
^ I can respect that, still think you are. a whiney bitch with no friends tho.
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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #344 on: May 17, 2014, 11:55:38 PM »
Yo luk i get you don't get much but it goes like this,


A someone has cancer

B same someone cancer goes into remission

C someone else prayed gor cancer to heal.


unless C can be repeated under controlled conditions in a double blind series of trials for a large population of cancer sufferers. and the results analysed by an independent and qualified team then you don't have proof you only have........try finishing the sentence.
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Offline Lukvance

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #345 on: May 18, 2014, 12:00:07 AM »
Yo luk i get you don't get much but it goes like this,
A someone has cancer
B same someone cancer goes into remission
C someone else prayed gor cancer to heal.
unless C can be repeated under controlled conditions in a double blind series of trials for a large population of cancer sufferers. and the results analysed by an independent and qualified team then you don't have proof you only have........try finishing the sentence.
Proof for what? Isn't the research you describe, to determine if prayer cures cancer?
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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #346 on: May 18, 2014, 12:22:40 AM »
Proof that determines your friends recovery was due to prayer or just a coincidence..  a black cat could have shat on a mat the same night your friend was cured.  there is no way in your world of superstition to determine if the recovery was due to the cat shatting on the mat, prayer or a zillion other events ....is there luk.


And 1000 other cases of cancer going into remission with or without prayer still would not prove a miracle.


lets set up a double blind test to see if you can change something with prayer.


Curious do you believe in a literal interpretation of the bible?

« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 12:27:43 AM by eh! »
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Offline median

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Re: Why can't/wont god heal amputees?
« Reply #347 on: May 18, 2014, 12:24:35 AM »

Yes I do have demonstrable evidence. The cancer was there and now its not. Doctors I trust can verify that the cancer is not there anymore.

You must not read my posts very carefully. I asked you for demonstrable evidence of the "God" causing the cancer to go away, not of the cancer going away. If I wake up in the morning and my car is missing I could say Santa Claus stole it, but there would need to be actual demonstrable evidence of such a claim. That is what you need to present.


Quote
Answer the question honestly: Do you believe (as true and actual) the claims of all supernatural or extraordinary claims that you hear on the basis of hear-say alone?
Yes, as long as they don't impact me.

That's not what I asked you. I asked you if you actually believe all claims to the supernatural by anyone with beliefs which contradict your own. Whether such claims effect you or not is entirely irrelevant to the question.

Secondly, and I said this before, belief is not a choice. You cannot will yourself to actually believe that a pink flying elephant is in your room right now. You can say you believe it, but that would not be genuine belief. In order to actually believe something one must be convinced by some means, either by sound reasons or unsound reasons.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 12:31:10 AM by median »
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan