No, it doesn't tell me because they are not equal. Jesus is not a pay-day loan company, rather, he is closer to a protection racket. Your "debt" to Jesus isn't monetary, unless you are of the type who likes to put his hand on the screen and pick up the phone for a FedEx "miracle". So what is it that you are going to specifically do to prove to him that his "suffering" wasn't in vain, because as far as I can see, all you have to do is accept that he did it for you so you don't have to. Like you will live the rest of your life trying to repay the debt you have to your father who suffered on the pavement to save your life. I will live the rest of my life trying to repay my debt to Jesus who suffered on the cross to save me. One of the things I do is follow his teachings, do things I know he will like me to do for him. Like "Above all, keep loving one another earnestly, since love covers a multitude of sin" 1 Peter 4:8
Do you have to do exactly the the same thing your father did to repay your debt? In the case of suffering to save your life, do you have also to wait for a car to almost run unto him to repay him?
I think we need to keep on track about which hypotheticals we are using in each scenario. Here, I have simply been discussing my parents paying a monetary debt for me, not
as below, where you drew up the idea of my dad throwing himself into traffic. So, in the case of paying them back, yes I am doing exactly the same, unless, as I said before, they decide to charge me interest.
As for what I have bolded, why do you need to follow this teaching? I certainly don't need to follow this as I instintively worked it out for myself (minus the bit about sin). How come you need to be told?
They can't both be correct. Yes, they can.
If only life was this simple and things could be rebutted so readily without so much as a by your leave. Please, expand on how these mutually exclusive positions can co-exist together.
To repeat, my dad in this ludicrous, unrealistic hypothetical scenario, isn't expecting to come back to life 3 days later. Jesus, however, is. Infact he knows he is. They are not analogous.... and can never be analogous because god and his Jesus avatar can not make a sacrifice.Is the fact that your father knows that he would resuscitate 3 days after make his suffering less meaningful?
Let's even say that he won't resuscitate let's say he just get hit by the car and break his leg, puncture his lung, break some ribs but will survive.
Like your father suffered on the pavement before going to the hospital. Jesus suffered under the cross before dying.
I admit that the concept of suffering flew past me in my last response..... not that it makes much of a difference, because the suffering is part of the sacrifice. I don't know how many times I can say that these scenarios are not comparable. Jesus has a monumental advantage over my dad, that being he is all powerful. I know, I've heard this shit before, "Jesus chose
to suffer even when he could stop himself suffering". Then he's an idiot. No-one, nowhere, would prolong their own suffering if they could stop it yet continue to help others........ not that I think Jesus is even helping others - he's forcing you to make a do or die decision about your eternal existence, akin to a mafia boss. The "suffering", the "sacrifice" is the, "Awww look at the poor Jesus putting himself up for such torment for me", to rope you in. It's a fucking con, because the reason he is doing it is to be able to forgive. He is warped. He is disturbed. I, and I dare say you, would just forgive and not have to "self harm" in order to persuade ourselves to forgive.
Your father already saved you from death (by pushing you out of the way). Jesus already saved you from your sins (by taking the cross for you).
I have no reason to believe sin exists, a concept made up to try justify why the christian god has psychotic tendencies by projecting his own self made problems onto others and then blaming them for it.
You can ignore the fact that your father saved your life (for example by saying "I didn't need him! I was fine! plenty of time!") and still have your life "saved". You can ignore the fact that Jesus took the cross and still have your sins forgiven.
My dad, in this silly scenario, I wouldn't ignore. Jesus on the other hand, I can and do ignore because he is a monumental nutjob who feels I should be grateful that he can forgive me for a problem he created because he allowed himself to sleep for 3 days.
But, if you want to repay your debt (and I hope you do) to your father's sacrifice (witch is here whether you want it or not) you will have to accept his sacrifice. If you want to repay your debt to Jesus, you'll have to accept his sacrifice.
Really, you don't need to keep up with the dad analogy because it doesn't work.
Also, you're getting preachy. Please stop it. I don't owe Jesus/god anything because 1) I have no reason to believe god exists, and 2) even if I did believe this god existed his problem with humanity is all of his own making and he should take a long look in the mirror at how he totally fucked up his creation.......time and time again.
Why would you have a debt if you don't accept your father's sacrifice?
As I've shown, this is irrelevant.