Author Topic: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge  (Read 19264 times)

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Offline Benny

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #261 on: March 06, 2014, 01:38:18 AM »
You would be a false prophet for claiming that. Bible contradicts you.
When God is on this Earth, trust me, everyone will know.

A false prophet?  How?  In the All In One Guide To Worship, OAA says, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Forum except through me."[1]  He also says, "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves."[2]

You say that the Bible contradicts me, but the All In One Guide To Worship contradicts YOU.  Furthermore, you say that "When God is on this earth, trust me, everyone will know."  But how do we know he'll ever be on this earth?  OAA is ON THIS EARTH.  He posts on this very forum.  We know He exists, and I have a strong inner conviction that He is the King of kings.  We've never seen God.  We've seen OAA.  We have proof that He exists.  So I think believing that Blaziken Incarnate is my savoir is a lot more rational than believing in your deity of choice.

(Note to OAA: I think I'm going to capitalize Your pronouns from now on.  Because You're a good guy.)
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Online Aaron123

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #262 on: March 06, 2014, 02:08:18 AM »
With ten pages right now, I've undoubtedly lost track of certain things said in this thread, so I wonder if someone could clarify a few things.

First, on the opening "atheist is a belief" statement, has skeptic54768 ever given a clear-cut explanation of what definition of the word "belief" he is using?  I know I tried asking him before but I don't think I got a clear-cut answer out of him (and had to prod a little just to get him to comment at all on this).

Second, does this whole "non-belief belief" thing applies only to gods, or does it works on anything I have a non-belief on?  For example, I do not believe that toothpaste can sing.  Does this mean I have a non-belief belief about singing toothpaste?  After all, you cannot prove that toothpaste do not sing.
Being a Christian, I've made my decision. That decision offers no compromise; therefore, I'm closed to anything else.

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #263 on: March 06, 2014, 02:12:29 AM »
Second, does this whole "non-belief belief" thing applies only to gods, or does it works on anything I have a non-belief on?  For example, I do not believe that toothpaste can sing.  Does this mean I have a non-belief belief about singing toothpaste?  After all, you cannot prove that toothpaste do not sing.

I tried to get an answer out of him with my "Prove Benny can't fly" remarks, which he hasn't answered.
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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #264 on: March 06, 2014, 04:09:38 AM »
You would be a false prophet for claiming that. Bible contradicts you.
When God is on this Earth, trust me, everyone will know.

They will only know if I want them to.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
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Offline Antidote

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #265 on: March 06, 2014, 04:23:07 AM »
And the Bible says the Earth is fixed in space, as well as being a circle (flat). It also says the sky - sorry, firmament - is a tent spread across the Earth. Did I mention it says the Earth is flat?

It is fixed in orbit. Way ahead of when scientists discovered this.

The earth's orbit actually isn't constant, it fluctuates slightly from year to year.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milankovitch_cycles

It's spin on it's axis also isn't constant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluctuations_in_the_length_of_day

Explain to me how the bible confirmed something before science confirmed it, when science actually debunks it?
« Last Edit: March 06, 2014, 04:26:31 AM by Antidote »
According to Cpt. Obvious: Theists think they know God, Atheists require evidence.

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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #266 on: March 06, 2014, 04:29:16 AM »
So yeah, prove that leprechauns do not exist, then we will be going somewhere.
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Offline Graybeard

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #267 on: March 06, 2014, 06:40:29 AM »
No, there are no problems. God is not responsible for evil.
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

Exodus 4:11 And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the LORD?

Once again, you are simply quoting verses out of context. I have repeatedly said that you can't do that with the Bible. Everything must be analyzed within the full context of the chapter, to possibly even the whole book.
OK, off you go... you tell us who created Satan and the meaning of the above verses.
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #268 on: March 06, 2014, 07:37:36 AM »
Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
If this can't be done, then atheism is a belief.
This is your first mistake. You have confused the word “belief” = a faith in a deity with “belief” = that which is strongly probable by virtue of evidence.

Quote
A lot of atheists falsely think that atheism just means "without belief” but it actually means, "No God."
This is your second mistake. The “a-“ prefix mean “without – totally lacking in”: we see it in such words as “amoral” “apart” “agnostic” and “abandon” etc.

Quote
Atheism is a positive claim that God does not exist.
This is your third mistake: it is, in fact, the equivalent of saying, “I do not believe your claim that there are gods." And here “believe” is based upon ““belief” = that which is strongly probable by virtue of evidence.”

Quote
Agnosticism is the view where they don't have an opinion either way.
Your fourth mistake. It is not that Agnostics do not have a view either way that gives rise to “agnostic” – the word is pretty self-explanatory: a- = without, Gnostic = a revelation. They are in a position where a god has not revealed themselves to them. The stand, as it were, awaiting something that may never come. They may hope for that revelation or hope that there will not be that revelation: it simply has not arrived.

Quote
Sure, some atheists like to say, "Atheism just means that we lack belief in God" but this is an attempt by modern atheists to redefine the word. The word NEVER meant that. The word always meant "No God."
Persisting in a mistake will not make it true.

Quote
I even heard some of them say, "Atheism means that we don't think there is enough evidence for God." But, this backfires too because there ARE theists out there who agree with this statement, but believe in God anyway. So, this definition gets thrown out the window too.
This is simply illogical and basically meaningless. You have created an erroneous argument, and then you have destroyed your own argument, and dance around as if that proved something – it doesn’t.

Quote
The proper meaning of "lacking belief in God"
Ah, you see – you have realised that you were wrong earlier and are now changing your definition to the one I suggested to you above.

Quote
means that you believe God is there, but you don't believe in Him.
And then you make your fifth mistake. Again you confuse the two meanings of “belief”. It would be better for you and us if you were to use “faith” to indicate a belief without evidence and “belief” that which is strongly probable by virtue of evidence.


Quote
Sort of like having a friend who betrays your trust and you lose your faith in him.
Ah, good – you start to decide that there are two meanings to the word belief, but then step back into the same erroneous path of failing to distinguish between faith in your friend and faith in a god.

This will probably go above your head but your example of “faith” in a friend has a nuance of “faith in his trustworthiness that had been previously evidenced.” Whereas, “faith” in a god has never had any evidence.

Quote
The friend still exists, but you lose your belief in your friend. So, this is why "lacking belief" backfires and actually means you DO think God is real, you just lost faith in Him.
Yet still you fail to see the difference between the two definitions of faith…

Quote
So, that leaves atheism as meaning "No God" which is a positive claim. So, any atheists out there want to defend their positive claim of "No God?"
Your question comes across as stupid. It is objectionable because you have a tone that says: “Look at me – I have already defeated you.” And yet, the whole thing comes across in a way that validates the wonderful quote:

"Debating Christians on the topic of gods is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon; it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory."

I do not wish to be insulting, but one of the distinguishing feature of the religious is that they are poorly represented in the ranks of those who are above average intelligence. We see the hysterical, fundamentalist tribesmen that comprise the Taliban; those Pentecostals who handle snakes and get bitten and the YECs and creationists. These are the people who wallow in ignorance as their education has not equipped them for the modern world and they wish to change it back to the 14th century.

Please note, I am not saying that all Christians are thick, just that they seem to be over-represented in that demographic. I am afraid you facile arguments above have not helped alter that perception.

If you wish to debate anyone, including me, I suggest that you formulate your argument a little more logically.

I doubt that you can.

Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #269 on: March 06, 2014, 09:25:34 AM »
Once again, you are simply quoting verses out of context. I have repeatedly said that you can't do that with the Bible. Everything must be analyzed within the full context of the chapter, to possibly even the whole book.

Absolutely terrible, lazy post.  Just claiming "CONTEXT FOUL!" doesn't cut it.  explain what the context is in each case and why it makes his quotes not relevant to the point he was making.  Otherwise, you are just wasting space on the database.
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #270 on: March 06, 2014, 09:54:08 AM »
So yeah, prove that leprechauns do not exist, then we will be going somewhere.

And there is the ever present god of the gaps really means god of the bible equivocation crap....again and again and again.

BTW I was thinking of the sketch your sig talks about in the thrift store the other day when I saw part of a worn old 60's bar set decorated with pictures of greek philosophers. Too bad it was quite incomplete and in rough shape.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #271 on: March 06, 2014, 10:13:15 AM »
BTW I was thinking of the sketch your sig talks about in the thrift store the other day when I saw part of a worn old 60's bar set decorated with pictures of greek philosophers. Too bad it was quite incomplete and in rough shape.
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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #272 on: March 06, 2014, 10:30:03 AM »
BTW I was thinking of the sketch your sig talks about in the thrift store the other day when I saw part of a worn old 60's bar set decorated with pictures of greek philosophers. Too bad it was quite incomplete and in rough shape.
Are you a poofta?

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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #273 on: March 06, 2014, 11:30:29 AM »
No, there are no problems. God is not responsible for evil.
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

Exodus 4:11 And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the LORD?

Once again, you are simply quoting verses out of context. I have repeatedly said that you can't do that with the Bible. Everything must be analyzed within the full context of the chapter, to possibly even the whole book.
OK, off you go... you tell us who created Satan and the meaning of the above verses.

Here is a page that was already explained by William Lane Craig:

http://carm.org/does-god-create-evil
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Offline Foxy Freedom

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #274 on: March 06, 2014, 11:38:08 AM »
The entire point is that you can't even prove that the tooth fairy does not exist. Thus, there is still a probability of existence to label to it. To flat out state, "X does not exist" is showing a closed mind.

A truly open-minded honest person keeps the possibility open.

I think he missed my post on page 1, number 7.

He has not realised that he answers the statement - prove there is no god - in exactly the same way as atheists do. He agrees entirely with atheists on this matter that there are no real gods, with the one minor exception he has made for Yahweh. He accuses atheists of not keeping the possibility open, but he is doing the same.

I doubt that he can see why this kind of negative statement is useless for practical purposes of proof.

The reason I said "this kind" of negative statement is because negative statements can be proved in special circumstances when all possibilities can be defined. The proper way to state the purpose of this thread is to say " prove there are no gods which are claimed to exist".

An easy way to show that he is making the same assumptions as atheists is to say
"prove there are no gods (or demons) using Yahweh as a (literary) avatar".
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Offline jdawg70

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #275 on: March 06, 2014, 11:41:48 AM »
Here is a page that was already explained by William Lane Craig:

http://carm.org/does-god-create-evil

You know, for someone who keeps purporting how simple and obvious the biblical text is, you sure lean on a whole lot of 3rd party interpretations of it.  Sorta the same way the Catholic laity approach the bible.
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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #276 on: March 06, 2014, 12:11:36 PM »
No, there are no problems. God is not responsible for evil.
Isaiah 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Amos 3:6 Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the LORD hath not done it?

Exodus 4:11 And the LORD said unto him, Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? have not I the LORD?

Once again, you are simply quoting verses out of context. I have repeatedly said that you can't do that with the Bible. Everything must be analyzed within the full context of the chapter, to possibly even the whole book.
OK, off you go... you tell us who created Satan and the meaning of the above verses.

Here is a page that was already explained by William Lane Craig:

http://carm.org/does-god-create-evil
Sorry it doesn't mention the devil, try again.
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Offline Benny

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #277 on: March 06, 2014, 12:16:07 PM »
Here is a page that was already explained by William Lane Craig:

http://carm.org/does-god-create-evil
Could you speak for yourself for once?  For someone who prides himself on being a skeptic, you really haven't put together your own opinions on this.  You just link to a WLC post without any context to back it up.  I don't care what Craig says, I care what you have to say.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #278 on: March 06, 2014, 12:17:44 PM »
Sorry it doesn't mention the devil, try again.

I am in shock that you guys don't know a basic Bible story.

God created Satan but Satan rebelled out of his own free will. When you allow free will, you allow the possibility of people doing things that you don't like.

If your son/daughter gets a DWI, do you blame yourself for bringing the child into the world? Or do you blame your son/daughter for his/her own decision to drive drunk?
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #279 on: March 06, 2014, 12:18:59 PM »
Here is a page that was already explained by William Lane Craig:

http://carm.org/does-god-create-evil
Could you speak for yourself for once?  For someone who prides himself on being a skeptic, you really haven't put together your own opinions on this.  You just link to a WLC post without any context to back it up.  I don't care what Craig says, I care what you have to say.

This puts us in circles then. "I don't care what Dawkins says about evolution, I wanna know what YOU say."

Would that be fair?
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Offline jdawg70

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #280 on: March 06, 2014, 12:26:03 PM »
I am in shock that you guys don't know a basic Bible story.

God created Satan but Satan rebelled out of his own free will. When you allow free will, you allow the possibility of people doing things that you don't like.

So how does that jive with:
Yes. But, everyone will choose the good. The ones who choose the evil will be in Hell. Picture Alcatraz times 1,000.

Because - very clearly - you have just given an example of someone who was in heaven that decided to not choose the good.

Quote
If your son/daughter gets a DWI, do you blame yourself for bringing the child into the world? Or do you blame your son/daughter for his/her own decision to drive drunk?

Depends - did I completely neglect any involvement in his/her life?  If that is the case, I probably should share some of that responsibility.  After all, part of the reason s/he is making poor life choices is because I did jack sh*t to help him/her grow and learn to be a responsible adult.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #281 on: March 06, 2014, 12:30:37 PM »
I am in shock that you guys don't know a basic Bible story.

God created Satan but Satan rebelled out of his own free will. When you allow free will, you allow the possibility of people doing things that you don't like.

So how does that jive with:
Yes. But, everyone will choose the good. The ones who choose the evil will be in Hell. Picture Alcatraz times 1,000.

Because - very clearly - you have just given an example of someone who was in heaven that decided to not choose the good.

Quote
If your son/daughter gets a DWI, do you blame yourself for bringing the child into the world? Or do you blame your son/daughter for his/her own decision to drive drunk?

Depends - did I completely neglect any involvement in his/her life?  If that is the case, I probably should share some of that responsibility.  After all, part of the reason s/he is making poor life choices is because I did jack sh*t to help him/her grow and learn to be a responsible adult.

Not necessarily. I have been around the block in my time on Earth and I have seen friends who grew up in nice stable families who got DWI's. I know a few people who got more than one, but this was about 10-15 years ago. Their parents were in tears.

And on the flipside, I have also known people who got thrown out of their house at 18 because they refused to get a job. Their parents washed their hands of them and said, "Have a nice life."

I will never forget one time I had a good friend who got a DWI and he told me to meet him at his house because he wanted me there when he told his parents. He thought it would soften the blow. It was around 2 AM. So I met him at his house and we went inside and he walked into his parents room and turned on the light and said, "i got another DWI." His dad jumped out of bed and screamed, "How could you be so fucking stupid?!?! ANOTHER ONE?!?!?!" and he threw a lamp against the wall and it shattered and he said, "tell your friend to get the fuck out of this house, we have to have a long talk."

That was a scary moment.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2014, 12:36:22 PM by skeptic54768 »
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline junebug72

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #282 on: March 06, 2014, 12:41:50 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #283 on: March 06, 2014, 12:44:16 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

It makes no sense to say, "I don't believe you when you say that God is real, but I'm not claiming God doesn't exist." That just seems like semantic word games.

If you don't believe that God is real, then you obviously think God is not real. Otherwise, atheists would be praying to God because they don't claim God doesn't exist, right? If they don't pray, they are admitting that they think there is no God.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2014, 12:48:50 PM by skeptic54768 »
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #284 on: March 06, 2014, 12:49:09 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

Yet, for the most part,  we don't live our lives on certainties. We live lives based on probabilities. Whether it is quantum physics or catching a train we use probability. If you live in the UK then the chances of the train arriving aren't that good! So then we get to this figure called god. Now, despite all the stories written about thousands of gods we have nothing by way of useful evidence to use to determine if there is a god or not. Usually, we don't start to accept anything without evidence (or you can send me $5,000 to help me send you the $2,000,000 that is sitting in the Nigerian bank!). no evidence means no belief until something turns up to show it is right. I'm not holding my breath.
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #285 on: March 06, 2014, 12:59:40 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

Yet, for the most part,  we don't live our lives on certainties. We live lives based on probabilities. Whether it is quantum physics or catching a train we use probability. If you live in the UK then the chances of the train arriving aren't that good! So then we get to this figure called god. Now, despite all the stories written about thousands of gods we have nothing by way of useful evidence to use to determine if there is a god or not. Usually, we don't start to accept anything without evidence (or you can send me $5,000 to help me send you the $2,000,000 that is sitting in the Nigerian bank!). no evidence means no belief until something turns up to show it is right. I'm not holding my breath.

But there is proof for God. Such as the proof of one of my friend's needing 1,200 dollars or else they would get evicted and someone showed up on their doorstep with a 1,200 dollar check saying, "A voice told me you needed this" even though they never told anyone the exact amount they needed.

If that's not proof, then nothing will ever convince you guys.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline junebug72

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #286 on: March 06, 2014, 01:11:18 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

It makes no sense to say, "I don't believe you when you say that God is real, but I'm not claiming God doesn't exist." That just seems like semantic word games.

If you don't believe that God is real, then you obviously think God is not real. Otherwise, atheists would be praying to God because they don't claim God doesn't exist, right? If they don't pray, they are admitting that they think there is no God.

Skeptic I just don't understand what you've prove "IF" you prove atheism is a belief in non belief.

Sincerely,

JB
Belief in a cruel God makes a cruel man.
Thomas Paine

Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/t/thomas_paine.html#XXwlhVIMq06zWg2d.99

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #287 on: March 06, 2014, 01:16:15 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

Yet, for the most part,  we don't live our lives on certainties. We live lives based on probabilities. Whether it is quantum physics or catching a train we use probability. If you live in the UK then the chances of the train arriving aren't that good! So then we get to this figure called god. Now, despite all the stories written about thousands of gods we have nothing by way of useful evidence to use to determine if there is a god or not. Usually, we don't start to accept anything without evidence (or you can send me $5,000 to help me send you the $2,000,000 that is sitting in the Nigerian bank!). no evidence means no belief until something turns up to show it is right. I'm not holding my breath.

But there is proof for God. Such as the proof of one of my friend's needing 1,200 dollars or else they would get evicted and someone showed up on their doorstep with a 1,200 dollar check saying, "A voice told me you needed this" even though they never told anyone the exact amount they needed.

If that's not proof, then nothing will ever convince you guys.

You might have just proved something ......telephones.

"prove there are no gods (or demons) who use Yahweh as a (literary) avatar".
Neither Foxy Freedom nor any associates can be reached via WWGHA. Their official antitheist website is http://the6antitheist6guide6.blogspot.co.uk

The 2nd edition of the free ebook Devil or Delusion ? The danger of Christianity to Democracy Freedom and Science.       http://t.co/2d1KcJ9V

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #288 on: March 06, 2014, 01:17:27 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

Yet, for the most part,  we don't live our lives on certainties. We live lives based on probabilities. Whether it is quantum physics or catching a train we use probability. If you live in the UK then the chances of the train arriving aren't that good! So then we get to this figure called god. Now, despite all the stories written about thousands of gods we have nothing by way of useful evidence to use to determine if there is a god or not. Usually, we don't start to accept anything without evidence (or you can send me $5,000 to help me send you the $2,000,000 that is sitting in the Nigerian bank!). no evidence means no belief until something turns up to show it is right. I'm not holding my breath.

But there is proof for God. Such as the proof of one of my friend's needing 1,200 dollars or else they would get evicted and someone showed up on their doorstep with a 1,200 dollar check saying, "A voice told me you needed this" even though they never told anyone the exact amount they needed.

If that's not proof, then nothing will ever convince you guys.

You might have just proved something ......telephones.

"prove there are no gods (or demons) who use Yahweh as a (literary) avatar".


I just said that they never told anyone how much they needed. Plus, the person wasn't even a friend. It was just some random person that appeared on their doorstep.

Why ignore the facts of the story?
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Foxy Freedom

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Re: Prove There Is No God - A Challenge
« Reply #289 on: March 06, 2014, 01:20:54 PM »
Skeptic,

I think you confuse religion with reality.  I only say this because I care. 

You can not prove that God does not exist if you can not prove that God does.  I think I understand your point though.  You're saying very elaborately that atheism is not absolute knowledge. 

Peace,

JB

Yes, even Carl Sagan, an atheistic hero said, "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence."

Nobody can ever be 100% sure that God does not exist.

Yet, for the most part,  we don't live our lives on certainties. We live lives based on probabilities. Whether it is quantum physics or catching a train we use probability. If you live in the UK then the chances of the train arriving aren't that good! So then we get to this figure called god. Now, despite all the stories written about thousands of gods we have nothing by way of useful evidence to use to determine if there is a god or not. Usually, we don't start to accept anything without evidence (or you can send me $5,000 to help me send you the $2,000,000 that is sitting in the Nigerian bank!). no evidence means no belief until something turns up to show it is right. I'm not holding my breath.

But there is proof for God. Such as the proof of one of my friend's needing 1,200 dollars or else they would get evicted and someone showed up on their doorstep with a 1,200 dollar check saying, "A voice told me you needed this" even though they never told anyone the exact amount they needed.

If that's not proof, then nothing will ever convince you guys.

You might have just proved something ......telephones.

"prove there are no gods (or demons) who use Yahweh as a (literary) avatar".


I just said that they never told anyone how much they needed. Plus, the person wasn't even a friend. It was just some random person that appeared on their doorstep.

Why ignore the facts of the story?

The landlord would have known, no doubt he told others. What is the most reasonable explanation?
Neither Foxy Freedom nor any associates can be reached via WWGHA. Their official antitheist website is http://the6antitheist6guide6.blogspot.co.uk

The 2nd edition of the free ebook Devil or Delusion ? The danger of Christianity to Democracy Freedom and Science.       http://t.co/2d1KcJ9V