Author Topic: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible  (Read 422 times)

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Offline Brad the Bold

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Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« on: February 05, 2014, 04:27:07 PM »
Not sure if this fits best in "Biblical contradictions" or "Religion in the News"

http://www.foxnews.com/science/2014/02/05/camel-bones-suggest-error-in-bible/

In summary the archaeology suggest that camels were domesticated in the Middle East around 900BC. (All sites dating after 900BC contain abundant camel bones, all sites before contain few or none.)

But the biblical stories of Jacob, Joesph, and Abraham all reference camels as pack animals even though they report events from 1500-2000BC. The camel among the cattle given by Pharaoh to Abraham ( Genesis 12:16 ). Abraham's servant rode on a camel ( Genesis 24:10-11)

Camels in Genesis = anachronistic error.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2014, 04:34:54 PM by Brad the Bold »

Offline jdawg70

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2014, 04:58:58 PM »
Camels in Genesis = anachronistic error.
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."
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Online nogodsforme

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2014, 05:33:58 PM »
Ooooops! Gotta subtract camels from the major OT stories. Next they'll be telling us that Moses did not look anything like Charleton Heston. 

 


Looking at this in 2014 and I'm thinking, bare chests, men in dresses, all those phallic towers and staffs. Yul Brynner as that dishy hot Ramses. How gay was this movie?  And I almost died laughing when the trailer flashed the word "UNCUT!" across the screen. Wasn't Moses supposed to be Jewish? ;D

If they had made this movie with Chuck Norris, it would have lasted only 5 minutes-- Pharoah would have let the people go the first time.[1]
 1. I saw a "Chuck Norris Facts" poster (When god and Satan have their last fight,  Chuck Norris will win. The universe only looks like it's expanding; it's actually running away from Chuck Norris. ) and have been laughing ever since. So many of them are either anti-religious, math or science jokes. Right up my alley-- an alley where Chuck Norris is waiting to roundhouse kick you into Schrodinger's cat box.....
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Brad the Bold

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2014, 10:12:51 AM »
So, as usual, the fundies have an army of biblical scholars that have apparently been researching Israeli camel domestication in secret for decades and have all the answers as to why the research is flawed/false/fabricated/misinterpreted. Their "well researched and substantially documented" (sarcasm translator: pulled from their arses) counter theories are flooding the comments sections to prove once again that the bible is infallible and science is done by rubes.

http://www.timesofisrael.com/camel-archaeology-takes-on-the-bible/

http://www.ibtimes.com/oldest-camel-bones-undergo-carbon-dating-direct-proof-bible-was-written-centuries-after-events

The most galling to me are the ones who now snatch up the banner and cry "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" claiming that there might be evidence of camel use that we haven't found yet we just need to look harder.

Galling, because if we switched topics to the fossil record of evolution they'd likely be all, "But there are NO TRANSITIONAL FORMS!!!SUCK IT SCIENCE!"  >:(

*sigh*

Offline screwtape

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2014, 11:23:36 AM »
notice who did the original reseach:
Quote
Erez Ben-Yosef and Lidar Sapir-Hen

It is obviously a jewish conspiracy to bring down xians.[1]

also, kind of on par with the book of mormon talking about horses in south america at the time of jesus H.


 1. lest anyone miss what I think is obvious satire, I know the OT is jewish. 
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Offline godzilla

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2014, 08:50:18 PM »
I was about to post this.  :'(
Anyway, this won't stop Fundies from believing everything the Bible says, I wonder what would though....

Offline wheels5894

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2014, 12:18:46 PM »
Of course, one doesn't have to read very carefully to see that the old Genesis stories are myths - even worded in the language of myths.  That is not to say that they are untrue per se but it means they were written to give a message ,- just the Oesops Fables.

A text does not have to be literally true for it to carry meaning and for religion, which tries at least to tackle the biggest question of life, sometimes stories illustrate matters much better than dry philosophy.
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Offline wright

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2014, 02:31:27 PM »
Expected apologist whining, arriving at Gate 2 via Patheos Blogs: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2014/02/10/archeologists-camel-bones-discovery-challenges-bibles-historicity-christian-blogger-challenges-them-right-back/


From the linked article:
Quote
2.) The word for camel gamal (??????) may be a substitute for the oral tradition’s use of a load-bearing animal. Perhaps, according to oral tradition, the load bearing animal was a donkey or mule. When it came time to consolidate and ‘canonize’ the Torah, the scribes (being people of their time) assigned the word camel to the word load-bearing animal. (This is not unlike when we hear a story of a cowboy riding into town on an animal, we automatically assume the animal was a horse.)

Old Testament scholars have long suggested that the Torah was not finished in the form we have it today until well after the events they describe. Even if we accepted Moses as the author of the Torah, we must also remember that he was not present for a major portion of it (Genesis). Oral tradition must play some type of role in its formation, which is something Christians have believed for a long time.

Good grief, this is what passes for apologist logic? Does Beshears really want to play that game? If he's talking about the meaning of words being changed over time, I know a nearby house of cards that doesn't look like much of an investment.
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Offline wheels5894

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2014, 03:29:38 PM »
I just love the idea that an oral story would contain the words 'a load bearing animal'. If it is as old as the bible believers want the story to be, then these agricultural people would have the words to be precise and have said horse or donkey if that was what it was. If not, then th myths were made up after the camel became on of the beasts of burden in Israel and the writers just assumed it always had been.
No testimony is sufficient to establish a miracle, unless the testimony be of such that its falshood would be more miraculous than the facts it endeavours to establish. (David Hume)

Online nogodsforme

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Re: Camel archaeology conflicts with the Bible
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2014, 04:53:28 PM »
Soooo, it could have been an elephant, a St. Bernard dog, a tame land shark. Or a sturdy slave with a strong back. Or a motor vehicle named after an animal, like a Ford Mustang or a Volkswagen Rabbit.[1]

Maybe the Jews transported all their worldly goods out of Egypt on the back of Bigfoot. The bible does not say it was NOT Bigfoot. So it could have been. So there.  &)
 1. Or a Jaguar, because Ben Kingsley, Tom Hiddleston and Mark Strong. http://www.jaguarusa.com/british-villains.html

Ow ow ow! :-*
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.