Author Topic: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)  (Read 9868 times)

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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #319 on: December 07, 2013, 02:33:17 AM »
WE actually do believe in survival of the fittest,it's why we can go to the market and buy that steak,and we have all done little as possible to alleviate the world food shortage in certain regions,like YOU we do as little as possible for ANYBODY but ourselves GENERALLY speaking of course. There are pockets of people who do all they can,you and I are not in those pockets

I'm not sure where you went with that post.

Do you think starving people in Africa are just not fit enough to survive? The United States does waste a lot of food.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Astreja

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #320 on: December 07, 2013, 03:05:57 AM »
I am curious as to why you help them, considering you believe in evolution. "Survival of the fittest."

Humanity has evolved to have a sense of compassion whereby we can identify with the pain of other living beings.  We are "the fittest" -- that is, the most appropriate, not always faster or stronger but better suited to our environment -- because this neurological trait makes it easier to live in large groups and cooperate with strangers.

I am among "the fittest" because I have achieved a reasonable balance between selfishness (juicy steaks) and altruism (using part of My salary to support such things as medical research, clothing and food drives, and other causes that benefit those outside My immediate family).

Now, Skeptic, please answer My question:  What do you propose we do to alleviate suffering in Hell?
« Last Edit: December 07, 2013, 03:34:32 AM by Astreja »
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #321 on: December 07, 2013, 03:28:45 AM »
I am  fit...

Fit for sitting on the couch...that is...

I think too many theists take "survival of the fittest" as meaning "survival of the physically strongest", without factoring other things, like behaviors, technology, etc.
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Offline Astreja

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #322 on: December 07, 2013, 03:43:19 AM »
Do you think starving people in Africa are just not fit enough to survive? The United States does waste a lot of food.

Interestingly, those individuals who manage to stay alive in adverse situations, such as famine, may have survived because of one or more physical traits.  For example, someone who sweats less may be the one who lives when water is in short supply.

I wish that it was as easy as {reduce waste -> redistribute surplus food -> save lives}.  There are other things at play here, such as regional politics.  A lot of food is shipped to needy areas but a lot of it doesn't make it through to the intended recipients.  This is particularly so when there's armed conflict in the area, as a lot of the donated supplies get hijacked and redirected to local warlords and their supporters.  In such situations, it may well be aggression that selects for fitness --  At least, until superior firepower arrives to deal with the problem and protect the less aggressive.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #323 on: December 07, 2013, 12:47:09 PM »
Do you think starving people in Africa are just not fit enough to survive? The United States does waste a lot of food.

Interestingly, those individuals who manage to stay alive in adverse situations, such as famine, may have survived because of one or more physical traits.  For example, someone who sweats less may be the one who lives when water is in short supply.

I wish that it was as easy as {reduce waste -> redistribute surplus food -> save lives}.  There are other things at play here, such as regional politics.  A lot of food is shipped to needy areas but a lot of it doesn't make it through to the intended recipients.  This is particularly so when there's armed conflict in the area, as a lot of the donated supplies get hijacked and redirected to local warlords and their supporters.  In such situations, it may well be aggression that selects for fitness --  At least, until superior firepower arrives to deal with the problem and protect the less aggressive.

I agree that is the problem! Corrupt people doing nothing but corrupting and taking the food away.

This is why i find it comical when people blame God and yell "Let God fix it!!!!" when it's up to us and our free will.

If a bunch of dicks are taking the food, God shakes his head with the rest of us.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline G-Roll

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #324 on: December 07, 2013, 12:57:01 PM »
Do you think starving people in Africa are just not fit enough to survive? The United States does waste a lot of food.

Interestingly, those individuals who manage to stay alive in adverse situations, such as famine, may have survived because of one or more physical traits.  For example, someone who sweats less may be the one who lives when water is in short supply.

I wish that it was as easy as {reduce waste -> redistribute surplus food -> save lives}.  There are other things at play here, such as regional politics.  A lot of food is shipped to needy areas but a lot of it doesn't make it through to the intended recipients.  This is particularly so when there's armed conflict in the area, as a lot of the donated supplies get hijacked and redirected to local warlords and their supporters.  In such situations, it may well be aggression that selects for fitness --  At least, until superior firepower arrives to deal with the problem and protect the less aggressive.

I agree that is the problem! Corrupt people doing nothing but corrupting and taking the food away.

This is why i find it comical when people blame God and yell "Let God fix it!!!!" when it's up to us and our free will.

If a bunch of dicks are taking the food, God shakes his head with the rest of us.
Am I the only one who finds humor in this post? I almost +1ed it but I think he means what he says in a different way than I do.

Offline MadBunny

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #325 on: December 07, 2013, 02:55:19 PM »

If a bunch of dicks are taking the food, God shakes his head with the rest of us.

The only reason you feel this is the case is because you have cast god in your own image.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #326 on: December 07, 2013, 09:24:46 PM »
WE actually do believe in survival of the fittest,it's why we can go to the market and buy that steak,and we have all done little as possible to alleviate the world food shortage in certain regions,like YOU we do as little as possible for ANYBODY but ourselves GENERALLY speaking of course. There are pockets of people who do all they can,you and I are not in those pockets

I'm not sure where you went with that post.

Do you think starving people in Africa are just not fit enough to survive? The United States does waste a lot of food.
No I am saying you and I are aware of it but do little to nothing to help,the difference is you have orders from god to help the meek,I don't,so you as a Christian FAIL
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Offline median

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #327 on: December 07, 2013, 09:30:03 PM »

OK, I have a question for you to start off.

Is there anything that exists without a purpose for its existence?

If yes, explain what it is and why it has no purpose.
If no, you must concede the universe has a purpose for its existence.

Are you familiar with the famous Russell/Copelston debate? If not, please check it out on YouTube. You really need to do your philosophy homework.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #328 on: December 07, 2013, 09:39:08 PM »
I agree that is the problem! Corrupt people doing nothing but corrupting and taking the food away.

This is why i find it comical when people blame God and yell "Let God fix it!!!!" when it's up to us and our free will.

If a bunch of dicks are taking the food, God shakes his head with the rest of us.

I consider myself to be lazy.

But if i had omnipotence, i would help everything.

Why?

Because it would be nothing, omnipotence is literally unlimited power.
Therefore if god exists, he is a lazy/immoral bastard.
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Offline median

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #329 on: December 07, 2013, 09:42:14 PM »

So i take it you do not enjoy a nice big juicy steak knowing there are starving people in Africa?

Do you ever eat anything?

Excuse me DICK! I am a vegetarian and I sponsor starving children in Africa (as well as send clothes and food to people there and in Mexico). You really should think more before you open your proverbial mouth. Think outside the church box.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline median

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #330 on: December 07, 2013, 09:51:22 PM »

I agree that is the problem! Corrupt people doing nothing but corrupting and taking the food away.

This is why i find it comical when people blame God and yell "Let God fix it!!!!" when it's up to us and our free will.

If a bunch of dicks are taking the food, God shakes his head with the rest of us.

You think an omnipotent God exists who has the power to end all world starvation immediately, right now, this very second and yet somehow it's our job? What a cop-out. There clearly is no all-loving all-powerful deity. Your God is imaginary fiction (yes, like Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy for children).
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Add Homonym

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #331 on: December 07, 2013, 10:11:53 PM »
Because it would be nothing, omnipotence is literally unlimited power.
Therefore if god exists, he is a lazy/immoral bastard.

He might be busy. If he's created an infinite number of universes, with different physical constants, then, to fix all the evil in the universe, he might be stretched rather thin.
Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #332 on: December 07, 2013, 10:14:05 PM »
He might be busy. If he's created an infinite number of universes, with different physical constants, then, to fix all the evil in the universe, he might be stretched rather thin.

I sense sarcasm here, being that omnipotence would hand wave the concept of busy away..
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #333 on: December 08, 2013, 03:03:00 AM »
You think an omnipotent God exists who has the power to end all world starvation immediately, right now, this very second and yet somehow it's our job? What a cop-out. There clearly is no all-loving all-powerful deity. Your God is imaginary fiction (yes, like Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy for children).

Let me illustrate how silly that sounds:

You think billionaire Bill Gates exists who has the power to end all work for his children and make life a party 24/7 for them, and yet somehow they have to earn their own money? What a cop-out. There clearly is no billionaire Bill Gates. Your Gates is imaginary fiction.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #334 on: December 08, 2013, 03:26:08 AM »
I think you fail to see what omnipotence means...

It means one could do everything ever in a zero amount of time.

If this god is apparently loving, he sure doesn't love Africa.
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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #335 on: December 08, 2013, 04:00:44 AM »
You think an omnipotent God exists who has the power to end all world starvation immediately, right now, this very second and yet somehow it's our job? What a cop-out. There clearly is no all-loving all-powerful deity. Your God is imaginary fiction (yes, like Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy for children).

Let me illustrate how silly that sounds:

You think billionaire Bill Gates exists who has the power to end all work for his children and make life a party 24/7 for them, and yet somehow they have to earn their own money? What a cop-out. There clearly is no billionaire Bill Gates. Your Gates is imaginary fiction.

I don't see Bill Gates letting his children starve in Africa, or not receiving medical help, if they have a terminal disease. Your analogy can only stretch so far, because we know Bill Gates exists, because I have seen him on TV.

Despite what you think, Bill Gates is a loving parent, and would suddenly have second thoughts about his principle, if any of his children suffered because of it.
Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Boots

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #336 on: December 08, 2013, 09:15:23 AM »
Let me illustrate how silly that sounds:

You think billionaire Bill Gates exists who has the power to end all work for his children and make life a party 24/7 for them,

Skep, question: could heaven be described as a 24/7 party?  If so, then you certainly have to concede that your god is capable of creating this scenario.  Further, that some beings (unborn children, for example) get to go there without the "benefit" of having suffered through this life.

How do you reconcile that with the reality we see daily: of untold suffering of innocents here on earth, while some innocents get the 24/7 party immediately?
* Religion: institutionalized superstition, period.

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #337 on: December 08, 2013, 10:19:08 AM »
Let me illustrate how silly that sounds:

You think billionaire Bill Gates exists who has the power to end all work for his children and make life a party 24/7 for them,

Skep, question: could heaven be described as a 24/7 party?  If so, then you certainly have to concede that your god is capable of creating this scenario.  Further, that some beings (unborn children, for example) get to go there without the "benefit" of having suffered through this life.

How do you reconcile that with the reality we see daily: of untold suffering of innocents here on earth, while some innocents get the 24/7 party immediately?

I've been to a 24/5 party but never a 24/7 one.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

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Offline MadBunny

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #338 on: December 08, 2013, 12:55:17 PM »
You think an omnipotent God exists who has the power to end all world starvation immediately, right now, this very second and yet somehow it's our job? What a cop-out. There clearly is no all-loving all-powerful deity. Your God is imaginary fiction (yes, like Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy for children).

Let me illustrate how silly that sounds:

You think billionaire Bill Gates exists who has the power to end all work for his children and make life a party 24/7 for them, and yet somehow they have to earn their own money? What a cop-out. There clearly is no billionaire Bill Gates. Your Gates is imaginary fiction.


I find it amusing that you place these limitations on your god.  I notice your god only has powers that you can imagine 'him' having, or morals that you imagine it to have.

In short you can't imagine the effort it would take to individually deal with every human therefore your god cannot manage to individually deal with every human.

Your god is less of a god and more of a super...human.
Your god is less yaweh and more Black Adam.



Has the power of a god, chooses to bestow it upon only his chosen subjects.  Is selfish, requires adulation, and isn't afraid to get things bloody.  As long as you stay out of his back yard he doesn't care if you're super wealthy or starving.  Could probably rule the entire world if it weren't for the opposition, can't be arsed to do so.


Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #339 on: December 08, 2013, 01:29:48 PM »
I think you fail to see what omnipotence means...

It means one could do everything ever in a zero amount of time.

If this god is apparently loving, he sure doesn't love Africa.
It's obvious that Skeptics God only loves whitey
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #340 on: December 08, 2013, 02:30:21 PM »
I think you fail to see what omnipotence means...

It means one could do everything ever in a zero amount of time.

If this god is apparently loving, he sure doesn't love Africa.
It's obvious that Skeptics God only loves whitey

No, It's the U.S. who hates Africa.

Imagine if we let them keep their own diamonds. They'd be wealthy as hell!

The problem is godless people keep rolling in with bulldozaers and stealing their diamonds and selling them in the U.S.

"One nation under God" indeed. What a joke!
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline MadBunny

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #341 on: December 08, 2013, 03:11:47 PM »
No, It's the U.S. who hates Africa.

Imagine if we let them keep their own diamonds. They'd be wealthy as hell!

The problem is godless people keep rolling in with bulldozaers and stealing their diamonds and selling them in the U.S.

"One nation under God" indeed. What a joke!




God: powerless against godless people.  Super god you have there Skeptic54768.  Real impressive.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #342 on: December 08, 2013, 03:17:15 PM »
I think you fail to see what omnipotence means...

It means one could do everything ever in a zero amount of time.

If this god is apparently loving, he sure doesn't love Africa.
It's obvious that Skeptics God only loves whitey

No, It's the U.S. who hates Africa.

Imagine if we let them keep their own diamonds. They'd be wealthy as hell!

The problem is godless people keep rolling in with bulldozaers and stealing their diamonds and selling them in the U.S.

"One nation under God" indeed. What a joke!
I have never bought a diamond in my life,,,,and I think you are confusing USA with Holland,in Africa stealing diamonds....BTW everything you have in terms of wealth has been "stolen" from the indigenous peoples of North America,see the double standard you have there? Why don't you go back home from your county of origin,or that of your ancestors? You can take your God with you.
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #343 on: December 08, 2013, 03:17:18 PM »
No, It's the U.S. who hates Africa.

Imagine if we let them keep their own diamonds. They'd be wealthy as hell!

The problem is godless people keep rolling in with bulldozaers and stealing their diamonds and selling them in the U.S.

"One nation under God" indeed. What a joke!




God: powerless against godless people.  Super god you have there Skeptic54768.  Real impressive.

Please tell me what lesson anyone would learn if God kept feeding the Africans. "Hey we can keep stealing the diamonds and God is gonna keep feeding them! Wow! This God really spoils us! No discipline whatsoever! Such a pushover!"

What lesson would a person learn if they kept getting traffic tickets and their parents kept paying for it?
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Aaron123

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #344 on: December 08, 2013, 03:22:07 PM »
God: powerless against godless people.  Super god you have there Skeptic54768.  Real impressive.

Well, to be fair, there is precedence for that.  Just look at what happened with those iron chariots...
Being a Christian, I've made my decision. That decision offers no compromise; therefore, I'm closed to anything else.

Offline G-Roll

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #345 on: December 08, 2013, 03:23:17 PM »
Quote
http://money.howstuffworks.com/african-diamond-trade2.htm

First, remember that not all African diamond mines are corrupt. For example, the African nation Botswana has been able to thrive thanks to a successful diamond mining industry. As recently as 1999, it was considered the world's fastest-growing economy. In fact, three-quarters of Botswana's export profits and 45 percent of the country's government revenue are produced by diamonds. Thanks to a legitimate diamond industry, Botswana has enjoyed a complete about-face from one of the world's poorest countries in 1966 to the world's most rapidly growing economy over the last 25 years [source: Allafrica.com].

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/07/20/business/botswana-diamonds-de-beers/index.html

In 1969, the Botswana government signed a 50/50 deal with global diamond giant De Beers to explore and mine all of the country's diamonds. The partnership, called 'Debswana,' has helped turn Botswana into one of Africa's most prosperous countries, boasting today a robust economy and one of the highest per capita incomes on the continent.
The state mines the country's riches as an owner, getting a share of the profit in addition to just collecting taxes and royalties like many other mineral-rich African governments.
This unique arrangement has allowed Botswana to make significant investments in education and health care, officials say.
"Since we partnered with De Beers, we have a lot to show from any community development standpoint," says Bank of Botswana governor Linah Mohohlo. She notes that this model can be emulated in other parts of the continent.
"If you were to replicate what we do in Botswana in other African countries, I have no doubt in my mind that there could be meaningful gains."
And now, Botswana's diamond industry looks set to get a further boost after De Beers announced last year its decision to shift its rough diamond trading operation from London to Gaborone, the Botswana capital.
Linah Mohohlo, Bank of Botswana governor. The company says it expects the move to bring an extra $6 billion of diamond sales into the country. A new head office is also under construction while 80 staff members  will be relocated from Europe to Africa.

Yeah those freaking heathens are mucking up Botswana! How dare De Beers Co. have a working relationship with the Botswana government since 1969 that pumps $6 billion dollars into the country of Botswana!? That is just something Jesus wouldn’t support.

Do you know of the KPSC?
Quote
The Kimberley Process Certification Scheme (KPCS) is the process established in 2003 to prevent "conflict diamonds" from entering the mainstream rough diamond market by United Nations General Assembly Resolution 55/56 following recommendations in the Fowler Report. The process was set up "to ensure that diamond purchases were not financing violence by rebel movements and their allies seeking to undermine legitimate governments."

Now I am not ignorant enough to state that there is no corruption in Botswana. Or that the US/west is fair to any nation in Africa or helpful or harmful. However your statement of "imagine if we let them keep their own diamonds they'd be wealthy" is silly. I am sure that the government of Botswana could mine their own diamonds and keep all the profits but why would they?
I have given you two separate sources that state the diamond industry have skyrocketed an African countries economy. What Botswana's government does with that money.. I have no idea. Given your statements should we (the US) invade African countries and displace their governments? Seeming that has worked so well in the Middle East in the past?

Lol I know nothing of this subject but a quick google search proved your statement invalid. It is safe to state something along the lines of the world gave up on Africa or that the west could care less about Africa. But sometimes there is a bored individual on the other side of the internet with nothing better to do but challenge your statement.
You kind sir are incorrect. Thanks to a western company and US consumers Botswana has a "sparkling" economy.       


Offline Aaron123

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #346 on: December 08, 2013, 03:27:54 PM »
Please tell me what lesson anyone would learn if God kept feeding the Africans. "Hey we can keep stealing the diamonds and God is gonna keep feeding them! Wow! This God really spoils us! No discipline whatsoever! Such a pushover!"

What lesson would a person learn if they kept getting traffic tickets and their parents kept paying for it?

What lesson is there when god stands by, do nothing, and allow people to "keep rolling in with bulldozaers and stealing their diamonds and selling them in the U.S."?
Being a Christian, I've made my decision. That decision offers no compromise; therefore, I'm closed to anything else.

Offline MadBunny

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Re: The Religious "Ask Skeptic" Thread (With Apology To The Atheists)
« Reply #347 on: December 08, 2013, 03:28:16 PM »
Please tell me what lesson anyone would learn if God kept feeding the Africans. "Hey we can keep stealing the diamonds and God is gonna keep feeding them! Wow! This God really spoils us! No discipline whatsoever! Such a pushover!"

What lesson would a person learn if they kept getting traffic tickets and their parents kept paying for it?

I don't know.  It's your god, you tell me.  What lesson is he teaching his Christian Americans by telling them they can take what they want from the less powerful?
What lesson would a person learn if they let their children bully others for lunch money, knew about it and did nothing?

Wow, this god lets me do whatever I want to people with no consequences whatsoever.  Fuck those guys, I'm taking their shit.




Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.