Author Topic: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?  (Read 19076 times)

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Online Jag

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #841 on: December 14, 2013, 12:13:41 PM »
Just because a lot of creation scientists are free thinkers and go against the grain of what the majority of secular scientists think, does not make us automatically wrong.

It also doesn't make them right.  That's something that each scientist has to demonstrate, experiment by experiment, regardless of personal beliefs.

The reason that mainstream science is laughing at creation science is that the verifiable facts have come down overwhelmingly in favour of mainstream science, and no creation scientist has yet gotten past the hypothesis stage to formulate an actual theory.

Skep has just referred to himself as a "creationist scientist", thereby answering any lingering questions about him. Liberty U is apparently even worse that I thought.
"It's hard to, but I'm starting to believe some of you actually believe these things.  That is completely beyond my ability to understand if that is really the case, but things never cease to amaze me."

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #842 on: December 14, 2013, 01:22:57 PM »
If we evolved, God would've mentioned that in the creation account.
And just which creation account would that be?
There are two stories in Genesis, did god have to make two guesses?

No, there isn't. The "2nd story" is a zooming in on the creation of man and what happened that day. It's not a different story.

How do you guys not know this stuff?
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #843 on: December 14, 2013, 01:44:19 PM »
Interesting you post that picture. I see you believe that things get more complex over time instead of progressing toward disorder. This is an interesting belief because it contradicts what we know about entropy. Energy in a closed system can not increase the order of things. Since the universe is a closed system, we would not be able to see anything progressing from disorder to order.
The total entropy of a closed system can only increase.  However, there is no reason that the entropy in part of the universe cannot decrease, provided that it does not decrease the total entropy of the universe.  The Sun alone generates enough entropy (through the dispersion of solar energy) to outweigh anything we do to decrease entropy here on Earth.  Never mind all the other stars, all the black holes, etc.  In short, our actions here on Earth have no meaningful effect on universal entropy - we don't even noticeably affect the universal rate of entropy increase, let alone running any risk of breaking the Second Law of Thermodynamics.

Quote from: skeptic54768
Facts are facts. I didn't create thermodynamics.
You don't appear to understand thermodynamics either.

By the way, question for you.  Is your god bound by entropy?

If we evolved, God would've mentioned that in the creation account.
That assumes a god wrote the creation account to begin with, rather than it being written by primitive humans who used their imaginations to come up with an explanation that made sense to them.

Quote from: skeptic54768
I'm using the simplest possible form of logic here. Don't you think that's something God would know?
You are also slicing your logic to ribbons on Occam's Razor because of all the implicit assumptions contained in the idea of "God".

Well if you say it is fact, then it must be fact.
What you don't seem to realize is that your argument regarding God is exactly like this.

Quote from: skeptic54768
I am sorry, but I am not a fresh young mind in the 1st grade willing to believe anything a grown up says. Dawkins wants to hook 'em while they're young so it's ingrained in their minds and they will feel weird if they doubt evolution.
Funny, that's how theists operate - note that children of religious parents start being taught religious stuff before they're even able to read, let alone have the mental development to question what they're being told.

You haven't heard a peep from Him because you're an atheist. God does not show up where He's not wanted. That's rude behavior.
Logic failure.  Astreja just said that she wanted God to show up right in front of her.

Quote from: skeptic54768
Do you show up to people's homes uninvited and just walk in the front door and plop on their couch and turn on the tv?
Nope.  But if someone says that they want to meet me (say they've heard about me from other people), then that's enough of an invitation for me to introduce myself - assuming I care.

No, there isn't. The "2nd story" is a zooming in on the creation of man and what happened that day. It's not a different story.
Yes, it is a different story.  It isn't just that the order is different either, although that's a key point.  In the first story, the order goes plants, animals, humans (more to the point, it specifically mentions that humans were made male and female).  In the second, it goes Adam (male human), plants, animals, Eve (female human).  Also, note the chronology of the first story:  Plants on day 3, animals on days 5 and 6, humans on day 6.  Yet in the second story, Adam was there before both plants and animals.

Genesis 2:5 says that no plants had yet been made for there were no people to till them, and no rain to water them.
Genesis 2:6 says that the land was being watered.
Genesis 2:7 says that Adam (man) was created.
Genesis 2:8 says that a garden was made.
Genesis 2:9 says that trees grew.
Genesis 2:10 says that rivers were made.
Genesis 2:11-14 names the first four rivers.
Genesis 2:15-17 is where God told Adam his rights and responsibilities.
Genesis 2:18-20 is where animals were made.
Genesis 2:21-22 is where Eve (woman) was made.

There is no way to reconcile the two sequences of events without a lot of mental gymnastics, which violate Occam's Razor due to the assumptions they have to make.

Quote from: skeptic54768
How do you guys not know this stuff?
A much better question is, how do you not know that the two creation stories have a distinctly different order of events?

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #844 on: December 14, 2013, 02:58:18 PM »
Just because a lot of creation scientists are free thinkers...
You're seriously calling ignorant close-minded creationist "scientists" free-thinkers? :laugh:

certainly free from scientific method and sense.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline voodoo child

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #845 on: December 14, 2013, 09:04:56 PM »
How do you guys not know this stuff?


You got life's answers from a book, Written by primitive humans?

What a waste. 
 
The classical man is just a bundle of routine, ideas and tradition. If you follow the classical pattern, you are understanding the routine, the tradition, the shadow, you are not understanding yourself. Truth has no path. Truth is living and therefore changing. Bruce lee

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #846 on: December 14, 2013, 11:40:31 PM »
If we evolved, God would've mentioned that in the creation account.
And just which creation account would that be?
There are two stories in Genesis, did god have to make two guesses?

No, there isn't. The "2nd story" is a zooming in on the creation of man and what happened that day. It's not a different story.

How do you guys not know this stuff?
 

Genesis 1:25-27 (Humans were created after the other animals.)

    And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let us make man in our image.... So God created man in his own image.

Genesis 1:27 (The first man and woman were created simultaneously.)

    So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


which is a different order than


Genesis 2:18-19 (Humans were created before the other animals.)

    And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Genesis 2:18-22 (The man was created first, then the animals, then the woman from the man's rib.)

    And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them.... And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

or
The Order of Creation

Genesis 1:11-12 and 1:26-27 Trees came before Adam.
Genesis 2:4-9 Trees came after Adam.

Genesis 1:20-21 and 26-27 Birds were created before Adam.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:19 Birds were created after Adam.

Genesis 1:24-27 Animals were created before Adam.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:19 Animals were created after Adam.

Genesis 1:26-27 Adam and Eve were created at the same time.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:21-22 Adam was created first, woman sometime later.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #847 on: December 15, 2013, 12:32:29 AM »
Why are you guys not fucking ignoring this half baked creationist yet? You can't fix stupid
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #848 on: December 15, 2013, 01:09:10 AM »
Patience is a virtue, you know.

Besides from which, even though he's wrong about this stuff, not saying anything would imply that we have no answer to it.  I think he's counting on that to a degree.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #849 on: December 15, 2013, 01:19:13 AM »
Patience is a virtue, you know.

Besides from which, even though he's wrong about this stuff, not saying anything would imply that we have no answer to it.  I think he's counting on that to a degree.
He ignores or dismisses any scientific,reasonable or even plausible explanation. He knows he is wrong,but will never admit it. It is like banging your head against a brick wall,it only feels good when you stop
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline xyzzy

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #850 on: December 15, 2013, 03:16:56 AM »
Besides from which, even though he's wrong about this stuff, not saying anything would imply that we have no answer to it.  I think he's counting on that to a degree.
Maybe that's what talkorigins or a FAQ is for, and not answering them might deprive us of some excellent snark[1] but, unfortunately, that's also exactly the action that trolls count on for regular meals and night-time amusement.

For a sad example of what can happen, albeit absent moderation,[2] take a look at the WWGHA/blog. There a small group of trolls[3] derails each and every thread using the the same approach as does SkepTroll.[4]

I doubt much of this is new to most here, but sometimes we can forget to stand back and look at from a detached view point.

Disclaimer: I've had him on ignore since his flagrant dishonesty when squirming out of a debate with median and only see his posts when people reply to him.
 1. ParkingPlaces, for example, has laid down some serious smack on that account
 2. God has blessed us by sending us such wonderful moderators. Now where are my car keys?
 3. It looks like several theists are joining in, but most ate sock-puppets of one person
 4. Make stupid statements, the more outrageous the better, and count on them being refuted. Once refuted, change the subject and demand people prove something else, which he will then ignore, eventually cycling back to the good old classics. Rinse and repeat until the OP is completely forgotten and people are knocking themselves over to prove him wrong.
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Offline median

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #851 on: December 15, 2013, 03:51:12 AM »

No, my argument is based on empiricism. I see systems created using intelligence. The universe is a majorly complex system, as is the human body. This means it's only logical that intelligence is responsible for the universe and everything in it.

Logic and empiricism are 2 gifts from God that we can use to deduce his existence. The problem is that a lot of atheists try to turn it around against God.

But the facts show that empiricism and logic prove God's existence.

Nope, they don't. Nature proves nature. And it doesn't tell us how it get it until we investigate. Merely positing some-thing you call 'God' does nothing to further the discussion - b/c you cannot explain a mystery with another mystery. You have your searching processes backwards (starting with your conclusion is the wrong way).
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline median

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #852 on: December 15, 2013, 03:54:52 AM »

A different interpretation of the fossils is that they are different species that God created, instead of the fossils being a step by step process into modern man.

Another gap argument. fail.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline median

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #853 on: December 15, 2013, 03:58:27 AM »

You haven't heard a peep from Him because you're an atheist. God does not show up where He's not wanted. That's rude behavior.

Do you show up to people's homes uninvited and just walk in the front door and plop on their couch and turn on the tv?

Bearing false witness again I see. Way to go team! This alleged 'God' showed up to Satan, the angels, Saul of Tarsus, Pharaoh, doubting Thomas, and thousands more (again supposedly). Sorry dude. You're trying to makeup your own version of Christianity. It's pure bullshit.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #854 on: December 15, 2013, 04:18:24 AM »
Why are you guys not fucking ignoring this half baked creationist yet? You can't fix stupid

As I explained earlier: there is no other theist around. As soon as Jailed turned up, Skep got dropped like a rock. However, the main reason was that Skep was too busy to run two sock puppets.
Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #855 on: December 15, 2013, 04:23:19 AM »
How do you guys not know this stuff?

You mean: Why do we not humour you with your incorrect belief that Genesis 2 is a "zooming in", when it's not. I believe we know about your response, but you fail to know that we have a response to your response.

How do you not know that?
Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #856 on: December 15, 2013, 11:06:44 AM »



flipping burden of proof, your argument is invalid

No, my argument is based on empiricism. I see systems created using intelligence. The universe is a majorly complex system, as is the human body. This means it's only logical that intelligence is responsible for the universe and everything in it.

Logic and empiricism are 2 gifts from God that we can use to deduce his existence. The problem is that a lot of atheists try to turn it around against God.

But the facts show that empiricism and logic prove God's existence.

Fallacy remains. Circular logic, flipping burden of proof. Adding appeal to incredulity. Your argument is invalid.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Quesi

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #857 on: December 15, 2013, 11:23:36 AM »
Hey Skeptik

I'm really trying to be patient, but I would love an answer to my question about the size of the sun, and how it relates to direct and indirect science. 

I know that you are busy here, with a lot of posts to respond to.  But I would really appreciate it if you could tell me if I am on the right track to understanding.  Or not.

My original question was posted back here:

http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,25868.msg589374.html#msg589374

Thanks!

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #858 on: December 15, 2013, 12:28:42 PM »
Hey Skeptik

I'm really trying to be patient, but I would love an answer to my question about the size of the sun, and how it relates to direct and indirect science. 

I know that you are busy here, with a lot of posts to respond to.  But I would really appreciate it if you could tell me if I am on the right track to understanding.  Or not.

My original question was posted back here:

http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,25868.msg589374.html#msg589374

Thanks!

Size exists only in the mind. There is no objective way to determine size. This is what Berkeley was talking about.

To a human, a basketball is small. To an ant, a basketball is HUGE. What is the objective size of the basketball? Does the basketball have 2 different sizes at once? It's all based on perception, which is based on the mind.

Same thing with color. A person sees something as completely red and you see it as completely blue. Does the object have 2 different colors at once? No, because color only exists in the mind.

None of our senses escape the problem of perception, which is why things can only exist in minds. Ergo, God's mind is why everything exists.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Quesi

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #859 on: December 15, 2013, 12:32:02 PM »
^^^ Thank you for taking the time to respond.  I think I've learned a great deal from your response. 

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #860 on: December 15, 2013, 12:35:21 PM »
Patience is a virtue, you know.

Besides from which, even though he's wrong about this stuff, not saying anything would imply that we have no answer to it.  I think he's counting on that to a degree.
He ignores or dismisses any scientific,reasonable or even plausible explanation. He knows he is wrong,but will never admit it. It is like banging your head against a brick wall,it only feels good when you stop


But once again, you are assuming that the scientific approach is the best way to learn. This has not been proven. You can not use the scientific method to validate the scientific method. It's circular.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #861 on: December 15, 2013, 12:36:44 PM »
^^^ Thank you for taking the time to respond.  I think I've learned a great deal from your response.

Finally, I have opened someone's mind.

Once you realize everything is perceived a certain way, your mind becomes free and open. There is no objective way to determine anything: size, color, distance, etc etc etc.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #862 on: December 15, 2013, 12:42:56 PM »
If we evolved, God would've mentioned that in the creation account.
And just which creation account would that be?
There are two stories in Genesis, did god have to make two guesses?

No, there isn't. The "2nd story" is a zooming in on the creation of man and what happened that day. It's not a different story.

How do you guys not know this stuff?
 

Genesis 1:25-27 (Humans were created after the other animals.)

    And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good. And God said, Let us make man in our image.... So God created man in his own image.

Genesis 1:27 (The first man and woman were created simultaneously.)

    So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.


which is a different order than


Genesis 2:18-19 (Humans were created before the other animals.)

    And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

Genesis 2:18-22 (The man was created first, then the animals, then the woman from the man's rib.)

    And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him. And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them.... And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.

or
The Order of Creation

Genesis 1:11-12 and 1:26-27 Trees came before Adam.
Genesis 2:4-9 Trees came after Adam.

Genesis 1:20-21 and 26-27 Birds were created before Adam.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:19 Birds were created after Adam.

Genesis 1:24-27 Animals were created before Adam.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:19 Animals were created after Adam.

Genesis 1:26-27 Adam and Eve were created at the same time.
Genesis 2:7 and 2:21-22 Adam was created first, woman sometime later.

You must have omitted a word or phrase.

The Bible I use says "Now the Lord God had formed....." which implies that God already created the animals and the author was just reminding the reader that the animals were there.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #863 on: December 15, 2013, 12:52:37 PM »
I am biting my tongue and bidding adieu to all conversations with you, Skeptic. No progress whatsoever has been made in this thread or any other, no meetings of the minds has occurred, and I find the whole exercise to be a total waste of energy and bandwidth. Even now you think that you've convinced Quesi of something, when you merely answered her question. She now understands your perspective. And even now, you insists that science is circular but ignores the fact that nothing is more circular than the bible. I can't take it any more.

Skep, if you are really determined to bring folks to your Jesus, you're in the wrong place. I suggest that you rethink your participation here as well. After nearly 1200 posts, you have accomplished nothing positive, and lots negative. For me personally, my opinion of christians in general has fallen several notches because of you.  Your energies too would be better used elsewhere.

Since you haven't bothered responding to my major posts, there is certainly no need to respond to this minor one. I'm tired of you, I assume you're tired of me. I have never ever put a participant on WWGHA into "ignore" status, but I am going to do that right now with you. That's no way to be a winner.

PP

Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #864 on: December 15, 2013, 12:55:01 PM »
I am biting my tongue and bidding adieu to all conversations with you, Skeptic. No progress whatsoever has been made in this thread or any other, no meetings of the minds has occurred, and I find the whole exercise to be a total waste of energy and bandwidth. Even now you think that you've convinced Quesi of something, when you merely answered her question. She now understands your perspective. And even now, you insists that science is circular but ignores the fact that nothing is more circular than the bible. I can't take it any more.

Skep, if you are really determined to bring folks to your Jesus, you're in the wrong place. I suggest that you rethink your participation here as well. After nearly 1200 posts, you have accomplished nothing positive, and lots negative. For me personally, my opinion of christians in general has fallen several notches because of you.  Your energies too would be better used elsewhere.

Since you haven't bothered responding to my major posts, there is certainly no need to respond to this minor one. I'm tired of you, I assume you're tired of me. I have never ever put a participant on WWGHA into "ignore" status, but I am going to do that right now with you. That's no way to be a winner.

PP

I am sorry you feel that way. To me, everything I say makes perfect sense.

I just find it shocking that your opinion of Christians has fallen because of me, but when we bring up how our opinion of atheists has fallen because of Stalin and Pol Pot, you guys get upset and say that's not fair.

All I'm asking for is consistency on both sides.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Quesi

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #865 on: December 15, 2013, 01:03:26 PM »


I am sorry you feel that way. To me, everything I say makes perfect sense.


We know that.  And I think most of us understand the futility. 

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #866 on: December 15, 2013, 02:59:58 PM »


All I'm asking for is consistency on both sides.

Actually we are consistently right and you are consistently wrong, so that much has been achieved
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #867 on: December 15, 2013, 03:07:01 PM »
I am biting my tongue and bidding adieu to all conversations with you, Skeptic. No progress whatsoever has been made in this thread or any other, no meetings of the minds has occurred, and I find the whole exercise to be a total waste of energy and bandwidth. Even now you think that you've convinced Quesi of something, when you merely answered her question. She now understands your perspective. And even now, you insists that science is circular but ignores the fact that nothing is more circular than the bible. I can't take it any more.

Skep, if you are really determined to bring folks to your Jesus, you're in the wrong place. I suggest that you rethink your participation here as well. After nearly 1200 posts, you have accomplished nothing positive, and lots negative. For me personally, my opinion of christians in general has fallen several notches because of you.  Your energies too would be better used elsewhere.

Since you haven't bothered responding to my major posts, there is certainly no need to respond to this minor one. I'm tired of you, I assume you're tired of me. I have never ever put a participant on WWGHA into "ignore" status, but I am going to do that right now with you. That's no way to be a winner.

PP

I am sorry you feel that way. To me, everything I say makes perfect sense.

I just find it shocking that your opinion of Christians has fallen because of me, but when we bring up how our opinion of atheists has fallen because of Stalin and Pol Pot, you guys get upset and say that's not fair.

All I'm asking for is consistency on both sides.
Since when did being a murderous dictator,who wishes to stay in power have anything to do with Atheism?
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline Zankuu

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #868 on: December 15, 2013, 03:16:25 PM »
You haven't heard a peep from Him because you're an atheist. God does not show up where He's not wanted.

I feel like I'm repeating myself from months ago... Many of us were once sincere Christians that prayed daily and we never heard a peep. You were asked why months ago and never had an answer. Why does God ignore people like me but not others, like you? Plus what you say here doesn't jive with your conversion story. You said that you were an atheist that prayed to Yahweh to heal a dog, and he actually answered that prayer. God answered an atheist (and it contradicts what you typed). If I were to get on my knees today and pray and honestly tell God I want to accept his son as my Lord and Savior, I wouldn't hear or feel anything. Explain why.

If being an atheist isn't the reason God doesn't speak to us, and being sincere isn't the reason God doesn't speak to us, then what's the reason?
Leave nothing to chance. Overlook nothing. Combine contradictory observations. Allow yourself enough time. -Hippocrates of Cos

Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: Would You Ever Torture Your Children With Fire In in the Basement?
« Reply #869 on: December 15, 2013, 03:24:23 PM »
I am sorry you feel that way. To me, everything I say makes perfect sense.

I just find it shocking that your opinion of Christians has fallen because of me, but when we bring up how our opinion of atheists has fallen because of Stalin and Pol Pot, you guys get upset and say that's not fair.

All I'm asking for is consistency on both sides.
Since when did being a murderous dictator,who wishes to stay in power have anything to do with Atheism?
[/quote]

Sadly, 12, you quoted him, and quotes aren't deleted in the ignore system. But tell the dude if he wants to compare his effect on the world favorably with Pol Pot and Stalin, that's his business. Its not at all what I said, but if he wants to interpret it that heavy-handedly, that's up to him.

I was just saying I was less impressed with christians now that I know more about how they fail to think. That doesn't mean I assume they are all tyrants and such.

It'll probably hurt his feelings that I don't think he's a tyrant.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.