Author Topic: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.  (Read 14565 times)

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #174 on: December 27, 2013, 02:36:06 PM »
I worship my God because of love.

Prove it? Your conscience has made you aware of God. If not why do you resist him. If you knew for sure he didn't exist you wouldn't even be on this site. You would forget about that and worry about other things in life. But yet you engage in conversation of something you say you don't believe in.

Friend, I don't say this to hurt you in any way. I mean no disrespect to you in any way, I am just answering the question.

No, myths have made us aware that some people think there is a god. We are on this site because we are trying to ward off the damage religions do, not because we're on the verge of changing our minds. Until theists can come to their senses and stop believing, we have work to do. Because the many harms of religion is of great concern to those of us that do not believe.

We engage in this conversation because others engage in nonsense, and that nonsense negatively effects our world.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline lotanddaughters

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #175 on: December 27, 2013, 02:38:56 PM »
I worship my God Green Goblin because of love.

Prove it? Your conscience has made you aware of God Green Goblin. If not why do you resist him. If you knew for sure he didn't exist you wouldn't even be on this site. You would forget about that and worry about other things in life. But yet you engage in conversation of something you say you don't believe in.

Friend, I don't say this to hurt you in any way. I mean no disrespect to you in any way, I am just answering the question.

The striking out and replacing with another mythical creature isn't my idea. I learned it here at WWGHA. But, since you're new here, I figured you would appreciate being enlightened by this little ditty that destroys your God with elegant ease.
Enough with your bullshit.
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Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #176 on: December 27, 2013, 02:45:36 PM »
If what you are saying is true. How can Christians be the minority but yet the birth of Christ is our nations largest holiday. Why has the Holy Bible been the #1 selling book the entirety of your life. Why is there a time in history that time became BC. Oh, maybe it was by pure chance.

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #177 on: December 27, 2013, 02:47:03 PM »
If what you are saying is true. How can Christians be the minority but yet the birth of Christ is our nations largest holiday. Why has the Holy Bible been the #1 selling book the entirety of your life. Why is there a time in history that time became BC. Oh, maybe it was by pure chance.

There is apparently no limit on how many people can be wrong.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline lotanddaughters

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #178 on: December 27, 2013, 03:00:15 PM »
Yeah, he must be doing a hell of a job, because I've had enough of this for today, and am leaving work now to get a start on my hedonistic, sinful weekend, which will involve copious amounts of alcohol, marijuana, and unprotected sex with a smokin' hot eastern european woman 16 years my junior.  8)

Have a nice day.


I know. Isn't it unbelievable?


Some ancient dude made some rules, attributed them to a god, and probably lived your upcoming weekend for the rest of his entire life.


Thou shalt not kill.

Good. Looks like if the people obey, nobody is disposing of the leader. He is free to continue pounding on all that sweet ass.



Thou shalt not steal.

Good. He no longer needs to be worried about his shit. He is free to continue pounding on all that sweet ass.



Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife, nor his ass.

Good. When they go around conquering the neighboring villages, this dude always gets the majority of the new available brides anyway. And, if he wants your wife, all he has to do is accuse you of picking up sticks on the wrong day or some shit.  He is then free to continue pounding on all that sweet ass.



Thousands of years later, this long-dead dude is still preventing people from doing the things they naturally desire.

Not me, Motherfucker. Not me. I've got news for motherfuckers.

Have a nice weekend.  ;D
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Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #179 on: December 27, 2013, 03:01:50 PM »
Maybe someone would care to educate me on atheism. I have noticed there are several beliefs. It would seem that it is somewhat as spread out as religion. Are there different types of atheists?

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #180 on: December 27, 2013, 03:20:50 PM »
Maybe someone would care to educate me on atheism. I have noticed there are several beliefs. It would seem that it is somewhat as spread out as religion. Are there different types of atheists?

It is actually pretty simple. There are atheists, who say that they don't think there are gods or any god, regardless of the religion. And there are agnostics, who say that we don't have enough information to know if there is a god, and most of them tend to assume there probably isn't. They just don't claim to know for sure.

Other than that, we are individuals. Since we don't have a single book or a set of religious texts to follow, we aren't limited ion our lack of belief.

I'm a full-blown "there is no god of any kind" kind of guy. I say that yours doesn't exist, the hindu god doesn't exist, the zoroastrian god doesn't exist, the coyote god of some American Indian tribes doesn't exist.

Do I know for sure I'm right? Nope. If a god shows up, introduces himself in some irrefutable manner, and proceeds to skewer me and put over a Sears gas barbecue, right about then I'll believe. Until then, I don't think so.

You, as a theist, believe in stories. I, as one who has no capability to fool myself that much, do not.

I think its genetic.
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Offline Astreja

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #181 on: December 27, 2013, 03:22:33 PM »
Why are we here, Charlie?  Not because your god is real, but because believers are real and interfere in our day-to-day lives.

With the more rabidly religious among us constantly trying to force their beliefs into health care, scientific research, education and politics, consider yourself very, very lucky that we prefer to talk out our anger rather than act it out.  I can't begin to count the number of times My blood pressure has spiked while reading a story of a women's health care clinic losing its funding, a child bullied for asserting his right not to pray, or an elected official putting forth some stupid legislation that clearly violates the nation's constitution in favour of his imaginary friend.

Don't even get Me started on the rage I feel when someone credits a healing to "God" instead of to the dozens of hard-working medical professionals who did the work.

I do find it funny (in a sad-clown kind of way) that you speak about respecting us, yet use terms of pseudo-familiarity such as "dear" and "friend."  That is rude, condescending and completely inappropriate.  How would you like it if I walked into your workplace in a too-short miniskirt, struck a pose with one of My gams poised delicately on your desk chair, and crooned (in front of your immediate superior and your co-workers), "Hei, darling!  That report you promised Me is just a bit late.  I'm going to have to dis-cipline you." *leer*

(At this, Springy G shudders to the core of Her being)  Ick.  Even I don't like that, and I made it up!

But try to look at things from our side of the fence, Charlie:  What you're doing with Bible quotations is essentially verbal and psychological abuse by proxy.  We dislike being told that people are evil and worthless, especially when we know that we're neither of those things.  Perhaps you should let your god tell us that -- In person, not out of a book.
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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #182 on: December 27, 2013, 03:28:20 PM »
I worship my God because of love.
Charlie, you have a strange definition of love then. Perhaps you could explain it for me? What I see you saying is that if you do not express this "love" in the form of extreme adulation, then you will suffer eternal and horrendous consequences.

That emotion is not love, that is more akin to fear. Further, your description sounds more like an abused partner rationalising and protecting their abuser, than emotion given freely without negative consequences. This is particularly so if you readily accept the mantle of being wrong, unworthy, and never being able to meet some arbitrary standard, as you seem to do.

Still, perhaps that mantle is the same fully-functional cloak of invisibility that your god also wears? In which case it might be somewhat cool to watch the TV infomercials, then buy one and get a second one free. Paying only for the cost of the additional shipping and handling.

It's also not love when you are obligated into doing something to repay a debt for something someone else is accused of doing. That's not love, that's emotional manipulation.

So, tell me please, how is what you are obligated to do in deference to punishment, love?

Quote
Prove it? Your conscience has made you aware of God. If not why do you resist him.
It has? That's news to me. Frankly, I think that you are projecting here and it's a lot more than finger puppets. Although it's likely as real.

Based on one of your comments my regretting getting sick after eating those days-old leftovers isn't my conscience (at least not in the way you are implying), nor is it me recognising a sin, nor is it me being aware of some god. It's actually me being aware of those remarkable micrometer sized single-celled organisms that your god so finely tuned with the ability to inflict great harm on us humans.

I also don't resist what hasn't been proven to exist, particularly when it's often couched in excuses why it can't be demonstrated to be real. I find that a better strategy than fretting about being cast into imaginary places for imaginary offences, as decided by imaginary beings. But that's just me. I'm kinda weird in that respect.

Quote
If you knew for sure he didn't exist you wouldn't even be on this site. You would forget about that and worry about other things in life. But yet you engage in conversation of something you say you don't believe in.
Would you please pass that message on to the folks here, here, and here. When you've attended to those, please let me know and, together, we can work on the others.

Quote
Friend, I don't say this to hurt you in any way. I mean no disrespect to you in any way, I am just answering the question.
Pretty much the same here.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2013, 03:31:24 PM by xyzzy »
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You are in a maze of twisty little religions, all alike -- xyzzy

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #183 on: December 27, 2013, 03:35:49 PM »
If anyone, just one, feels that I am not welcome here anymore, I will promptly withdraw myself.

I don't believe you.  You've lied to me before, why should I believe this?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #184 on: December 27, 2013, 03:41:36 PM »
ParkingPlaces, thank you, that was very informative. I have a better understanding.

I'm going to take some time and see if I can figure out the proper use of this site.

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #185 on: December 27, 2013, 10:10:59 PM »
I'm going to take some time and see if I can figure out the proper use of this site.

You must be joking...

Uses for this site.

A: debating with theists.
B: debating with atheists.
C: chilling out in the chatter forum, and posting whatever you want.
D: getting confined to the shelter and enjoying the fact that no one is allowed to - darwin you.

It is actually pretty simple. There are atheists, who say that they don't think there are gods or any god, regardless of the religion. And there are agnostics, who say that we don't have enough information to know if there is a god, and most of them tend to assume there probably isn't. They just don't claim to know for sure.

Not to be a nitpicker, but agnosticism is based on knowledge, atheism is based on belief (or lack of belief in this case).
You can be a Gnostic atheist, or an agnostic atheist.
The same way as you can be a Gnostic theist, or an agnostic theist.
« Last Edit: December 27, 2013, 10:13:32 PM by Angus and Alexis »
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Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #186 on: December 28, 2013, 06:27:21 AM »
I remember reading a post yesterday that stated Jesus never healed an amputee.

What is halt and maimed in the Bible? Let's see what Jesus said.

Matthew 18:8  Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee, it is better for thee to enter into life halt and maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.

Halt is to be deprived of a foot, crippled. Jesus is here talking about the foot.
Maimed is to be seriously disfigured or missing a limb. Jesus here is talking about the hands.

Matthew 15:30-31  And great multitudes came unto him, having with them those that were lame, blind, dumb, maimed, and many others, and cast them down at Jesus feet, and he healed them.
Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see, and they glorified the God of Israel.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #187 on: December 28, 2013, 06:33:28 AM »
I remember reading a post yesterday that stated Jesus never healed an amputee.

What is halt and maimed in the Bible? Let's see what Jesus said.

Matthew 18:8  Wherefore if thy hand or thy foot offend thee, cut them off, and cast them from thee, it is better for thee to enter into life halt and maimed, rather than having two hands or two feet to be cast into everlasting fire.

Halt is to be deprived of a foot, crippled. Jesus is here talking about the foot.
Maimed is to be seriously disfigured or missing a limb. Jesus here is talking about the hands.

Matthew 15:30-31  And great multitudes came unto him, having with them those that were lame, blind, dumb, maimed, and many others, and cast them down at Jesus feet, and he healed them.
Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see, and they glorified the God of Israel.

Do you accept what was written in the Iliad as factual?
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #188 on: December 28, 2013, 06:37:13 AM »
I remember reading a post yesterday that stated Jesus never healed an amputee.

What is halt and maimed in the Bible? Let's see what Jesus said.....

Or rather, let's not, because it is irrelevant.

In your faith you present a book, that sets out the myth of your chosen god.  It is pointless to try to use that book as proof of itself - any holy book would be expected to be generally consistent in its self-referencing (though many fail to do so in the detail).  What is important is if sources or experience outside that holy book confirm what it says.

Example: the holy book of Anfauglir says that he is eight foot tall.  It further says that he towers over people.  Can we use "towers over" to prove the truth of his alleged eight foot height?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #189 on: December 28, 2013, 10:49:20 AM »
What is halt and maimed in the Bible? Let's see what Jesus said.

Whoa, whoa, slow down there.

What jesus said means squat unless you can prove it is factual.
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Offline G-Roll

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #190 on: December 28, 2013, 03:51:48 PM »
I have stated the conscience is a God-given trait to make you aware of the presence of sin. It works as a checkup, if you will, for the believer throughout day to day life. It says: don't do that.

Well, there's another purpose for the conscience. The Bible speaks many times and in various places about a Day of Judgement. Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord. In that day, many shall say Lord we didn't know, and God will say, your conscience bears witness of your sins, depart from me I never knew you
 
I don't know what you can do with it, but there it is.

You have provided nothing to support your claim that god gave you a conscience. It is my train of thought that you know you have no reason to think god gave you a conscience and ignore the FACT that Satan is the reason for a conscience and Christian morality. All you have done to refute that point is tell me how awful Satan is. Yet you have zero evidence of Satan doing anything half as evil as your god. Charlie you are crazy. You seem like a nice guy but until you provide evidence that god gave you knoweldge of right and wrong and thus birthed morality you are nuts for thinking god had anything to do with it.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #191 on: December 28, 2013, 08:08:04 PM »
Look guys, I am a mere man such as yourselves. I don't have all the answers!! You say, I want to see God in person, or an awesome display of his power and I will believe. Please allow me to show you why you or scientists will never see God until the second coming. I have no other source but the Bible itself.

My only purpose here is to show you why you will not see God through the physical realm as we humans know it.

The Bible tells us several times that our sins have separated us from God. This is a physical separation not spiritual. If it were spiritual there would be no religion on earth. It would just be separation in every aspect. So how, when and where did this separation take place?

When God created man in the Garden of Eden it was a perfect environment. There was no good or evil, it was perfection. They didn't even need clothing. The Bible makes it clear they were to live forever without end in their physical bodies. Then they sinned. This is where it all begins. This is when the entire world was changed forever. This is where God separated himself from man.

Because one mans sin has entered into the world we are all born in sin. The separation from God continues until that which is perfect comes again, The Christ.

Because of sin, God can no longer be in the presence of man, but by spirit. Man was the the one who caused it, not God. The Bible was written by holy men of old, inspired by the Holy Spirit, for God to communicate with us. He can no longer communicate with man physically because of sin.

You may say if God is God he can do anything, and could have avoided all of this. No, God has given man free will to do or think as he pleases. Man ultimately will determine his own destination. God has never forced himself on anyone. That's why the just shall live by faith. 

 

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #192 on: December 28, 2013, 08:56:08 PM »
Look guys, I am a mere man such as yourselves. I don't have all the answers!! You say, I want to see God in person, or an awesome display of his power and I will believe. Please allow me to show you why you or scientists will never see God until the second coming. I have no other source but the Bible itself.

My only purpose here is to show you why you will not see God through the physical realm as we humans know it.

The Bible tells us several times that our sins have separated us from God. This is a physical separation not spiritual. If it were spiritual there would be no religion on earth. It would just be separation in every aspect. So how, when and where did this separation take place?

When God created man in the Garden of Eden it was a perfect environment. There was no good or evil, it was perfection. They didn't even need clothing. The Bible makes it clear they were to live forever without end in their physical bodies. Then they sinned. This is where it all begins. This is when the entire world was changed forever. This is where God separated himself from man.

Because one mans sin has entered into the world we are all born in sin. The separation from God continues until that which is perfect comes again, The Christ.

Because of sin, God can no longer be in the presence of man, but by spirit. Man was the the one who caused it, not God. The Bible was written by holy men of old, inspired by the Holy Spirit, for God to communicate with us. He can no longer communicate with man physically because of sin.

You may say if God is God he can do anything, and could have avoided all of this. No, God has given man free will to do or think as he pleases. Man ultimately will determine his own destination. God has never forced himself on anyone. That's why the just shall live by faith. 

 

I assume you just don't count the folks who had direct contact with your god after the garden. The ones he talked to and stuff. And showed his behind to. Things like that. They don't count as direct contact. Even though that's exactly what happened. Because that would be inconvenient for your to explain after writing the above.

As myths go, the christian version would be as harmless as the rest of the worlds myths if it didn't insist that stuff like sin was true. The original sin story offers up what has to be the most simplistic explanation for human behavior ever concocted. It is so absurd that the word absurd is inadequate.

Human being evolved. There was no pressure on us, biologically, to behave so well that even christians would be pleased. In the olden days, some people, in a culture you admire, who lacked adequate information, made something up to explain why everything wasn't puppy dogs and roses. You still believe them today, and try to influence our modern culture with that absolutely useless concept.

If you applied the same logic to arithmetic, every math problem would have the answer '2' because that is how many humans we started out with.

There is no connection between human behavior and your sorry story. Except for the part that some people believe it, and their actions reflect their belief in that reality. In some cases, it may indeed cause a few people to act nicer. In others, some apparently keep right on doing bad things because they think they're going to hell anyway. In any case, there is no connection with reality, and the connection with the human psyche is all artificial.

Christians cherish sin. It is the basis for all that is precious to them. They dwell on it. We have had christians come here and tell us that there would be nothing to stop them from killing people if they thought that sin and the Jesus story were not true. That is how much your story, which is wrong, wrong, wrong, can negatively effect people.

There is a modern acronym, KISS, which stands for Keep It Simple, Stupid. It if often good advice. But christians demand that it have a different meaning: Keep It Stupid, Stupid! Because thinking isn't allowed within your religion. Not the kind of thinking that might cause one to question the, you know, stupidity of insisting that your god loves us but no so much that he's going to do anything about it. You tout free will as the most wonderful thing ever, insist that we need it, then proudly damn each and every person who exercises it to hell if we don't kowtow to the east or whatever it is your religion claims will help.

If there were a god, the only super power he would have is being super selfish. But he doesn't exist, so the onus is on the believers. Now christians aren't the only one with gods who want dumb things, but that is the subject of this discussion, so I'm talking to you. You are harming our world. You are further damaging what is already an imperfect planet by distorting important truths and pretending you have viable answers.

I know you honestly believe the stories to be true. But if you can't look at what you are saying and understand how false the story is, then you will, for the rest of your life, continue to spread untruths, and you will help spread the damage that religion does to our world.

You were wronged when you were told the story is true. You are wronging others by continuing that sad tradition.

The only thing you have going for yourself right now is that when you die and nothing happens, you won't be aware of how wrong you have a been. You'll have wasted your life disseminating bad information and never know it. Until then, you will be continuing the spread of pain, all in the name of something that you wrongly think is wonderful.

Nothing should be able to distort the truth that much. But lies always can. And the most vulnerable of us are the most prone to believing them. Which makes everything that much worse.

Christianity is so far from the truth that it should be illegal to have the words  'christianity' and 'truth' within ten miles of each other. Until you realize how wrong christianity is, and how wrong your beliefs, make you, you will continue to be part of the problem. And I will remind you just as often as I can.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #193 on: December 28, 2013, 09:10:04 PM »
Let me ask you Parkingplaces, have you ever committed a sin?

Offline Azdgari

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #194 on: December 28, 2013, 09:12:22 PM »
Let me ask you Parkingplaces, have you ever committed a sin?

Charlie, this shows that you don't yet know what an atheist is.  It would help if you backed up and got that down first, because it would show you why this question above ^^ is so silly.
The highest moral human authority is copied by our Gandhi neurons through observation.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #195 on: December 28, 2013, 09:22:13 PM »
Let me rephrase, have you ever done anything you knew was wrong? Or are you afraid to answer the question hiding behind the disguise of your belief?

Offline Antidote

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #196 on: December 28, 2013, 09:24:14 PM »
Let me rephrase, have you ever done anything you knew was wrong? Or are you afraid to answer the question hiding behind the disguise of your belief?

This is a "gotcha" question, nothing more nothing less, if he answers truthfully, you'll say "see, see? You have an innate morality!", if he declines to answer, you'll use that against him.
According to Cpt. Obvious: Theists think they know God, Atheists require evidence.

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Do not assume I was religious in any way, I have never been religious.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #197 on: December 28, 2013, 09:28:30 PM »
If your not going to answer the question, don't reply to me anymore!! It's put up or shut up!!

Offline Azdgari

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #198 on: December 28, 2013, 09:29:43 PM »
Your question wasn't even addressed to him, Charlie.
The highest moral human authority is copied by our Gandhi neurons through observation.

Offline Antidote

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #199 on: December 28, 2013, 09:31:09 PM »
If your not going to answer the question, don't reply to me anymore!! It's put up or shut up!!

Well this was quite uncalled for, especially when you're not exactly forthcoming with direct answers yourself.
According to Cpt. Obvious: Theists think they know God, Atheists require evidence.

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Do not assume I was religious in any way, I have never been religious.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #200 on: December 28, 2013, 09:34:49 PM »
[Preaching removed]
GB Mod
« Last Edit: December 29, 2013, 04:07:21 AM by Graybeard »

Offline Azdgari

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #201 on: December 28, 2013, 09:36:43 PM »
Charlie, before it gets buried - do you understand why telling someone to 'put up and answer the question or shut up' is inappropriate, when you didn't ask that person the question in the first place?
The highest moral human authority is copied by our Gandhi neurons through observation.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #202 on: December 28, 2013, 09:41:31 PM »
Why doesn't that person answer the question? Because he is condemning himself is he does.