Author Topic: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.  (Read 13199 times)

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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Why should I believe in your Yahweh, when I know that Atum created the world.

Heretic!

Its obvious Thor and Odin are the real gods, they killed all the frost giants!

Do you see any frost giants outside? I think not!
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Offline One Above All

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Why should I believe in your Yahweh, when I know that Atum created the world.

Heretic!

Its obvious Thor and Odin are the real gods, they killed all the frost giants!

Do you see any frost giants outside? I think not!

*Cough*

*Points at self*
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Angus and Alexis

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What blatantly vague, inevitable, predictable prediction did you make?

What magic did you do? D:
Rule 1: No pooftas. Rule 2: No maltreating the theists, IF, anyone is watching. Rule 3: No pooftas. Rule 4: I do not want to see anyone NOT drinking after light out. Rule 5: No pooftas. Rule 6: There is NO...rule 6.

Offline One Above All

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What blatantly vague, inevitable, predictable prediction did you make?

I predict that, from every universe spawned by Myself or the other gods, a being will arise and join Us in eternal enlightenment.

What magic did you do? D:

Creating entire universes isn't good enough for you?
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Angus and Alexis

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I predict that, from every universe spawned by Myself or the other gods, a being will arise and join Us in eternal enlightenment.

Creating entire universes isn't good enough for you?

Blimey, such complexity of words, i cannot understand your great mysteriousness!

*Bows down*

What must i do lord to get eternal life?
Rule 1: No pooftas. Rule 2: No maltreating the theists, IF, anyone is watching. Rule 3: No pooftas. Rule 4: I do not want to see anyone NOT drinking after light out. Rule 5: No pooftas. Rule 6: There is NO...rule 6.

Offline One Above All

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What must i do lord to get eternal life?

Evolve.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Evolve.

*end stupid RP*

So...theists who still want to claim that brain processes are from god...*sigh*
Rule 1: No pooftas. Rule 2: No maltreating the theists, IF, anyone is watching. Rule 3: No pooftas. Rule 4: I do not want to see anyone NOT drinking after light out. Rule 5: No pooftas. Rule 6: There is NO...rule 6.

Offline Hatter23

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Explain how those chemicals and electrons let you know that what you just did was wrong. That little voice in the skull is the conscience that divides right from wrong. No science in that.

There's no science in the way brain chemistry affects one's judgement? Please notify the ENTIRE PHARMACOLOGICAL INDUSTRY!!!!!

Seriously, do ever stop to look at what you type and consider how stupid it is?
« Last Edit: December 26, 2013, 12:34:43 PM by Hatter23 »
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Hatter23

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And how does one "win" at life?

and furthermore, wouldn't having no arms make it hard to put the little pegs in the little holes on the little plastic cars?
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline G-Roll

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^^
They would have to spin the wheel with their toes as well.

Why can't Theist just say my god doesn't interact in this world like he was documented in the Old Testament anymore? Instead we get god doesn’t heal amputees (Harbinger77 not included) because he is real and overly loving.

Offline Astreja

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Heretic!

Its obvious Thor and Odin are the real gods, they killed all the frost giants!

Do you see any frost giants outside? I think not!

My little brother and Dad say "Hei!"

You have to watch out for frost giant DNA, 'tho -- Y'know, the little 6-pointed thingies that pile up in the driveway on a cold winter day?  And I wouldn't trust those snowmen, either...  ;)
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Offline Astreja

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I appreciate your opinion, however you have taken "conscience" out of context from my meaning.
Do you know why God destroyed those people?

Because he has a real problem with imperfection and human bad behaviour, and thought killing everything was a jolly good idea.  (BTW, Bastet has a contract out on his sorry head for what he did to Her kittens.)

More seriously, Charlie, it's a myth.  The Noachide flood simply did not happen, and there is no way that Noah and his family could have put that many animals into a wooden boat and have it stay afloat for 40 days while the rains were coming down at the rate of 30 feet per hour[1].

I am quite convinced that your god is mythical.  However, that doesn't stop it from being used as an excuse for horrific wars and persecutions.
 1. The height of Chomolungma (Mount Everest), 29,029 feet, divided by 960 hours (40 hours x 24 hours per day) = 30.238 feet/hour.
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Offline charlie24

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I'm sure you guys have more constructive conversation than Charlie is a piece of shi* and Charlie is an idiot, and hail Satan. How about let's be adults here.

Offline One Above All

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #100 on: December 26, 2013, 04:02:31 PM »
I'm sure you guys have more constructive conversation than Charlie is a piece of shi* and Charlie is an idiot, and hail Satan. How about let's be adults here.

How about you ignore and/or report those and focus on the ones that made thoughtful responses, rather than use the former as an excuse not to deal with the latter?
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Astreja

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #101 on: December 26, 2013, 04:11:31 PM »
I'm sure you guys have more constructive conversation than Charlie is a piece of shi* and Charlie is an idiot, and hail Satan. How about let's be adults here.

I think G-Roll made a very good point, Charlie.  Here it is again, with emphasis:

The problem is (according to you) that god created your mind to convince you that you are a piece of shit. God doesn’t live in my mind so I have no need to hate myself for being a mere human.

Note the difference:  *We* aren't likening you to excrement; that's Christian "Original Sin" theology, taken primarily from the Pauline epistles rather than from the supposed words of Jesus.  It views mankind as fatally flawed and fit only for damnation.  This is a bleak, absolutist dualist view, good god versus evil humans, that deliberately devalues the good works that humans regularly do.  It is one of the most destructive philosophies ever taught on this planet, and has done vastly more harm than good over the centuries.
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #102 on: December 26, 2013, 04:12:33 PM »
I'm sure you guys have more constructive conversation than Charlie is a piece of shi* and Charlie is an idiot, and hail Satan. How about let's be adults here.

How about you ignore and/or report those and focus on the ones that made thoughtful responses, rather than use the former as an excuse not to deal with the latter?

(Raises hand). Because it's easier to complain about the trivia than engage with the tough questions?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #103 on: December 26, 2013, 04:17:43 PM »
Hi Astreja, I never got back to you. Been kinda busy as you can see.
I wish I could see your post while I'm writing, I haven't figured out how maneuver here yet. Maybe their right about me being an idiot, lol.
I think we were talking about why God utterly destroyed those civilizations, nations, and tribes in the old testament. Basically it was to keep from having to destroy the world again. At the time the Hebrews reached the promised land with Moses having passed away and Joshua now leading, they were the only people on earth that believed in the true God. All other nations believed false Gods.
God knew they would never believe him, so the Bible says God told Joshua to destroy all living flesh including the animals. If the Hebrews had gone in peaceably they would have mingled with the heathen and lost sight of God. Forcing Gods hand to destroy the earth again. Just what he had already done because "man continuously thought evil and cursed God."
 But here's the good news, God doesn't do that anymore because the perfect sacrifice has come. We are no longer under law but we are now living under grace, the new covenant Jesus Christ.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #104 on: December 26, 2013, 04:31:44 PM »
Hi Astreja, I never got back to you. Been kinda busy as you can see.
I wish I could see your post while I'm writing, I haven't figured out how maneuver here yet. Maybe their right about me being an idiot, lol.
I think we were talking about why God utterly destroyed those civilizations, nations, and tribes in the old testament. Basically it was to keep from having to destroy the world again. At the time the Hebrews reached the promised land with Moses having passed away and Joshua now leading, they were the only people on earth that believed in the true God. All other nations believed false Gods.
God knew they would never believe him, so the Bible says God told Joshua to destroy all living flesh including the animals. If the Hebrews had gone in peaceably they would have mingled with the heathen and lost sight of God. Forcing Gods hand to destroy the earth again. Just what he had already done because "man continuously thought evil and cursed God."
 But here's the good news, God doesn't do that anymore because the perfect sacrifice has come. We are no longer under law but we are now living under grace, the new covenant Jesus Christ.

Notice the circular think here: God Knew they would never believe him.

God could have made those in question in a way where they would have accepted Joshua
God could have shown up himself in his awe inspiring glory and would have been way more impressive than carved idols and said false religions would dry up within the week
God could have given Joshua Mighty powers to subvert the laws of physics, like waiving his hand and the weapons of other civilizations fall to dust, forgoing the need for utter destruction
God could have written his instructon to submit to Joshua in the sky


but no, an Omnipotent and Omnicent God...best he can come up with is utter destruction....and that's not very advanced morality.

But still, none the less the stories have all the weight of those in the Iliad.
« Last Edit: December 26, 2013, 04:50:20 PM by Hatter23 »
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #105 on: December 26, 2013, 04:32:04 PM »
Now, now, little children lets be quiet while the adults are speaking.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #106 on: December 26, 2013, 04:33:47 PM »
Now, now, little children lets be quiet while the adults are speaking.

care to address the substance of my arguments?
« Last Edit: December 26, 2013, 05:00:29 PM by Hatter23 »
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #107 on: December 26, 2013, 04:41:07 PM »
Ahh, but you fail to realize God has given man free will to do whatever we want, good or bad. God never forces anyone to do his will. I can give you scripture if you like. That's why we don't see God, instead he gave us his word (the Bible). He places his word above his name. Need any scripture let me know.

Offline G-Roll

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #108 on: December 26, 2013, 04:45:06 PM »
I'm sure you guys have more constructive conversation than Charlie is a piece of shi* and Charlie is an idiot, and hail Satan. How about let's be adults here.

First of all I don’t think you are a piece of shit. Your god does. You strike me as a well spoken gentleman. Unfortunately I can't say the same for how Yahweh sees you.
Second, I didn’t call you an idiot. Well not directly in exact words. I used colorful banter to make my point. I apologize if I offended you but sarcasm is my first langue and I would expect a theist who joins an atheist website would have a bit of thicker skin.
Third, why not hail Satan for our consciousness? For our ability to know right from wrong? If Satan was the serpent he is the reason we have that. Unless you believe god controls everything including Satan and this was all part of a divine elaborate plan.
It is still a mystery to me how you attribute your consciousness, morality, or anything else that separates us from the animal kingdom to god. The ability to realize you are naked to know good from evil are gifts from Satan.

Quote
How about let's be adults here.
Why? Being immature and childish have gotten me this far. I fear I may be too far gone.  :(

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #109 on: December 26, 2013, 04:45:20 PM »
I can't work this site yet, but the guy talking about the omnipotent God is bringing the groceries home. Listen to him!!!

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #110 on: December 26, 2013, 04:46:17 PM »
Ahh, but you fail to realize God has given man free will to do whatever we want, good or bad. God never forces anyone to do his will. I can give you scripture if you like. That's why we don't see God, instead he gave us his word (the Bible). He places his word above his name. Need any scripture let me know.

Characters in the Bible actually defy God after they interact with God. So your own mythology denies the concept that this "god" character needs to be hidden for freewill to exist.

An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Dante

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #111 on: December 26, 2013, 04:46:26 PM »
I think we were talking about why God utterly destroyed those civilizations, nations, and tribes in the old testament. Basically it was to keep from having to destroy the world again. At the time the Hebrews reached the promised land with Moses having passed away and Joshua now leading, they were the only people on earth that believed in the true God. All other nations believed false Gods.
God knew they would never believe him, so the Bible says God told Joshua to destroy all living flesh including the animals. If the Hebrews had gone in peaceably they would have mingled with the heathen and lost sight of God. Forcing Gods hand to destroy the earth again. Just what he had already done because "man continuously thought evil and cursed God."

But do you not wonder why an omni-god, especailly the OT version, would have a need to exterminate so many people via other people, or a flood? Why not with a snap of it's holy fingers, or twitch of the nose?

I mean, why would an omniscient being not know that there would be plenty of sin and such even after the great flood? Why would it not realize that having his people (Joshua) do the wet work, when it could just as easily think the thought and eliminate those that "thought evil", wouldn't end the transgressions? And again, why would your god not realize that even that wouldn't be enough to rid the world of sin and evil, so it'd have an unforseen need to regenerate in human form and sacrifice itself to itself for it's own immutably flawed creations?

To me, that doesn't sound like a very well thought out, all powerful, all knowing plan for it's most beloved creation. Maybe the guy in my sig was on to something after all.....
« Last Edit: December 26, 2013, 04:49:38 PM by Dante »
Actually it doesn't. One could conceivably be all-powerful but not exceptionally intelligent.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #112 on: December 26, 2013, 04:48:24 PM »
No you haven't gone to far. As long as there is life there is hope.

Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #113 on: December 26, 2013, 05:11:47 PM »
NO, God doesn't need to hide himself. Allow me to take you back to the beginning and show you where man stands with God.
God created a perfect man and perfect woman (Adam and Eve). They were made to live forever with never facing a physical death, in the Garden of Eden. He tells them to eat of any fruit of the trees but the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. You see, they were naked and were not ashamed because they didn't know good or evil, they were in a perfect creation. Then comes the serpent (Satan) which means in Hebrew "the enemy and adversary". and you know the rest. Now sin has entered a perfect world. A holy righteous God told Adam that he would die if he ate of that tree. Now man has sinned and must now face a physical death. Whereby sin entered into the world by one man, all have sinned and come short of the glory God. This is where all mankind stands now before God. A sinner in need of a Saviour, and God has provided by the sacrifice of his son Jesus Christ. For God so loved the world he gave his only begotten son that whosoever shall believe in him shall nor perish but have everlasting life.
God has never failed man, man has always failed God, and God has always made a way for us. The love of God goes beyond human comprehension.   

Offline Astreja

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #114 on: December 26, 2013, 05:13:22 PM »
But here's the good news, God doesn't do that anymore because the perfect sacrifice has come. We are no longer under law but we are now living under grace, the new covenant Jesus Christ.

Sorry, Charlie -- I don't do human sacrifice.
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Offline charlie24

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Re: Why won't God heal amputees? Because he can make you win at life without it.
« Reply #115 on: December 26, 2013, 05:24:12 PM »
A righteous and holy God can accept nothing less than perfection into his kingdom. So how can mere man full of sin be accepted. By what Jesus did at Calvary, he suffered, bled and died there for our sins to be washed away. You see, when God sees a  born again Christian, who is also full of sin and imperfections, he doesn't see us, he sees the blood of Jesus on us and that makes us perfect. A bride fit for the bridegroom, as the Bible says.