Author Topic: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?  (Read 24599 times)

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Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1479 on: November 01, 2013, 12:05:39 AM »
Despite the fact that Jesus himself said, "I have not come to abolish the law, but to follow it. I tell you the truth: Not one jot, not one iota will pass from the law till ALL has been fufilled."

They forget that Jesus is there for them if they tried yet failed, not to do whatever they want, then activate thier forgive-o-matic. Jesus asks his followers to repent[1] and follow him. But Christians neither repent nor follow him. Making 'Christian' a misnomer... actually it should be Paulian because when Paul contradicts Jesus, who's edicts do Christians choose to follow? Paul's!
 1. which a condition is to try not to make the same sin again.

[Bold mine] Isn't that "fulfill"? I guess it depends on what version you're reading from.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously.

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1480 on: November 01, 2013, 12:07:51 AM »
Here is a video I would like the atheists to watch. It's about materialism vs immaterialism.



Please watch it because you might understand it better. We can then continue the discussion about it.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1481 on: November 01, 2013, 12:12:51 AM »
There's a video I would like you to watch skeptic but it may not be allowed since it's this atheist guy named "Nam" beating down this idiot Christian named "skeptic" because, it seems, he doesn't get that what he says means nothing to us unless it's not only in his own words but also that he backs it up with reality, evidence (non-biased), and credible sources not cheap cartoonish videos that are laughable.

It's a good a video but I don't think the site would allow it.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously.

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1482 on: November 01, 2013, 12:18:49 AM »
There's a video I would like you to watch skeptic but it may not be allowed since it's this atheist guy named "Nam" beating down this idiot Christian named "skeptic" because, it seems, he doesn't get that what he says means nothing to us unless it's not only in his own words but also that he backs it up with reality, evidence (non-biased), and credible sources not cheap cartoonish videos that are laughable.

It's a good a video but I don't think the site would allow it.

-Nam

Please, Nam. If you don't have anything credible to add to this conversation, then don't say anything.

I know people on here will watch it and respond. It is not laughable at all. It just explains it more concisely than I could.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1483 on: November 01, 2013, 12:24:00 AM »
There's a video I would like you to watch skeptic but it may not be allowed since it's this atheist guy named "Nam" beating down this idiot Christian named "skeptic" because, it seems, he doesn't get that what he says means nothing to us unless it's not only in his own words but also that he backs it up with reality, evidence (non-biased), and credible sources not cheap cartoonish videos that are laughable.

It's a good a video but I don't think the site would allow it.

-Nam

Please, Nam. If you don't have anything credible to add to this conversation, then don't say anything.

I know people on here will watch it and respond. It is not laughable at all. It just explains it more concisely than I could.

People would prefer my video therefore you're wrong. And it's sad for you because my video doesn't even exist, a lot like your god. COMMONALITY! I knew it could be achieved!

New ground, people! New ground!

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously.

Offline Azdgari

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1484 on: November 01, 2013, 12:53:14 AM »
So you agree it is evidence that God exists?

No.  Stop trying to jump the gun and think for a second.  If - IF - you try to use an answered prayer as evidence for gods, then nogodsforme's sister's unanswered prayer must be evidence against gods.

Rather than creaming your pants with ill-founded excitement and asking if I believe a god exists, could you for once try to honestly agree or disagree with the statement, and say why?

And I don't believe reality is subjective.

That is not what you argued.

I always said that according to atheistic materialism, you can't empirically prove an external world exists independent of the senses. It is merely taken on assumption.

Yes, you said that.  And as I and others pointed out to you, that's not a problem unique to materialism.  Immaterialism has precisely the same problem.  Materialism is off-topic to the problem.  You decided to change the topic at that point, as I recall.
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Offline Azdgari

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1485 on: November 01, 2013, 12:55:53 AM »
Here is a video I would like the atheists to watch. It's about materialism vs immaterialism.
<snip>
Please watch it because you might understand it better. We can then continue the discussion about it.

As has been pointed out to you by several people, the topic is first-year philosophy material.  And if you are unable to discuss it yourself, then just say so.  Don't post a video to do it for you.

Now, if you had a transcript of the video that could be quoted and analyzed, that could be passable.  Because then you could actually refer to it.  It's hard enough to educate you as it is.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 12:58:38 AM by Azdgari »
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Offline Ivellios

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1486 on: November 01, 2013, 06:13:22 AM »
[Bold mine] Isn't that "fulfill"? I guess it depends on what version you're reading from.

-Nam

Technically it does say 'fufill' however using that word in that manner makes Christians think it means, "I did it, so you don't have to."

ie. Jesus paid his taxes, therefore they're fufilled. So in Christian 'context' they don't have to pay taxes. Jesus gave tithes, so Christians don't have to tithe. Jesus never broke the speed limit, so it was fufilled so Christians can ignore that too. Jesus didn't rape anyone fufilling Duet 22, so Christians don't have to obey Duet 22 and rape as they please, etc, etc.

Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1487 on: November 01, 2013, 07:43:17 AM »
Somewhere, many pages ago, skeptic said that only 1 or 2 percent of people would get into heaven (it might have been less but I'm not reading the whole thread again).
Now if god created everything including us, and then sent himself down here to save us all, why would only 2% (being genorous here) be able to make it to heaven?
By any standard that is a piss poor result, that is a 98% failure rate.
That is an EPIC FAIL.
Clearly the sacrifice idea did not work.
You must have to seriously question a god that has, at most, a 2% success rate.
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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1488 on: November 01, 2013, 08:58:08 AM »
Christianism: God sent Himself as His son to die in a sacrifice that He doesn't really die or lose anything, and He likes the "sacrifice". With this "sacrifice" He buys the souls from Satan, who is an enemy that He Himself created for this purpose. He also created the souls He bought in the "sacrifice".

He also got "tempted" by His enemy, having zero chance of falling for the temptation since He's God and knows everything.

Yep. Makes perfect sense.
Religion: The belief that an all powerful God or gods created the entire universe so that we tiny humans can be happy. And we also make war about it.

Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1489 on: November 01, 2013, 09:04:54 AM »
^yep, I think that just about sums it up.
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Offline jynnan tonnix

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1490 on: November 01, 2013, 09:17:35 AM »
Somewhere, many pages ago, skeptic said that only 1 or 2 percent of people would get into heaven (it might have been less but I'm not reading the whole thread again).
Now if god created everything including us, and then sent himself down here to save us all, why would only 2% (being genorous here) be able to make it to heaven?
By any standard that is a piss poor result, that is a 98% failure rate.
That is an EPIC FAIL.
Clearly the sacrifice idea did not work.
You must have to seriously question a god that has, at most, a 2% success rate.

I asked this same basic question, also many pages ago, without getting anything like a coherent answer.

Here it is again:
Quote
And, another question/comment... Based on the assumption that your figures have anything to do with reality here...If god actually cares about redemption, has a plan, is omnipotent, etc, etc...Exactly how is it that of all the billions of people on earth, all but a relative handful, or more like the merest pinch of them are damned for eternity? My math is not great, but you seem to be implying that of, let's say 8,000,000,000 people, about 7,980,000,000 are bound for eternal torment. Even though they are going by honest understanding and often trying their utmost to live their lives as they believe they should, based on their upbringing and the way they perceive the world around them? Often with confidence, just as strong and unshakable as yours.

How does the concept of a loving, caring god ever begin to fit in with this scenario?

How do all these alleged demons manage to have so much more power over the world than an omnipotent god that he can only manage to lead such a paltry percentage to salvation?

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1491 on: November 01, 2013, 09:18:44 AM »
Somewhere, many pages ago, skeptic said that only 1 or 2 percent of people would get into heaven (it might have been less but I'm not reading the whole thread again).
Now if god created everything including us, and then sent himself down here to save us all, why would only 2% (being genorous here) be able to make it to heaven?
By any standard that is a piss poor result, that is a 98% failure rate.
That is an EPIC FAIL.
Clearly the sacrifice idea did not work.
You must have to seriously question a god that has, at most, a 2% success rate.
He only wants the 2% that fully buy the story,follow ALL the rules(even contradictory rules) and totally submit themselves. The coffee table Christian who reads the passages his pastor tells him to,,,,NO interest in him,Satan can have em
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Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1492 on: November 01, 2013, 09:34:50 AM »
]He only wants the 2% that fully buy the story,follow ALL the rules(even contradictory rules) and totally submit themselves. The coffee table Christian who reads the passages his pastor tells him to,,,,NO interest in him,Satan can have em
I guess that would include the rule about giving away all your wealth?
Perhaps the homeless are actually the 2%, a crap life for them now but great rewards once they are in heaven  &)

Sorry jynnan tonnix, I didn't realise you had already asked pretty much the same thing.
I guess it does not hurt to prompt him again for a response.
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Offline median

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1493 on: November 01, 2013, 10:42:23 AM »
The proposition is true or false, as you say, and cannot be both at the same time[1].  But evidence for and against a proposition can both exist simultaneously.
 1. Unless reality is subjective, as you've put forth elsewhere...but let's not complicate this with that just now.

So you agree it is evidence that God exists?

And I don't believe reality is subjective.
I always said that according to atheistic materialism, you can't empirically prove an external world exists independent of the senses. It is merely taken on assumption.

And you can't "prove" (with absolute certainty) that a world outside your mind exists either, and neither could Berkeley. That is the point! As I said before you are in the same boat everyone else is in. Consciousness is inherently subjective (for you AND for everyone else), and just ASSUMING your "God" (thing) doesn't get you out of the dilemma. You are just too hung up in nonsense about 'objective knowledge' (which you don't have) - and it's all because you started with your conclusion regarding the bible. Did you watch the video I posted on Kant's refutation of idealism? Did you do your homework? You didn't, did you?

The question of idealism vs realism is totally irrelevant. It doesn't change a thing either way. I know you WANT it to b/c you want to just ASSERT your theology (ad hoc) but assuming your position a priori on a testable old book doesn't help you demonstrate anything except your own credulity.

p.s. - I'm not going to watch any video you post until you agree to watch the videos I post (b/c thus far, you haven't watched any of mine and that just makes you an ass).
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 10:46:50 AM by median »
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1494 on: November 01, 2013, 10:45:22 AM »
Saw an annoying (are there any other kind?) Christian bumper sticker the other day in the Safeway parking lot. It said:

"Choose Jesus. If you don't like him, Satan will take you back."

Hahahahahaha! So funny!

Grrrr. Such cruel superior a$$hole arrogance wrapped up in that little slogan! Once saved, always saved, right? Not saved, doomed to hell.

If you are not a Christian, than you are pwned by Satan. Atheists, Hindus, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, pagan animists, are all the property of the devil-- no matter how nice, successful, friendly, law-abiding and good to their families.

That is why some Christians, realizing that there were very nice non-Christians out there, decided that works did not matter, only faith did. After telling us that "you know a tree by its fruits" and that only Christians could be nice and patriotic and law abiding and decent to their families.  &)

No matter if 75% of the planet is not Christian, preferring to keep the faith of their ancestors with respect and devotion. Or to practice no religion at all. Straight to hell with 'em! They deserve to die and suffer in agony for all eternity.  :P
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline median

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1495 on: November 01, 2013, 11:14:03 AM »
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 11:15:44 AM by median »
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline screwtape

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1496 on: November 01, 2013, 11:51:35 AM »
Life is full of trials and tribulations which toughens us up for Heaven.

right.  because you think once we get to heaven we have to fight a war.  for god.  who is omnipotent.  and could avoid the war if he wanted.  But instead he doesn't.  So he must want war.

there is something fundamentally wrong with you.
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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1497 on: November 01, 2013, 01:08:21 PM »
Nobody wants a master that has rules for your life. After the dog was healed, I was looking for ANY reason to break my promise to the Lord. I was thinking, "Maybe it's just a huge coincidence that the dog was healed. Maybe God did heal the dog, but He doesn't expect me to keep my promise, I wanna live my own life. Why would God heal a dog?"

I was making excuses in order to keep living my own life. When I realized that I was just being selfish, I embraced the Lord and never looked back.

It's hard to admit we have somebody to answer to. Everyone wants to live however they want, do whatever they want, whenever they want.

Skep,

When people read this thread who will they think is possessed by a demon?

You conveniently think that a dog was allegedly cured for your benefit, but a horse allegedly cured for someone else was cured by a demon. There is no mention in your statement that you even considered that a demon might have cured the dog.

The demon that you follow wants you to worship an instrument of torture, a cross, and tells you that you can do anything and be forgiven for it. You have already said that your demon welcomes mass murderers like Hitler.

Let's see what this demon makes you do:

You have pretended to know subjects you don't know, misrepresented facts on various subjects, lied about what you have studied, pretended you know who will be "saved" by your demon, accused everyone of being led by demons except yourself, and believed in conspiracy theories.

You insult others and accuse others at the same time.


I see people are resorting to ad-hominems and calling me stupid.

I will take the high road and not respond by insulting.

For people who preach tolerance, you guys are very judgmental and intolerant.

You are the only one who cannot see the demon in your own head.



skeptic, (and I am having a hard time calling you that) is there any kind of supernatural being or magical force you do not believe in? If you do not believe in something that other people think exists, how can you tell you are right? So far, you have professed belief in several different "gods" and/or many different "demons". Have you actually seem them with your own eyes? Or do you detect them in some other fashion?

Do you also believe in the real physical existence of any of these: ghosts, spirits, fairies, witches, elves, vampires, werewolves, mermaids or zombies? Why or why not?

Do you believe in the existence of psychic phenomena like ESP, mediums who communicate with the dead, telepathy (mental communication between people) or telekinesis (moving objects with the mind)? Why or why not?

Do you think tarot cards or astrology are real ways to figure out the world? Do you think there are people who can predict the future?

You have cited things on tv and the internet as evidence of demons, as if people can't make sh!t up about demons and put it online.  I honestly want to know how you distinguish what actually exists from what people imagine or lie about.

You really do seem to be skeptical of being skeptical. :?


I believe in all those things. I have seen some stuff in my life...I kid you not...I have seen some stuff.

I have witnessed plates lift off the ground and smash into a wall.

I've witnessed "Get out" appear in blood on the wall at my friend's house and disappear within 30 seconds.

I have witnessed a seance and heard the voices. They are not human spirits. They are demons pretending to be human spirits.

I have witnessed many of these things.

The main reason I converted was because my friend's dog was very very sick with cancer and they were going to put him to sleep the next day to end his suffering. I prayed, "Lord if you exist and save this dog, I will dedicate my life to you." The next day my friend said the doctors couldn't find the cancer and they showed him both x-rays taken with the cancer and without the cancer and the doctors were astonished. All they said was, "No idea what happened but it's gone." This dog went from lying like a slug on the carpet to jumping and playing fetch the next day.

This might not be proof to you guys because you haven't seen it with your own eyes but my own eyes have witnessed a myriad of things to the point where I just can't be an atheist anymore.

It has been 100% proven to me.

Skep, this is not normal. Ask yourself, is this normal?


« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 01:38:58 PM by Foxy Freedom »
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Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1498 on: November 01, 2013, 01:29:11 PM »
Somewhere, many pages ago, skeptic said that only 1 or 2 percent of people would get into heaven (it might have been less but I'm not reading the whole thread again).
Now if god created everything including us, and then sent himself down here to save us all, why would only 2% (being genorous here) be able to make it to heaven?
By any standard that is a piss poor result, that is a 98% failure rate.
That is an EPIC FAIL.
Clearly the sacrifice idea did not work.
You must have to seriously question a god that has, at most, a 2% success rate.
He only wants the 2% that fully buy the story,follow ALL the rules(even contradictory rules) and totally submit themselves. The coffee table Christian who reads the passages his pastor tells him to,,,,NO interest in him,Satan can have em

I highly doubt 2% actually follow ALL the rules. More like 0.0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000001% do.

;)

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously.

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1499 on: November 01, 2013, 03:45:56 PM »
Some Christians talk about how easy it is to believe in god, citing the pure and uncorrupted faith of very young children, mentally handicapped people and [supposedly] simple-minded native folk. God has written his words on our hearts-- see how people with so little knowledge accept him?

You know, anyone can believe in god, as long as they are: not tainted by actual facts, science, critical thinking and ideas developed after 1200 CE, i.e. people who are easily convinced of things that are clearly not true

When my daughter was in kindergarten at a private Christian-lite school,[1] her teachers told me they were so impressed by her love of Jesus. I rolled my eyes internally and thought, ffs, of  course she loves Jesus. She loves Santa, Angelina Ballerina, the Muppets, Cat Pee Barbie, Mulan, fairy princesses, and her two imaginary friends DB and GG. She's five years old. She's supposed to love made-up stuff. &)

It is only in religion that being as unsophisticated, ignorant and gullible as a toddler is seen as a virtue in a fully grown adult.   :P
 1. Her Dad is a Christian--not a fundy, obviously-- and I have no problem with her learning about what he believes. I have also made sure she has always known that I don't believe and that nobody can control what she believes.
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1500 on: November 01, 2013, 05:46:13 PM »
And you can't "prove" (with absolute certainty) that a world outside your mind exists either, and neither could Berkeley. That is the point! As I said before you are in the same boat everyone else is in. Consciousness is inherently subjective (for you AND for everyone else), and just ASSUMING your "God" (thing) doesn't get you out of the dilemma. You are just too hung up in nonsense about 'objective knowledge' (which you don't have) - and it's all because you started with your conclusion regarding the bible. Did you watch the video I posted on Kant's refutation of idealism? Did you do your homework? You didn't, did you?

The question of idealism vs realism is totally irrelevant. It doesn't change a thing either way. I know you WANT it to b/c you want to just ASSERT your theology (ad hoc) but assuming your position a priori on a testable old book doesn't help you demonstrate anything except your own credulity.

p.s. - I'm not going to watch any video you post until you agree to watch the videos I post (b/c thus far, you haven't watched any of mine and that just makes you an ass).

With all due respect median, the point isn't about "proving" an external world exists. The point is that it makes no sense to acknowledge an external world from a purely materialistic viewpoint. This is because you can not say what exists without any senses around to describe it.

Idealism doesn't have this problem because everything exists in God's mind. An external world only makes sense with Idealism, not materialism.

Idealism: We can empirically deduce that our senses are used to describe things and derive all knowledge. So since everything is known through a mind, it makes sense to posit an eternal infinite mind that perceives all things.

It makes no sense to say: "Since everything is known through minds, we'll just go ahead and claim we know exactly what exists when no minds are around to describe it."

It's a huge conundrum.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Foxy Freedom

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1501 on: November 01, 2013, 06:12:35 PM »
And you can't "prove" (with absolute certainty) that a world outside your mind exists either, and neither could Berkeley. That is the point! As I said before you are in the same boat everyone else is in. Consciousness is inherently subjective (for you AND for everyone else), and just ASSUMING your "God" (thing) doesn't get you out of the dilemma. You are just too hung up in nonsense about 'objective knowledge' (which you don't have) - and it's all because you started with your conclusion regarding the bible. Did you watch the video I posted on Kant's refutation of idealism? Did you do your homework? You didn't, did you?

The question of idealism vs realism is totally irrelevant. It doesn't change a thing either way. I know you WANT it to b/c you want to just ASSERT your theology (ad hoc) but assuming your position a priori on a testable old book doesn't help you demonstrate anything except your own credulity.

p.s. - I'm not going to watch any video you post until you agree to watch the videos I post (b/c thus far, you haven't watched any of mine and that just makes you an ass).

With all due respect median, the point isn't about "proving" an external world exists. The point is that it makes no sense to acknowledge an external world from a purely materialistic viewpoint. This is because you can not say what exists without any senses around to describe it.

Idealism doesn't have this problem because everything exists in God's mind. An external world only makes sense with Idealism, not materialism.

Idealism: We can empirically deduce that our senses are used to describe things and derive all knowledge. So since everything is known through a mind, it makes sense to posit an eternal infinite mind that perceives all things.

It makes no sense to say: "Since everything is known through minds, we'll just go ahead and claim we know exactly what exists when no minds are around to describe it."

It's a huge conundrum.

Only for you. The Demons in your head are preventing you from seeing reality.

See my reply above number 1497. Be sure not to let your demons interfere with answers to every question.
Neither Foxy Freedom nor any associates can be reached via WWGHA. Their official antitheist website is http://the6antitheist6guide6.blogspot.co.uk

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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1502 on: November 01, 2013, 07:07:21 PM »
Only for you. The Demons in your head are preventing you from seeing reality.

See my reply above number 1497. Be sure not to let your demons interfere with answers to every question.

That is a tu quoque logical fallacy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque

In fact, lots of atheists use this fallacy quite often.
I have seen many discredit Christianity because of a person's inconsistency. They say things like, "You say Christians don't steal but you steal and you're a Christian so it's all BS!"

Thank you for keeping me on my toes, Foxy.

BTW, the answer to your question is found in Matthew 12: 25-26
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1503 on: November 01, 2013, 07:08:59 PM »
No. There are many other, much better reasons.
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1504 on: November 01, 2013, 07:19:03 PM »
No. There are many other, much better reasons.

Why not open a thread about "reasons not to believe in Christianity?"
You won't find many reasons not to believe, but plenty of reasons to believe.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1505 on: November 01, 2013, 07:23:58 PM »
No. There are many other, much better reasons.

Why not open a thread about "reasons not to believe in Christianity?"
You won't find many reasons not to believe, but plenty of reasons to believe.

Do you mean "reasons not to believe" like this entire site and the experiences of most everyone who posts on it? And just about everything that happens in the world and that has ever happened?

Or do you mean "reasons to believe" like a sick dog that got better? Which is it?
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 07:26:29 PM by nogodsforme »
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1506 on: November 01, 2013, 07:24:52 PM »
Only for you. The Demons in your head are preventing you from seeing reality.

See my reply above number 1497. Be sure not to let your demons interfere with answers to every question.

That is a tu quoque logical fallacy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque

In fact, lots of atheists use this fallacy quite often.
I have seen many discredit Christianity because of a person's inconsistency. They say things like, "You say Christians don't steal but you steal and you're a Christian so it's all BS!"

Thank you for keeping me on my toes, Foxy.

BTW, the answer to your question is found in Matthew 12: 25-26

You see how you avoided the answers because of the demon in your head. This tu quoque has nothing to do with the questions I asked. I am not referring to any general principle. I am talking about the way you are led astray by your demon and cannot perceive anything correctly. see my reply 1497 and start thinking for yourself instead of letting a demon do it for you.

« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 07:49:00 PM by Foxy Freedom »
Neither Foxy Freedom nor any associates can be reached via WWGHA. Their official antitheist website is http://the6antitheist6guide6.blogspot.co.uk

The 2nd edition of the free ebook Devil or Delusion ? The danger of Christianity to Democracy Freedom and Science.       http://t.co/2d1KcJ9V

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #1507 on: November 01, 2013, 07:51:56 PM »
You see how you avoided the answers because of the demon in your head. This tu quoque has nothing to do with the questions I asked. I am not referring to any general principle. I am talking about the way you are led astray by your demon and cannot perceive anything correctly. see my reply 1497 and start thinking for yourself instead of letting a demon do it for you.

Can you please stop with the silliness?
Me being led by a demon is downright laughable.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)