Author Topic: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?  (Read 27978 times)

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Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #232 on: October 16, 2013, 04:09:26 PM »
But how do you know that Christianity isn't a false religion, and demons created it to deceive people so they wouldn't follow Ba'al, the One True GodTM?

Because no religion was around before the fallen angels. Angels fell to earth and created false religions.

Yahweh demonstrated his power over them in the Bible.

Nobody has ever demonstrated power over Yahweh.

That completely does not answer my question one bit.  But that's not surprising, considering that you're in a habit of ignoring questions and just saying what you want.  That's called preaching, and even though I'm not a mod, I can assure you that it's not tolerated here at WWGHA.  Speaking of which, don't I remember you saying that you didn't plan on preaching?

I'm not here to preach, just to explain my point of view.

Yeah, thought so.
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Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #233 on: October 16, 2013, 04:13:19 PM »
jdawg,

I have this feeling he's a Mormon, but, then, he hasn't mentioned Moroni, or Nephi, or whatever but he sounds like one.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

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Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #234 on: October 16, 2013, 04:14:00 PM »
Or one can be right. Christianity.

Or one can be right. Islam.
Or one can be right. Mormonism.
Or one can be right. Scientology.
Or one can be right. Pastafarianism.
Or one can be right. Hinduism.

Your point is...?
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Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #235 on: October 16, 2013, 04:14:56 PM »
jonnyUK,

^the Bible tells him so.

:P

-Nam
Agreed.
Instead of the saying "thinking outside the box"
Perhaps we need to try "thinking outside the book"
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Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #236 on: October 16, 2013, 04:16:51 PM »
Instead of the saying "thinking outside the box"
Perhaps we need to try "thinking outside the book"

Jonny, I think you're gonna like it here.
Remember to make an intro thread--I can't wait to hear a bit about you. (Edit: did you make one already?  Too lazy to look)

jdawg,

I have this feeling he's a Mormon, but, then, he hasn't mentioned Moroni, or Nephi, or whatever but he sounds like one.

-Nam

Mormonism and Christianity aren't the same thing  :?

Also:

The mormons have satanic imagery on their temple as well. Part of satanic freemasonry.

So, no.  But you still get a consolation prize. *hands nam a cookie*
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #237 on: October 16, 2013, 04:17:42 PM »
jonnyUK,

^the Bible tells him so.

:P

-Nam
Agreed.
Instead of the saying "thinking outside the box"
Perhaps we need to try "thinking outside the book"

No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible, "Lean not on your own understanding." Demons want you to believe that you know it all and you don't need God.

Only God has the understanding. Humans do not.

Obviously, you will disagree. Nothing I can do about that.

Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #238 on: October 16, 2013, 04:19:50 PM »
So? He says all but his church or form of Christianity is Satanic, that's what the Book of Mormon teaches.

But I'll take the cookie.

(munches)

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously - Humphrey

Offline Zankuu

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #239 on: October 16, 2013, 04:19:55 PM »
In other words, the Bible says to shut down critical thought; don't trust yourself, just read the Bible. THAT is dangerous, 54768, and it's the opposite of skepticism. Funny that word is in your username.
Leave nothing to chance. Overlook nothing. Combine contradictory observations. Allow yourself enough time. -Hippocrates of Cos

Offline jdawg70

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #240 on: October 16, 2013, 04:21:35 PM »
jdawg,

I have this feeling he's a Mormon, but, then, he hasn't mentioned Moroni, or Nephi, or whatever but he sounds like one.

-Nam

Well, at this point it would all be speculation.  He could be a member of the People's Front of Judea and I'm not sure I'd be able to tell.
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #241 on: October 16, 2013, 04:21:57 PM »
jdawg,

I have this feeling he's a Mormon, but, then, he hasn't mentioned Moroni, or Nephi, or whatever but he sounds like one.

-Nam

No way. Moroni was a fallen angel telling Joseph Smith he was from God. I can see right through the tricks and games played by the demons and fallen angels. not everyone can and this is why I try to warn them about the doctrines they are following.

I have nothing against Mormons or Catholics. I am just very against their doctrines.


Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #242 on: October 16, 2013, 04:22:42 PM »
No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible,

A couple of objections:

  • It's dangerous to follow my own understanding, and perception, and thoughts?  So it's dangerous to make any decision at all without permission from SkyDaddy 2.0?
  • Obviously it's written in the bible.  Any belief system that involves keeping people ignorant and indifferent needs to command people not to think for themselves.
  • And also, what Zankuu said:
In other words, the Bible says to shut down critical thought; don't trust yourself, just read the Bible. THAT is dangerous, 54768, and it's the opposite of skepticism. Funny that word is in your username.
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Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #243 on: October 16, 2013, 04:22:57 PM »


No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible, "Lean not on your own understanding." Demons want you to believe that you know it all and you don't need God.

Only God has the understanding. Humans do not.

Obviously, you will disagree. Nothing I can do about that.
Same point...Anything outside of a book?

Thanks Benny for the welcome.
I did say hello in the introductions a while ago.Not been on for a few days.
"Do I look like someone who cares what god thinks" - pinhead

Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #244 on: October 16, 2013, 04:24:20 PM »
Thanks Benny for the welcome.
I did say hello in the introductions a while ago.Not been on for a few days.

Ah, okay.  I'm just returning from a 2-year hiatus, so I'm a bit out of the loop :P
I'm here every now and again.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #245 on: October 16, 2013, 04:25:02 PM »
In other words, the Bible says to shut down critical thought; don't trust yourself, just read the Bible. THAT is dangerous, 54768, and it's the opposite of skepticism. Funny that word is in your username.

Why is it dangerous to read the Bible?

Have you ever read the Sermon on the Mount?

How would it be dangerous to put those beliefs into practice?

jesus said "love your neighbor as yourself." Is it dangerous to put this into practice?

I've asked this question to atheists many times and I've never gotten a good answer. I don't see how pure love is dangerous.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline jdawg70

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #246 on: October 16, 2013, 04:25:28 PM »
No way. Moroni was a fallen angel telling Joseph Smith he was from God. I can see right through the tricks and games played by the demons and fallen angels. not everyone can and this is why I try to warn them about the doctrines they are following.

I have nothing against Mormons or Catholics. I am just very against their doctrines.
That sounds an awful lot like you using your own understanding to see the tricks and games being played.
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."
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Offline Dante

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #247 on: October 16, 2013, 04:26:40 PM »

No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible, "Lean not on your own understanding." Demons want you to believe that you know it all and you don't need God.

Only God has the understanding. Humans do not.

Obviously, you will disagree. Nothing I can do about that.

No, we can agree that it's dangerous. We'll disagree about to whom it's dangerous, but it's dangerous, no doubt.

You see Skepdude, it's written in there to persuade people to NOT THINK. To follow blindly. And, it's no god that you're following. Religion is a tool used to CONTROL PEOPLE by other people who want to CONTROL PEOPLE. Uneducated masses, peasants, in early times. And if peasants started to think, to question authority, well then shit got real dangerous for the heirarchy. They could lose control, and power, and all the trappings that come with such.

You know, if there really was an all-knowing, all-powerful god that didn't want people to think for themselves, he must have real bad case of self doubt. Or a lack of real power.
Actually it doesn't. One could conceivably be all-powerful but not exceptionally intelligent.

Offline Zankuu

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #248 on: October 16, 2013, 04:28:30 PM »
Why is it dangerous to read the Bible?
If the Bible tells you that you can't trust yourself, that you can't rely on your own critical thinking skills and to just trust in it, that's dangerous.
Leave nothing to chance. Overlook nothing. Combine contradictory observations. Allow yourself enough time. -Hippocrates of Cos

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #249 on: October 16, 2013, 04:28:41 PM »
Same point...Anything outside of a book?

Thanks Benny for the welcome.
I did say hello in the introductions a while ago.Not been on for a few days.

I don't believe the Bible just because it's an "old book". (By the way it is multiple books, not one.)

I know the Bible is true because of all the prophecies coming true. The writings of Paul sound exactly like what is happening in the world today. It's shocking how accurate it sounds. Almost like Paul had someone guiding him with his writing......perhaps from above......

believe me, if the bible was pure rubbish, I'd happily laugh at it and throw it out.

Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #250 on: October 16, 2013, 04:30:10 PM »
jdawg,

I have this feeling he's a Mormon, but, then, he hasn't mentioned Moroni, or Nephi, or whatever but he sounds like one.

-Nam

No way. Moroni was a fallen angel telling Joseph Smith he was from God. I can see right through the tricks and games played by the demons and fallen angels. not everyone can and this is why I try to warn them about the doctrines they are following.

I have nothing against Mormons or Catholics. I am just very against their doctrines.




I didn't know Moroni was mentioned in the Bible? but you believe it was a "fallen angel"? Which is quite telling of you. You believe in the existence of other religions as being true; otherwise, you wouldn't have worded it that way.

Well, there is another explanation but I'll refrain.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously - Humphrey

Offline Benny

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #251 on: October 16, 2013, 04:34:06 PM »
Why is it dangerous to read the Bible?

It's not dangerous to read the Bible, it's dangerous to read it and abandon all critical thinking skills and ability to question what you read because of it.  You have clearly done the latter, and as such, you are getting yourself in a ton of hot water.

The Bible has some good stuff.  It also has a LOT of bad stuff.  Like the part you quoted about not relying on understanding?  Yeah, that's poison.

I know the Bible is true because of all the prophecies coming true.

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Failed_biblical_prophecies
There's a bunch of prophecies you may have forgotten, none of which came true.

believe me, if the bible was pure rubbish, I'd happily laugh at it and throw it out.

Funny--that's what I did when I realized the Bible was rubbish.  Maybe you should do that--it'll save some space in your brain for more important things than religion.
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Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #252 on: October 16, 2013, 04:36:21 PM »
Like gum balls.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously - Humphrey

Offline median

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #253 on: October 16, 2013, 04:38:58 PM »

"Faith without works is dead" is written in the Bible. We know a tree by its fruits. A bad tree does not bear good fruit.


Except no professing Christian claims to be perfect (aka - you still "sin"). So then this argument fails b/c you bear bad fruit all the time (in your "sin nature"). Thus, you can't tell who is or isn't a "true" Christian and you can't claim that all of the other denominations interpretations are incorrect. Mormons, for example, are far more moral people than most protestant sects I know of. Does that mean they are the ones who are "bearing good fruits" and you aren't? Do their actions make them true Christians?


Btw, your statements "according to the bible" are what are in question here in case you hadn't noticed. Why do you believe these things?

it is not just me claiming they are false. Look up the Satanic symbols used at churches. The Catholics especially have satanic symbols all over the place. Look at the Vatican. Obelisk (a satanic symbol) is HUGE at the Vatican.

 The mormons have satanic imagery on their temple as well. Part of satanic freemasonry.

Look up on google. Plenty of images showing the raging satanic activity going on.


And I'm sure these denominations would strongly disagree with your interpretation of their faith, wouldn't they? More importantly though, have you Googled the history of the symbols in your religion? The cross, for example is a pagan symbol which did not originate with Christianity. You really need to study your history a little more here. Here are two Christian sources for this:


http://www.cgg.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.sr/CT/ARTB/k/471/Cross-Christian-Banner-Pagan-Relic.htm
http://ministerofblog.wordpress.com/which-witch-is-which-testimonies-of-deliverance-from-the-darkest-pit/the-cross-the-true-history-of-a-very-pagan-symbol-the-inverted-cross-symbol-its-not-what-they-say-it-is/

Christianity itself has borrowed or outright stolen from pagan mythology. Read Dr. Robert M. Price who exposes this (among many other scholars).


http://www.truthbeknown.com/easter.htm
http://depts.drew.edu/jhc/doherty_price.html

Or one can be right. Christianity.


Oh? and how do you know that?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline neopagan

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #254 on: October 16, 2013, 04:39:38 PM »
Faith moving mountains is metaphorical.
The details about his life are simply facts: born of a virgin, feeding the masses etc.

is this really very hard to understand?
It may help everyone if you explain your process for determining that 'faith moving mountains' is metaphorical rather than literal.

I need help with this one too.... was cutting off the end of boys'/mens' penises methaphorical too?  If Abraham's wife laughed when she was told she'd have a baby in her 90s, then Abe had to chuckle a bit when he heard that bizzaro idea. 
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Offline median

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #255 on: October 16, 2013, 04:40:48 PM »

I know the Bible is true because of all the prophecies coming true. The writings of Paul sound exactly like what is happening in the world today. It's shocking how accurate it sounds. Almost like Paul had someone guiding him with his writing......perhaps from above......

believe me, if the bible was pure rubbish, I'd happily laugh at it and throw it out.


Oh? What prophesies? Can you name one? Btw, a prediction is not a prophesy and correlation does not equal causation. I'm confident you know this, yes?
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #256 on: October 16, 2013, 04:41:04 PM »
median,

The Bible tells him so.

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously - Humphrey

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #257 on: October 16, 2013, 04:43:57 PM »

No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible, "Lean not on your own understanding." Demons want you to believe that you know it all and you don't need God.

Only God has the understanding. Humans do not.

Obviously, you will disagree. Nothing I can do about that.


It's funny, and quite hypocritical, that you are leaning upon your own understanding here in order to tell us not to lead on our own understanding. In fact, you leaned on your own understanding when you read the bible and believed it. So this argument is false. If you didn't lean on your own understanding you wouldn't be able to get through the day, let alone be able to tell whether or not an old book was true or not.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. Carl Sagan

Offline Nam

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #258 on: October 16, 2013, 04:46:20 PM »

No. it is very dangerous to follow your own understanding. This is a demonic doctrine. It's even written in the Bible, "Lean not on your own understanding." Demons want you to believe that you know it all and you don't need God.

Only God has the understanding. Humans do not.

Obviously, you will disagree. Nothing I can do about that.


It's funny, and quite hypocritical, that you are leaning upon your own understanding here in order to tell us not to lead on our own understanding. In fact, you leaned on your own understanding when you read the bible and believed it. So this argument is false. If you didn't lean on your own understanding you wouldn't be able to get through the day, let alone be able to tell whether or not an old book was true or not.

Contradictory humor at its best. Where's the popcorn?

-Nam
A god is like a rock: it does absolutely nothing until someone or something forces it to do something. The only capability the rock has is doing nothing until another force compels it physically to move.

The right to be heard does not automatically include the right to be taken seriously - Humphrey

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #259 on: October 16, 2013, 04:50:42 PM »
Except no professing Christian claims to be perfect (aka - you still "sin"). So then this argument fails b/c you bear bad fruit all the time (in your "sin nature"). Thus, you can't tell who is or isn't a "true" Christian and you can't claim that all of the other denominations interpretations are incorrect. Mormons, for example, are far more moral people than most protestant sects I know of. Does that mean they are the ones who are "bearing good fruits" and you aren't? Do their actions make them true Christians?

Neither Mormons nor protestants are the right faith. The people themselves may be good, but their leaders are certainly on Satan's side.

It makes me happy when they learn their faith is the work of demons and come to Jesus.

Btw, your statements "according to the bible" are what are in question here in case you hadn't noticed. Why do you believe these things?

Because the Bible has changed countless lives for the better and has prophecies in it. If the Bible didn't work nobody's lives would be changed for the better. People would read it and go "I don't feel anything." Instead people read it and get an overwhelming joy warming their hearts and change their whole outlook on things.

If the Bible was a joke, people would laugh when they read the Bible. They would say, "I don't understand I'm not feeling anything. This is stupid."



And I'm sure these denominations would strongly disagree with your interpretation of their faith, wouldn't they? More importantly though, have you Googled the history of the symbols in your religion? The cross, for example is a pagan symbol which did not originate with Christianity. You really need to study your history a little more here. Here are two Christian sources for this: [/quote]

I don't wear a cross. I'm not into symbols. Symbols are pagan in origin, you are right. That's why I don't use them. Jesus is enough for me. I don't need to wear a cross to show off.


Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Jonny-UK

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Re: Jesus - What Kind of Sacrifice Are You Talking About?
« Reply #260 on: October 16, 2013, 04:52:15 PM »
believe me, if the bible was pure rubbish, I'd happily laugh at it and throw it out.
As I am sure people from other religions would do if they read the bible.
You follow the bible so must think other religious books are inaccurate.
Is there any thing outside the book(s) that points to the bible being the true religious book?
As Median said -what prophesies are coming true?
"Do I look like someone who cares what god thinks" - pinhead