A Relationship With God

[John 3 16]

I had a bit of an argument with my wife regarding the basis of faith and how those of us who have or have had faith in God force ourselves to be either willfully ignorant or unknowingly hypocritical.

Does your wife know your lack of belief?

I meant to say "Does your wife know about your conversion?"
Does she know you are an atheist now?  Have you come out of the closet yet?

[neopagan]

Oooh - ooooh, I just did a few weeks back.  I highly recommend it. A fundy spouse is a wellspring, a font, a veritable waterfall of logic, reason, and compassion when you tell them you've moved on past skydad.                      (Is there a sarcasm button?)

[John 3 16]

Why would you be sarcastic?

I think it is mutually beneficial that we respect our spouses and share our non belief or belief with them.

So neopagan.  Have you come out of the closet yet?

[Azdgari]

John, you might consider reading the thread, before you come off as even more of a prick.  Or at least some of it.  Here it is:
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,25194.0.html

[Jag]

I think it is mutually beneficial that we respect our spouses and share our non belief or belief with them.

Why? Do you feel this way about everything, or is this "tell all" limited to god beliefs? Is it disrespectful to keep quiet about it if we happen to agree? Is it disrespectful if we chose to stay quiet because in a particular relationship god beliefs are not important to either party? What id the topic is avoided in an effort to keep the peace? Still important to share, even if it means other issues will suddenly come to the forefront that might have otherwise never come up at all? Is there any discretionary judgment that you think is acceptable?

My BF (of many, many years) is agnostic, I'm atheist, and we pretty much never discuss it unless I'm going off on a rant about something stupid related to religion*. Do you still think it's important for us to share this, or does it only apply in cases where one or both parties are believers?

*edited to add: we still don't discuss it much, he just indulges my explosion of temper.

[neopagan]

Why would you be sarcastic?

Sarcasm keeps me from crying or suck starting my gun sometimes...

I think it is mutually beneficial that we respect our spouses and share our non belief or belief with them.

Sometimes... I get a little hung up on the words "mututally beneficial" and "respect" in my case.

So neopagan.  Have you come out of the closet yet?

What part of "I just did a few weeks back" did you not understand? 
Simple answer: YES - on 9/11/13.  It sucked and still does (see my answer to your second comment).  I won't bore you with my tale.. as Azdgari noted, it's available elsewhere if you have a big bag of popcorn.

[Jag]

See? No insults, no spite, just greetings exchanged between two people who happen to disagree over a single point. No harm, no foul. Wouldn't it be a wonderful world if we could all be so civil? 

That's what I saying.

BTW what's wrong with theists' karma points here? 
Are they all jerks like me?

Whoops, I missed this reply from you - sorry 'bout that.

Can you be a bit more clear about what you are asking? What "wrong" with theist karma points are you referring to? I'm not sure how to respond because I'm not sure what you are referring to, but if you can clarify a bit I'll try to answer, or at least give you my opinion, depending on what you mean by your question.

Did someone actually call you a jerk?

[John 3 16]

Can you be a bit more clear about what you are asking? What "wrong" with theist karma points are you referring to? I'm not sure how to respond because I'm not sure what you are referring to, but if you can clarify a bit I'll try to answer, or at least give you my opinion, depending on what you mean by your question

Or is it called Darwins points here?
Do you notice all of theists here have much higher negative darwins points than positive darwins regardless of their contents in the posts and attitude?

Did someone actually call you a jerk?

Something close to it.
you see here, all I did was asking a question whether he has come out of the closet or not.

John, you might consider reading the thread, before you come off as even more of a prick.  Or at least some of it.  Here it is:

you see here

........after a rude question

This website will get really boring if you guys keep treating theists like garbage and bully them and provoke them before you ban them.

[Azdgari]

you see here, all I did was asking a question whether he has come out of the closet or not.

John, you might consider reading the thread, before you come off as even more of a prick.  Or at least some of it.  Here it is:

You were coming off as a prick there, and would have come off as even more of one had you kept going like you were.  That's not the same as being a genuine jerk.

It appeared, at least to me, that you were trying to mockingly make fun of neopagan's family breakdown that followed his un-closeting.  To me, at least, that made you come off as a prick.

It had nothing to do with you being a theist, and everything to do with you being insensitive to his situation.

[John 3 16]

I had no idea what neopagan was going through though.

[Azdgari]

Right.

[nogodsforme]

People, theists or not, are given a lot of leeway on this site. People only get banned for breaking rules, being offensive and refusing to accept the advice of the mods. It usually takes some time, and is not based on negative darwin points.

Nobody gets banned for disagreeing with others. We have had some religious folks here for years. They stay until they stop posting on their own for whatever reason. I have never in several years here, seen any theist get banned just for being religious.  If they are willing to respond to questions and be respectful, they can stay as long as they want.

Contrast this with how atheists are treated on most religious sites. As soon as you express any non-religious sentiments or ask questions they don't like, you're on autoban! and I don't mean speeding down the highway in Germany.

[neopagan]

Jn316
We have atheists with a fair number of (-) Darwins also.  It's not a beauty contest.  In exploring your theory, you might look at some of the atheists' (-) Darwins too, a lot of them are from xians.  All of mine are...

And FWIW, I understood you did not know me from Adam's fig thong... so I give some leeway on the closet stuff.   
 

[Nam]

I have -46. But for my mouth (or fingers) I think that's a bit low.

[EDIT]

Many of my smites are from fellow atheists but many are from the religious community, mainly warranted, some not.

-Nam

[wright]

you see here

........after a rude question

This website will get really boring if you guys keep treating theists like garbage and bully them and provoke them before you ban them.

I misunderstood your tone. FWIW, I apologize. That was provocative and unwarranted.

Twitching knees like mine aside, this is a pretty tolerant site. If you'd like an example of behavior that's moving towards ban-worthy status, here's Crowbar's posting history:http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=56911

Theist trolls like that are fortunately few and far between, but they leave an unpleasant residue.

[Foxy Freedom]

This website will get really boring if you guys keep treating theists like garbage and bully them and provoke them before you ban them.

Do you mean in exactly the same way that Christians treat atheists on the street?

Or the way that Christians won't stop posting bibles through doors and bothering people in their own home?

Unlike those situations you chose to come to this site, so don't whine, just state your fallacy, and let someone refute it.

[ThatZenoGuy]

Or the way that Christians won't stop posting bibles through doors and bothering people in their own home?

Gah, i recently got two little christian pamphlets, i threw them in the fireplace for good riddens.

[Anfauglir]

Or the way that Christians won't stop posting bibles through doors and bothering people in their own home?

Gah, i recently got two little christian pamphlets, i threw them in the fireplace for good riddens.

The ones I'm getting through the door these days always have an address on them.  I always write them a polite letter thanking them for their leaflet, enclose a leaflet about the British Humanist Association, and invite them to get back to me if they have any questions. 

So far, none have taken me up on the offer.

[Mrjason]

I get "street pastors" bothering me in the street on friday nights, inviting me to come into their church hall for a cup of tea when I'm drunk.

Once in a particularly pissed state I went in and argued with them. The silly fucks came and knocked on my door at 10am the next day to ask if I wanted to come and join a prayer circle as they were worried about me!

There's also a dude who reads the bible at me when I'm on the way home from work and occasionally there are Jehovah's witnesses outside my local supermarket.

It's not just the christians either, I have muslim friends that invite me to understanding islam events despite knowing that I am an atheist. Admittedly there is usually a good buffet at the islam events so I do turn up for a bit.

I'm even god father to one friends daughter FFS. I only agreed to that because I've known the guy for 20 years and value his friendship more than I am offended by his disrespect.

I just can't seem to get away from the religious

[ThatZenoGuy]

It's not just the christians either, I have muslim friends that invite me to understanding islam events despite knowing that I am an atheist. Admittedly there is usually a good buffet at the islam events so I do turn up for a bit.

I was invited to a mosque once, if Muslims are good for one thing, its making bad-ass food.
Maybe a tad bit spicy though...

[screwtape]

Sometimes I go to Sikh gurudwaras just for the food.  The best Indian restaurants have Punjabi cooks. And most Punjabis are Sikh.  So... langar is just like going to a good Indian restaurant, for free.

[neopagan]

I'd go just about anywhere for free chow - except fundie pitch-ins.  I go to an Eastern Ortho food fest and usually don't know what I'm eating and the people are cool - never blabbering on about god or prayer for so-and-so.  However, a fundie-fest is nauseating due to the blather going on around the room, despite the comfort food. 

[Jag]

Can you be a bit more clear about what you are asking? What "wrong" with theist karma points are you referring to? I'm not sure how to respond because I'm not sure what you are referring to, but if you can clarify a bit I'll try to answer, or at least give you my opinion, depending on what you mean by your question

Or is it called Darwins points here?
Do you notice all of theists here have much higher negative darwins points than positive darwins regardless of their contents in the posts and attitude?

I can understand why you see it that way and even agree, to a point. There may be a genuine bias here, but that's a two way street, don't forget. With an openly atheist perspective, we get the attention of some truly interesting people on either side of the question. Theists who visit tend to fall into certain patterns of behavior, and the response from the active members varies by a few factors: the member's temperament, the visitor's temperament, the speed of decline in civility, the effort to provide support (ideally in the form of empirical evidence) for one's claims, and how long it takes the visitor to start "foaming at the mouth" behavior (some never do, and that's a nice change for us).

Go take a look at the posting history of whomever you want to - just click on their user name and then click on "Show Posts" to see history. You can read the posts in order and see certain patterns emerge pretty quickly among theists - it's not always there, but it's far more common than not.

To your concern about this site getting really boring, well, so far it's going strong. You're here, along with one or two other relative newbies, a couple long-timers and a few more who mostly pop in and out at random (you are one of this last group, aren't you?). Then add all the atheist members and it looks like we've got little to worry about, other than technical problems. I can certainly understand that it's not pleasant to be on the receiving end of criticism or critical remarks, that's generally the way it goes around here. I don't make claims without either knowing that I'm correct (and able to support it with evidence), or with the expectation that I will be called out if my claim is wrong, or unsupported.

Moving on, you haven't responded to my other post to you earlier in this thread: http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,25507.msg572295.html#msg572295

I'd like to know your thoughts on this.

[ThatZenoGuy]

Can you be a bit more clear about what you are asking? What "wrong" with theist karma points are you referring to? I'm not sure how to respond because I'm not sure what you are referring to, but if you can clarify a bit I'll try to answer, or at least give you my opinion, depending on what you mean by your question

Or is it called Darwins points here?
Do you notice all of theists here have much higher negative darwins points than positive darwins regardless of their contents in the posts and attitude?

I'm an atheist, and look at my "Darwins" .
I am like...in ratio terms...the most hated atheist here.

[nogodsforme]

I have never given or gotten any negative darwins, except from a Catholic former member who smited every atheist here, just on principle.

[William]

I am like...in ratio terms...the most hated atheist here.

Negative Darwins from fellow atheists are not "hate" - think of them as reality prods
It's what you do about them that counts.

[ThatZenoGuy]

I guess...(Darn you tulpae *raises fist*)

Still, 1:2 ratio is pretty bad ;P.

[screwtape]

Still, 1:2 ratio is pretty bad

Do better.

[ThatZenoGuy]

Do better.

Does that mean get more +?
Or more -?

I can easily get the second if you want...