Author Topic: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?  (Read 18355 times)

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Offline Azdgari

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #580 on: January 15, 2014, 10:06:27 PM »
Which, even if it happened (which would be bizarre), would give you no reason not to re-state it.  If anything, it would be a reason to re-state it, to resist the ones trying to silence you...whoever they are.
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #581 on: January 15, 2014, 10:09:44 PM »
Jdawg was offering sincere and helpful advice.  You've basically told him to shove it and go fuck himself unless he answers an undefined question.  Where did your hatred and hostility come from?
Your language not mine.
Hatred and hostility was created and the law of cause and effect demands the same feels be experienced. Sad really they have not understood anything.
According to Theists: Theists know God, Atheists don't.

Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #582 on: January 15, 2014, 10:13:27 PM »
Which, even if it happened (which would be bizarre), would give you no reason not to re-state it.  If anything, it would be a reason to re-state it, to resist the ones trying to silence you...whoever they are.
The tit for tat law will only make things worst. The bully remains a bully. The source of such things are routed in atheism. Nasty people.
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Offline xyzzy

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #583 on: January 15, 2014, 10:17:27 PM »
So you're either talking to yourself, the worst sock puppet in the history of socks, trolling or just missing a few screws.

Are we limited to just one of those, or may we tick all relevant boxes?
Depends on your persona and what it can do for you. Feel free to tick as many as you like.
Seems important to you.
Well, at least I can no longer say that you've never responded to any of my posts, although you have managed to consistently avoid answering my questions.

It's a shame that the only time you did respond was in a way that many would consider trollish. But at least I now know which box to tick.
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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #584 on: January 15, 2014, 10:21:08 PM »
The only thing you're proving, Jesuis, is that you're just trying to play some kind of a game with the members of this forum.

We aren't mind-readers, and even if your question was actually deleted (which I find doubtful), there's nothing at all preventing you from reposting it.  By refusing to, what you're really telling us is that you aren't interested in getting an actual answer, but that you just want to "stump the atheists".  It's nothing but inane sophistry, so you can justify your already-existing prejudice against atheists.

The only person you're fooling, though, is yourself.

Oh, regarding that "the bully remains a bully" thing, the only way to stop a bully is to not play their game.  That means reasking the question, instead of letting them silence you.  If you choose not to, then you have nobody to blame but yourself.

Online jdawg70

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #585 on: January 15, 2014, 11:15:28 PM »
not what I am looking for. You know what I am looking for. And you know you do not have it. I have established that already. Nice try on a cover up, but franckly it is still dodging the single question I asked. And don't ask me what the single question is. It might have been erased by another so rude and with power to be rude. So thanks but no thanks.

Fine.

42

There's your answer.  I'm glad this forum could help you find that.  Now go forth and tell others!  No more need for you to waste time here!.
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #586 on: January 15, 2014, 11:29:34 PM »
This guy is just a troll.

Not proving claims.

Saying utter garble.

Double standards.

Conspiracy theories on deleted posts.

Etc.
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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #587 on: January 15, 2014, 11:35:10 PM »
I understand it differently - those who believed in reincarnation or the after life have a duty in this life of morality compassionate interaction and humanist behavior do unto other etc. and is the foundation for them to be better off either in the kingdom of heaven or an afterlife with less suffering. In order to get that better life they have to perfect this one. Atheism does not promote this perfection process. Nor has it got an authority figure who claims he knows what he is talking about and willing to stand up. Richard Dawkins did try but got shot down quite quickly for his bus advert promoting the wrong agenda for the society.
And if most of them actually did act in such a morally compassionate and humanistic way, you might have a point.  But it wasn't until humanism developed - from secular attitudes, not Christian ones - that we actually started getting that.  For well over a thousand years, the afterlife was used as an excuse to justify the various bad things that happened to people (not to mention what other people did to them) in their actual lives.  Who cares if you live a life of want and suffering on Earth if you're going to heaven afterward?  I think you'd better spend some time reading about how Christians actually acted - especially the horrendous things they were perfectly willing to do to other humans - before you make baseless claims such as this.

What you also fail to understand is that Christianity doesn't promote any kind of perfection process at all.  It promotes doing what you think God wants in exchange for a ticket to heaven.  It wasn't until the Enlightenment - and the secular attitudes that came with it - that we started realizing that improving the quality of life for the average person actually mattered, and this idea of making life better for people here started to take root.  Not because of religion, but because of secular humanism.

Seriously, go read about how Christians actually acted towards other people, especially people who were weaker than them, up until around the 1800s.

Offline MadBunny

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #588 on: January 15, 2014, 11:48:54 PM »
I thought that would happen -- corrupt power has corrupted.

If you have no intention of stating whatever this question is, then you should be aware that I have no intention of fishing it out of your ass. 

I do note that your status says 'watched' which depending on the forum may imply that your posts are pre, rather than post moderated.  This isn't exactly Fourth Reich behavior, there are plenty of sites that do that, NYT, Huffington Post, and various blogs on Disquss.  So if that's your complaint that's entirely too bad.

So, out of generosity; What is this question that you've been asking that you feel atheists are unwilling or unable to answer?
If you give me another garbled non-answer I'll assume you are trolling, and treat it as such.
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Offline 12 Monkeys

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #589 on: January 16, 2014, 12:05:09 AM »
Even Skeptics whacked out theories about demons is clear compared to this nutbar...hey Skeptic is this guy Demon led or do you agree with his theories?
There's no right there's no wrong,there's just popular opinion (Brad Pitt as Jeffery Goines in 12 monkeys)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #590 on: January 16, 2014, 12:56:29 AM »
After reading your posts Jesuis, I have concluded that you are very lost. You sound a bit nutty in my opinion.

I see what you are trying to say. It's certainly true atheists can't explain the immaterial substance that animates the body, but you are going off the deep end a bit.

I can see why the atheists are getting frustrated with you. It must be tough listening to someone who thinks they have everything all figured out.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #591 on: January 16, 2014, 01:01:36 AM »
Even Skeptics whacked out theories about demons is clear compared to this nutbar...hey Skeptic is this guy Demon led or do you agree with his theories?

As I have always said there's only 2 sides to be on: God or Satan. He certainly doesn't sound like he's a Christian so that leaves Satan as the other option by default. It does sound like new age beliefs to me.

New agers are obsessed with frequencies and being your own God, so you don't have to answer to the true God.

Just my 2 cents.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #592 on: January 16, 2014, 01:01:50 AM »
After reading your posts Jesuis, I have concluded that you are very lost. You sound a bit nutty in my opinion.

I see what you are trying to say. It's certainly true atheists can't explain the immaterial substance that animates the body, but you are going off the deep end a bit.

I can see why the atheists are getting frustrated with you. It must be tough listening to someone who thinks they have everything all figured out.

This post is so ironic, stupid, and backwards...
THAT...I...WILL...give you a +1, for the laughs it gave me.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #593 on: January 16, 2014, 01:05:14 AM »
This post is so ironic, stupid, and backwards...
THAT...I...WILL...give you a +1, for the laughs it gave me.

he does have a point though. And it's what I was trying to explain:

What makes us different? What makes some people love a certain kind of music and another hate that kind of music? What makes someone nice and another evil? What makes us have all these different interests and individual personalities? If we are just blobs of chemicals on a floating rock, why aren't all the blobs of chemicals the same, almost like robots with no individual personalities? Everyone should be the same.

This is something beyond science, beyond the universe. transcends all.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #594 on: January 16, 2014, 01:11:45 AM »
What makes us different? What makes some people love a certain kind of music and another hate that kind of music? What makes someone nice and another evil? What makes us have all these different interests and individual personalities? If we are just blobs of chemicals on a floating rock, why aren't all the blobs of chemicals the same, almost like robots with no individual personalities? Everyone should be the same.

This is something beyond science, beyond the universe. transcends all.

Not at all, sure humans are just a giant mass of atoms formed into chemicals, tissues and the like.
But what you need to realize is that every human is different, both in physical form, and chemical secretions.

That is what makes everyone different.
Its basic physiology really, even the tiniest change in neurons could make a massive personality shift.
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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #595 on: January 16, 2014, 01:16:09 AM »
Not at all, sure humans are just a giant mass of atoms formed into chemicals, tissues and the like.
But what you need to realize is that every human is different, both in physical form, and chemical secretions.

That is what makes everyone different.
Its basic physiology really, even the tiniest change in neurons could make a massive personality shift.

That doesn't explain what makes me "me" and you "you." Why am "I" not "you?" Why was "I" born now and not thousands of years ago?

Like I said, beyond science. There is still no explanation how bones & blood evolved.
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #596 on: January 16, 2014, 01:20:45 AM »
That doesn't explain what makes me "me" and you "you." Why am "I" not "you?" Why was "I" born now and not thousands of years ago?

Err, yes, it does.

You have different genetics, brain configuration, different external stimuli, beliefs, etc.

Hence we are not the same.

As for "why was i not born thousands of years ago", It is because the combination of parts that make you, "you", did not exist back then.

Like I said, beyond science. There is still no explanation how bones & blood evolved.

Actually, there is explanations for those things.
The common excuse of "well evolution cant explain this" often refers to something it has explained, or something it is not meant to explain.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2014, 01:22:24 AM by Angus and Alexis »
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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #597 on: January 16, 2014, 01:24:56 AM »
What makes us different? What makes some people love a certain kind of music and another hate that kind of music? What makes someone nice and another evil? What makes us have all these different interests and individual personalities? If we are just blobs of chemicals on a floating rock, why aren't all the blobs of chemicals the same, almost like robots with no individual personalities? Everyone should be the same.
The answer is a combination of our chemical and biological makeup.  For example, some scientists showed that the chemical oxytosin made people more generous, while testosterone made people more selfish[1].  And we've known for decades that various chemicals can cause addictive dependencies in the human brain, to the point where someone values those things even above food.  We're literally just scratching the surface in terms of what chemicals can do to and for us.

We don't need to imagine a transcendent entity to explain the differences between us when it's so easily explained by our chemical makeup and our biological experiences.

I realize you want to believe that there's something more to it than that, but Occam's Razor applies even here.  The explanation which contains the least assumptions is the most likely to be correct.

What makes you, you, and what makes me, me, are the experiences we have as biological organisms combined with our chemical makeup.  Even if you had two people with the exact same DNA, they wouldn't have exactly the same experiences, and thus they would have unique differences between them.
 1. http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-moral-molecule/201103/how-do-we-know-what-causes-human-behavior

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #598 on: January 16, 2014, 05:25:03 AM »
Several posts quoting and debating self have been removed.  In my opinion, falls under "preaching".

It is perfectly possible to illustrate a point by rhetorically asking and answering questions to oneself in a post - but NOT by repeatedly self-quoting and holding a lengthy conversation
.
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #599 on: January 16, 2014, 07:31:40 AM »
Please do not respond further to Jesuis. It appears that he has left WWGHA but, before doing so, requested removal of his "foot print" (sic).

As a point of information, WWGHA does not remove members' posts wholesale. To do so would disrupt the flow of posts in each thread and also would be a huge task, as it would have to include all such posts quoted in replies.

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Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #600 on: January 16, 2014, 07:45:06 AM »
About damn time...
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #601 on: January 16, 2014, 10:17:09 AM »
That doesn't explain what makes me "me" and you "you." Why am "I" not "you?" Why was "I" born now and not thousands of years ago?

That's funny.  I used to wonder that all the time when I was a child.  I asked my mom that too.  She did not have a satisfying answer.  It only made sense to me once I understood that "I" am my brain.  I cannot be you because you are your brain.  It is like asking why your coffee cup is not your doorknob. 

You have a dualistic approach - you think you are separate from your body.  But this approach has no answer for why "you" happened to be stuffed into your particular body and not mine or a tiger's or a house fly's.   It has several other holes in too.  Like, why brain injuries can affect personality. 

I have a materialistic approach.  It has more explanatory power.


Like I said, beyond science. There is still no explanation how bones & blood evolved.

wrong on both counts.

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Offline Quesi

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #602 on: January 16, 2014, 10:21:02 AM »
Please do not respond further to Jesuis. It appears that he has left WWGHA but, before doing so, requested removal of his "foot print" (sic).


GB Mod


He is gone?  Oh my.  But I think I FOUND HIM.  It is either him or his soulmate.  And he is talking about vibrating atoms and listening to the sounds of universe.  Which sounds a whole hell of a lot like frequencies to me. 



"I lived in a cave for 6 months in the Canary Islands. I was tripping acid on a rock outside the cave when I realized that everything makes the exact same sound. We're all made of atoms, and atoms vibrate, and so everything in the Universe is tied together by the sound of that vibration."

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=588163421257762&set=a.102107073196735.4429.102099916530784&type=1&relevant_count=1

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #603 on: January 16, 2014, 10:23:49 AM »
Nice.
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Offline bertatberts

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #604 on: January 16, 2014, 10:33:51 AM »
There are some complete and utter nutjobs on this planet, and sadly they are allowed to walk around untethered and unsupervised. Apart from the pictured guy there was one reply were the guy said he could hear the earth worms whilst tripping. Wow it is a wonder these guys have enough braincells to actually walk.

Good find though Quesi.
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It would be pretty piss poor brainwashing, if the victims knew they were brainwashed, wouldn't it? - Screwtape. 04/12/12

Offline Quesi

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #605 on: January 16, 2014, 10:57:09 AM »

Good find though Quesi.

Thanks.  It "found me" actually, by showing up on my facebook feed this morning.  I subscribe to the "Humans of NY" page.

Click on the link, and read the comments.  Lots of folks are hearing these vibrations, it appears.  Who knew?  After a quarter of a century living in NYC, I don't even hear car alarms anymore. 

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #606 on: January 16, 2014, 11:03:03 AM »
Atomic vibrations wouldn't make any kind of audible sound, though.  At least not one that humans could hear.  I mean...good grief, it's difficult to even put it in scale, but a single involuntary muscle twitch is many magnitudes greater than an atomic vibration.

Offline screwtape

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #607 on: January 16, 2014, 11:07:51 AM »
Atomic vibrations wouldn't make any kind of audible sound, though. 

You are correct.  We call it "temperature".
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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #608 on: January 16, 2014, 11:36:46 AM »
Good catch, screwtape.  I wasn't thinking about that.

Honestly, I don't know why anyone would be inclined to trust someone who admitted to being drugged when he came up with this stuff.