Author Topic: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?  (Read 22951 times)

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Offline skeptic54768

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #290 on: January 13, 2014, 01:34:49 AM »
Really.... Who? NOT Obama. He's a muslim. Romney was Mormon NOT Christian. Who has been loud and proud since maybe Regan?

The problem is a lot of the Christians are old. Nobody wants to see an old fuddy-duddy Christian. We need a nice young hip 35 year old upstanding Christian man who follows God's laws and is pure fun at the same time instead of the stuffy old farts that can't relate to the youth.

God never said that it can't be fun to praise Him. You don't have to be 65 years old walking around like you have a coat hangar in your shirt to worship God.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 01:38:39 AM by skeptic54768 »
Matthew 10:22 "and you will be hated by all for my name’s sake. But the one who endures to the end will be saved." - Jesus (said 2,000 years ago and still true today.)

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #291 on: January 13, 2014, 01:46:28 AM »
As I said the "vocabulary" does not clearly align the mentality to the "frequency" of the question to be discussed, but the OP has already presumed "God exists" without properly understanding the meaning or vibration of this word and as such does not understand the answers given relative to the wisdom of such a word. Note this is not a dodge. I am clearly either not understanding your need or lack off. In other words our mental frequencies are not being aligned for if it was we would have no discrepancies.

Amazing, people think differently, i already knew that.

Now can you answer the question directly?
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #292 on: January 13, 2014, 01:53:41 AM »
As I said the "vocabulary" does not clearly align the mentality to the "frequency" of the question to be discussed, but the OP has already presumed "God exists" without properly understanding the meaning or vibration of this word and as such does not understand the answers given relative to the wisdom of such a word. Note this is not a dodge. I am clearly either not understanding your need or lack off. In other words our mental frequencies are not being aligned for if it was we would have no discrepancies.

Amazing, people think differently, i already knew that.

Now can you answer the question directly?
Question: Why is it hard for believers to answer a direct question?
Answer: They are answering "directly" but your lack of understanding seems to be going unnoticed. It is not the answering that is not taking place it is the lack of understanding that is cyclic. It is for you to tell me what word you do not understand or my responses are limited.
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #293 on: January 13, 2014, 01:57:31 AM »
Question: Why is it hard for believers to answer a direct question?
Answer: They are answering "directly" but your lack of understanding seems to be going unnoticed. It is not the answering that is not taking place it is the lack of understanding that is cyclic. It is for you to tell me what word you do not understand or my responses are limited.

By answering it like so, it proves that any god that such a believer believes in cannot be as godly as one would claim.
Rule 1: No pooftas. Rule 2: No maltreating the theists, IF, anyone is watching. Rule 3: No pooftas. Rule 4: I do not want to see anyone NOT drinking after light out. Rule 5: No pooftas. Rule 6: There is NO...rule 6.

Online Azdgari

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #294 on: January 13, 2014, 01:59:30 AM »
Really.... Who? NOT Obama. He's a muslim. Romney was Mormon NOT Christian. Who has been loud and proud since maybe Regan?

Obama is also a demonic Reptilian.  The Illuminati have planted him there to bring on the 2nd coming.  Or something like that.

Anyway, to answer your question, how about Bush Jr.?
The highest moral human authority is copied by our Gandhi neurons through observation.

Offline harbinger77

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #295 on: January 13, 2014, 02:03:24 AM »

This is an answer. An individual answer. A stand. I can respect that much. I guess it pleases you to know for some odd reason Homeland security named the fundamental Christian public enemy #1 in America. I think 2013.


http://www.fbi.gov/wanted/topten/

DHS has no such list.  However, given the rise of anti-American sentiment among the conservative sect it wouldn't surprise me.

You want to not get treated like a terrorist?  Stop acting like one.  Just like if you don't' want to be treated like a racist piece of s**t; don't act like a racist piece of s**t.

You f.ucks are forever threatening the president, and going around waving your guns in the air threatening violence every time some petty piece of bullshit doesn't go your way.  For example one person suggested that 'for the safety of the nation' if his political opponent were elected then it might require some brave American to shoot him.  Lets not forget how often the subject of 'secession has come up.  Usually every time you don't get to shove Christianity and government into the bedroom or get denied the ability to throw money at the feet of the wealthy.


So yeah, it's not that you just weasel out of direct answers, it's also that you guys are always trying to blame your farts on the dog while you're at it as well.
depends on how and where you search I guess.

According to the FBI , the "sovereign citizen movement" is made up of "anti-government
extremists who believe that even though they physically reside in this country, they are
separate or 'sovereign' from the United States."
These people, the FBI says, do not believe they have to answer to any government authority
and can cause a number of problems for law enforcement authorities.
But according to Trowbridge's letter, Kluczynski went much further, including "those who
believe America was founded on godly principles, Christians who take the Bible literally, and
'fundamentalists'."
http://www.examiner.com/article/colo-undersheriff-warns-state-police-homeland-security-to-target-christians

How about this news report. it's easy to find if you look in the right places.
http://www.publicadvocateusa.org/news/article.php?article=8530


or this...
On April 7, 2009, the Department of Homeland Security issued a controversial report on "rightwing
extremism." Titled Rightwing Extremism : Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in
Radicalization and Recruitment , its warning seems to be aimed at creating a special class of
Americans: those who question and resist the rapid shift to socialism. These targeted groups (who
still appreciate our Constitution and its promised human rights) must now be vilified as "the enemy
of the people" -- a dangerous threat to peace and unity. According to this report,
http://www.crossroad.to/News/homeland.htm

For those who say things about Jihad envy or some garbage like that. I challenge you to find talk like this any where about muslims. This is happening and you are in it.
I can't help but look at those pages (human genome) and have a vague sense that this is giving me a glimpse of God's mind.
-Francis Collins lead scientist Human Genome project

Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #296 on: January 13, 2014, 02:10:55 AM »
Question: Why is it hard for believers to answer a direct question?
Answer: They are answering "directly" but your lack of understanding seems to be going unnoticed. It is not the answering that is not taking place it is the lack of understanding that is cyclic. It is for you to tell me what word you do not understand or my responses are limited.

By answering it like so, it proves that any god that such a believer believes in cannot be as godly as one would claim.
It proves nothing unless your mental faculties have aligned itself to comprehend what you ask. You can only ask a question based on what you already know so that you can build upon it thus fine tuning your mental frequency and no mistake is being made and no ignorance is spouted and everyone is deluded and upset. Peace.
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #297 on: January 13, 2014, 02:29:09 AM »
It proves nothing unless your mental faculties have aligned itself to comprehend what you ask. You can only ask a question based on what you already know so that you can build upon it thus fine tuning your mental frequency and no mistake is being made and no ignorance is spouted and everyone is deluded and upset. Peace.

Not to nit pick, but you can also ask a question to gain new knowledge, even if you do not know it already.

But this still does not get any progress done other than "Theists answer it, its just that you don't have the same mindset".

Which IMO is crap, as you can use it for anything.

"Genieists answer questions, its just that you do not see it"

Etc.
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #298 on: January 13, 2014, 02:45:11 AM »
It proves nothing unless your mental faculties have aligned itself to comprehend what you ask. You can only ask a question based on what you already know so that you can build upon it thus fine tuning your mental frequency and no mistake is being made and no ignorance is spouted and everyone is deluded and upset. Peace.

Not to nit pick, but you can also ask a question to gain new knowledge, even if you do not know it already.

But this still does not get any progress done other than "Theists answer it, its just that you don't have the same mindset".

Which IMO is crap, as you can use it for anything.

"Genieists answer questions, its just that you do not see it"

Etc.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion but a fact remains a facts. Science is clear on what it aims to achieve by the scientific method. The imagination however is whatever you think and create out of imagining stuff - which clearly is not there and although beautiful and imaginative it remains outside the realm of science. It is the logic and the method that theists use to help explain these things created out of atheists imagination to put them on the right track.
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #299 on: January 13, 2014, 02:53:07 AM »
Everyone is entitled to an opinion but a fact remains a facts.

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, but some a shittier than others.

Science is clear on what it aims to achieve by the scientific method.



The imagination however is whatever you think and create out of imagining stuff - which clearly is not there and although beautiful and imaginative it remains outside the realm of science.

I know what an imagination is, I also know that an imagination does not equate to reality, and thus should not be used to solve reality.

It is the logic and the method that theists use to help explain these things created out of atheists imagination to put them on the right track.

Wait...
Are you saying that theists make up bullshit...just to keep scientists working?
I mean...it looks like that, but i would never say that...
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #300 on: January 13, 2014, 03:07:51 AM »
Everyone is entitled to an opinion but a fact remains a facts.

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, but some a shittier than others.

Science is clear on what it aims to achieve by the scientific method.

The imagination however is whatever you think and create out of imagining stuff - which clearly is not there and although beautiful and imaginative it remains outside the realm of science.

I know what an imagination is, I also know that an imagination does not equate to reality, and thus should not be used to solve reality.

It is the logic and the method that theists use to help explain these things created out of atheists imagination to put them on the right track.

Wait...
Are you saying that theists make up bullshit...just to keep scientists working?
I mean...it looks like that, but i would never say that...
As I said originally. "It is not that some are not answering your questions" - it is more like "you are not understanding the answers". Could be your mental frequency(electroencephalography) is not matching the frequencies of the theists. Why don't you keep it simple. First admit that the words and questions are being answered is not at your level of comprehension that is why you are not understanding it. No one has mentioned BS and assholes apart from you. I suspect there are good reasons why parents tell stories to their kids. Partly for the entertainment value and partly to pass a lesson of a sort but never trying to hurt it - more like to protect it when it does not quite understand the bigger picture.
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #301 on: January 13, 2014, 03:17:13 AM »
As I said originally. "It is not that some are not answering your questions" - it is more like "you are not understanding the answers".

No, its more like "Gee whiz, i wonder why none of those answers make sense to people who do not believe in a deity". Maybe because there is no forced delusion there.

Could be your mental frequency(electroencephalography) is not matching the frequencies of the theists.

As far as i am concerned, there is no such thing as a "theist exclusive brain frequency that makes all bullcrap answers true".

First admit that the words and questions are being answered is not at your level of comprehension that is why you are not understanding it.

What?
Nyet! Why the hell should i accept an answer that is based on something that objects with reality.

No one has mentioned BS and assholes apart from you.

Okay, right, so i typed words. Your point is? (Its also really hot here, and i have a serious sun burn, so i am a bit angry...)

I suspect there are good reasons why parents tell stories to their kids. Partly for the entertainment value and partly to pass a lesson of a sort but never trying to hurt it - more like to protect it when it does not quite understand the bigger picture.

No seriously.
Rule 1: No pooftas. Rule 2: No maltreating the theists, IF, anyone is watching. Rule 3: No pooftas. Rule 4: I do not want to see anyone NOT drinking after light out. Rule 5: No pooftas. Rule 6: There is NO...rule 6.

Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #302 on: January 13, 2014, 03:30:46 AM »
No, its more like "Gee whiz, i wonder why none of those answers make sense to people who do not believe in a deity". Maybe because there is no forced delusion there.
Why does eternity go on forever? In my understanding no one is forcing anyone to believe anything.

As far as i am concerned, there is no such thing as a "theist exclusive brain frequency that makes all bullcrap answers true".
That is clearly your belief and not science.

What?
Nyet! Why the hell should i accept an answer that is based on something that objects with reality.
Your lack of understanding is clear - no one is asking you to believe you are not understanding - that is clear for all to see.

Okay, right, so i typed words. Your point is? (Its also really hot here, and i have a serious sun burn, so i am a bit angry...)
Lets face it - anger is based on the mental emotional workings of a toddler not getting its toys and throwing a tantrum. Unless you have a better explanation for your lack of understanding other than frequencies which in my opinion is much closer to the truth than any other thing you have said to clairfy it.

I suspect there are good reasons why parents tell stories to their kids. Partly for the entertainment value and partly to pass a lesson of a sort but never trying to hurt it - more like to protect it when it does not quite understand the bigger picture.

No seriously.
Is pictures really necessary for you?
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #303 on: January 13, 2014, 03:42:03 AM »
Why does eternity go on forever? In my understanding no one is forcing anyone to believe anything.

Err, because eternity can be defined as "forever"?

Just like how a square always has 4 sides.

That is clearly your belief and not science.

Now that i think of it, burden of proof.
Post your source for your claim or be handwaved.

Your lack of understanding is clear - no one is asking you to believe you are not understanding - that is clear for all to see.

I think i can say, with partial certainty, that others here would agree that crap answers should not be accepted.

Lets face it - anger is based on the mental emotional workings of a toddler not getting its toys and throwing a tantrum.

Anger is the emotion caused by metaphorical gears grinding, making the machine get pissed off.

Unless you have a better explanation for your lack of understanding other than frequencies which in my opinion is much closer to the truth than any other thing you have said to clairfy it.

You have not even posted a damned link, you made baseless assertions that have no more value that anyone posting anything.

I also made no other claim than "bullshit answer should not be accepted".

Is pictures really necessary for you?

As a Brony who can be considered "generic", yes, posting images of ponies when able is necessary, when relevant.
What is your boggle?
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Offline Jesuis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #304 on: January 13, 2014, 04:04:14 AM »
Err, because eternity can be defined as "forever"?

Just like how a square always has 4 sides.
Its your belief that eternity goes on forever - there is no proof of that.

Now that i think of it, burden of proof.
Post your source for your claim or be handwaved.
I do not need a hand waved. Especially from someone not understanding what he is talking about. All I need is for you to build on what you really know rather than on what you do not. That would make sense and provide the opportunity for progress. I can give out a stars but that is just infants and I cannot treat you like that?

I think i can say, with partial certainty, that others here would agree that crap answers should not be accepted.
I have not put forward a crap answer - and it is your claim that others are posting crap especially religious or theist - it is purely because you do not understand frequencies that you make such claims and do not build on what you know or do not know - it is not  the answer that is wrong or crap - it could be simply that you have no clue.

Anger is the emotion caused by metaphorical gears grinding, making the machine get pissed off.
So you are not in control of your own machine? Anger might just be a frequency of mind where the conscious observer has no need to use that frequency as it is so infantile and childish and clear to the parent looking at the sibling.

You have not even posted a damned link, you made baseless assertions that have no more value that anyone posting anything.
I did ask you to rephrase the question but you claimed it was enough as it is. Clearly you are not understanding the word frequency ad many others. What do you really know or is this your ego ranting?

I also made no other claim than "bullshit answer should not be accepted".
yet nothing you have said about the answer gives any indication that you understand it in its entirety.

As a Brony who can be considered "generic", yes, posting images of ponies when able is necessary, when relevant.
What is your boggle?
Enjoy yourself. whatever you like - carry on.
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Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #305 on: January 13, 2014, 04:19:32 AM »
Its your belief that eternity goes on forever - there is no proof of that.

Incorrect, eternity is a word, and that word can be defined as forever.
Thus if you use the right definition, eternity means forever.

If you want to argue that words are not as they are defined as, do so in the chatter area.

I do not need a hand waved. Especially from someone not understanding what he is talking about. All I need is for you to build on what you really know rather than on what you do not. That would make sense and provide the opportunity for progress. I can give out a stars but that is just infants and I cannot treat you like that?

You refuse to prove your baseless claim?
(-1 incoming)

I have not put forward a crap answer - and it is your claim that others are posting crap especially religious or theist - it is purely because you do not understand frequencies that you make such claims and do not build on what you know or do not know - it is not  the answer that is wrong or crap - it could be simply that you have no clue.

I am not going to argue with someone who refuses to prove his claim of mutually exclusive theist brain frequencies.

So you are not in control of your own machine? Anger might just be a frequency of mind where the conscious observer has no need to use that frequency as it is so infantile and childish and clear to the parent looking at the sibling.

Bah, the one who is arguing for people who think there is a magical sky daddy who will take care of you is calling ME childish? What a ridiculous sentiment.

Enjoy yourself. whatever you like - carry on.

Will do.

Finally: http://thumb.egloos.net:8080/460x0/http://pds20.egloos.com/pds/201010/26/64/e0003064_4cc631ce21c73.jpg
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #306 on: January 13, 2014, 04:46:19 AM »
We do answer questions as best we can. But, trying to fully understand God is tough for people and atheists think we're stumped.

Imagine an ant trying to answer questions about a human. They would not be able to. This doesn't mean humans don't exist. it just means the ants can't fully understand us.

There probably is no need to answer or there are answers and no one understand it.
For instance many people perhaps cannot explain what frequencies are - they therefore lack the ability or vocabulary to explain said unknown - however it does not mean frequencies do not exist. Some things that were written for a primitve mind relative to science cannot be understood by those with a differnt mental and vocabulary make up. One would say it is all realtive to the receiver.

Two responses that seem to echo what Mooby was saying - that god is simply so different, so unimaginably unexplainable, that most believers simply CANNOT articulate it.

I've got no problem with that.  OldChurchGuy for example is fully prepared to say "I don't know" when he reaches that stage.  But many, many other Christians (I would say most) feel that "I don't know" somehow would make them lose.....even though they all agree that their god is unknowable, moves in mysterious ways, and all that.  They want to push on, explain and explain the unexplainable - and in doing so, in my experience drift further and further from answering the questions I am posing.

They also miss the point of the OP itself: that a god that was GOD, that was LOVE, simply wouldn't cause these questions in the first place.  The questions would not be able to exist.

And they also miss the point that salvation comes from belief and acceptance, at their own god's dictat - and that at the same time, their god is the one who determines his level of comprehensibility.  Its like spending a year in advanced calculus with the teacher going "well, its all really complicated, we'll never understand it and I can't really explain it" - then at final exam you are told "100% score, or we shoot you in the head".

Is any believer prepared to square that circle for me?  That salvation requires understanding, but that understanding is extremely difficult (if not impossible) to come by?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #307 on: January 13, 2014, 08:34:56 AM »

Who? NOT Obama. He's a muslim.

He isn't. That's a fact. He was baptized in The United Church of Christ. He attends church. He goes out with an uncovered head. He eats pork. He has never been shown as an adult to bow to Mecca.

So, once again, you ignore fact.



An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #308 on: January 13, 2014, 08:39:26 AM »

If there was a truly good and godly god, it would be clear.  No nagging doubts, no endless arguments.  It would be clear and obvious to all.  The fact that it isn't may not necessarily mean there isn't a god out there.  But it sure makes it clear that there is something seriously wrong with the picture.
There probably is no need to answer or there are answers and no one understand it.
For instance many people perhaps cannot explain what frequencies are - they therefore lack the ability or vocabulary to explain said unknown - however it does not mean frequencies do not exist. Some things that were written for a primitve mind relative to science cannot be understood by those with a differnt mental and vocabulary make up. One would say it is all realtive to the receiver.

I'm finding quite amusing that you are illustrating the original post's point.
Forgive me for my ignorance, but can you explain why you say that?

Because he states a truly good god would make it clear, and you appeal to how it has to be unclear. Are you saying your god lacks the ability to make it clear, or the will to make it clear?

An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #309 on: January 13, 2014, 08:55:47 AM »

Imagine an ant trying to answer questions about a human. They would not be able to. This doesn't mean humans don't exist. it just means the ants can't fully understand us.


You stated man cannot comprehend God any more than an ant can comprehend man. I state that, first, an ant can actually intact with man on a limited basis...confirm man's existence...even though man's way, purposes and desires are beyond an ant's comprehension. But Religion does quite the opposite...it cannot even show God's existence, but states whats God ways, purpose, and desires in very human terms. That is why I am tired of hearing the ant analogy...there is no analogy.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline G-Roll

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #310 on: January 13, 2014, 09:19:11 AM »
Tack this, Poag... Your publication date is 10FEB2009
Maybe you should check into something a bit more up to date.
Well... Seeming you are the expert on this subject I expected you to post something more update. This is the latest DOD instruction I know of. If you got something more recent that says you cannot pray whenever you want I would love to see it.
   
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Not allowing me to say "in jesus name" is a violation of my freedom of speech. You don't mind that though?
You can say in Jesus name all you want. You can get a group of guys together (willing participants) and pray to Jesus all you want. What doesn’t happen anymore is Chaplains cant preach to me and say in Jesus name in public formations. And yes no more crosses at Easter or Christmas. The US as a whole has gone secular for holidays.
If I thought your freedom of speech was being threatened then yes I would support you. If I thought the US government was making it illegal to be Christian I would be posting words of support. But alas that is not the case.

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At any rate. I can say as a deployed infantry soldier with secret security clearance, Your government lies to you.
As a deployed infantry soldier you should know you can't post things like this on social media sites. Be careful dude. I have seen people get kicked out over this stuff. Grant it was on Facebook with blatant hey it's me and here are some pictures... but still.
 
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The question is when it comes will you stand with the Christian and his American right to be.
Sure. Just provide me with some evidence of your persecution. Something other than some Christian website that thinks Merica is being torn apart by Obama the antichrist who is killing Merica because he is inclusive of all faiths. Not just your faith. I stopped reading at that part.
And a fox news link? Do you have anything DOD, US Army, or anything official? Again like I said should I see with my own eyes or be provided evidence of Christian persecution in the US military you are all just full of crocodile tears.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #311 on: January 13, 2014, 09:24:02 AM »
Question: Why is it hard for believers to answer a direct question?
Answer: They are answering "directly" but your lack of understanding seems to be going unnoticed. It is not the answering that is not taking place it is the lack of understanding that is cyclic. It is for you to tell me what word you do not understand or my responses are limited.
To a certain extent, this is true. Religion has its own language. Those who are brought up in religion are bi-lingual.

This bi-lingual ability only kicks in when religion is the subject of the conversation.

Religious language is very poorly defined and often, a simple noun, e.g. soul, has no easy translation into everyday English. Even amongst the religious, its meaning is not clear – we see this in discussions as to what exactly a soul is and does.

Religious language is, of necessity, vague and imprecise. Nothing of the main tenets has been seen, so its definition is bound to be fuzzy and subjective.

The religious can speak “normal English” though – you ask a Christian engineer to tell you about the forces on a piece of metal and his description will be just as good as an atheist engineer’s. We do not expect the Christian engineer to talk of demons pressing down on the metal or “God’s Grace” preventing the object from collapsing.

When speaking of religion, the atheist wants the facts not some nebulous bullsh*t but the religious person slips straight away into his second language and blames the atheist for “not understanding.”

The truth is there is no “understanding”. No two Christians agree on the majority of concepts but two engineers do.

This is best shown in the creation of the universe. The Christian will explain in “Religiousese” that “God spoke it into existence.” And will then slip back into “normal English” to ask what scientific proof is there of the Big Bang. – As if “speaking something into existence” actually meant something and was explicable.

Added to this, the religious speak amongst themselves in a mixture of “normal English” and “Religiousese.” They are quite happy in both languages and when discussing the finer points of “What is the soul” they throw in as much Religiouses as possible in a sort of “See how fluent I am” style.

So, in your explanation
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They are answering "directly" but your lack of understanding seems to be going unnoticed.

“Lack of understanding” means “you do not speak “Religiousese””… but even if I did, my understanding would not be greater, as you will find out if you try to explain the Trinity.
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #312 on: January 13, 2014, 09:41:16 AM »

The truth is there is no “understanding”. No two Christians agree on the majority of concepts but two engineers do.


Amongst other reasons, there a reason two engineers have a common knowledge of concepts, because if they don't, the project they are working on together will fail. This was understood early on when the Imperial Roman Standardized units of measurement were created.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #313 on: January 13, 2014, 10:03:53 AM »
Really.... Who? NOT Obama. He's a muslim. Romney was Mormon NOT Christian. Who has been loud and proud since maybe Regan?
It seems you've bought into the right-wing propaganda aimed at discrediting Obama by any means possible.  Fact is, Obama is no more a Muslim than I am.

And Mormons are a Christian sect, just one that's not accepted by the majority of other Christians.  I mean, their church is called "the Church of Jesus Christ and Latter Day Saints", after all.

Offline Ivellios

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #314 on: January 13, 2014, 11:39:38 AM »
Jesuis- Do you know how insulting it is to be told, "I could answer the question, but you wouldn't understand it anyways!" is?

Most people do not have the intellectual honesty to admit they don't understand something, and instead try to wiggle thier way out of it, in hopes that the direction they take something causes the person they are conversing with to forget that there wasn't ananswer.

I've had this one thing tied to my profile for years[1], very few know what it is or why it's there. It's from the movie Patlabor. There are these mechanized piloted suits used for dangerous tasks called 'Labors.' When someone uses them to commit crime or just run amok, like the famous tank incident, instead of calling the National Guard they have thier own police force unit with them, Patrol Labors.

In the movie the manufacturer released a new OS, coined the Hyper Operating System, or HOS. However there are certain problems with it. So this one cop visits his old friend that works for the manufacturer and asks, "Is it safe?"

His reply was, "We've got good results from customes that are pleased with our product. It's being used in all the top industralized nations!" blah blah blah

cop, "None of that is what I asked you! Is it safe?"

----------------------

A dodge coupled with Appeal to Popularity, and a few other Logical Fallacies. Just like a response from Christians.

If you didn't take that 'holier than thou' attitude and treat us like infants, and used everyday language, not just the one you use on sundays, with other people that use said language only on sundays, too. An engineer that truly understands thier work, and knows that you're not going to understand 'engineer speak' is going to use modern everyday speech, and use analogies that you can understand.

That's what seperates a good teacher or communicator from a ****ty one. More often that not, the problem is the 'teacher.' How many times did the Apostles just not get it when being taught by the "good teacher"? Did he just say, "Well, you're just to stupid to understand, so I'm not going to waste my time explaining it to you,"?

This is also why your ant analogy fails. God is All-Knowing, All-Loving and All-Powerful. ie He could speak ant if he chooses to. He could have made the ant so he could talk normally, and the ant would understand. He could just 'poof' understanding in the ant's brain. Since he's allegedly All-Loving, one would expect him to do something, rather than to leave them stumble and burn. Like the 'little birds outside in the snow' analogy you're giving God, an Omni-max being, human limitations. You're pigeon-holing him. And if christians who cannot communicate is the absolute best he can do, well now, it just doesn't seem like he's the 'god' that everyone seems to be describing. Like they've got a few of the descriptors *** backwards or something. I think it was Hatter that said something like, "If I can think of a better way, then he's not perfect."

Edit: Footnote added. Grammar and punctuation.
 1. Location box, used to show under gender, iirc. First said Sol System, but after so many Christians sounding like him...
« Last Edit: January 13, 2014, 01:27:24 PM by Ivellios »

Offline MadBunny

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #315 on: January 13, 2014, 11:54:19 AM »
depends on how and where you search I guess.

According to the FBI , the "sovereign citizen movement" is made up of "anti-government
extremists who believe that even though they physically reside in this country, they are
separate or 'sovereign' from the United States."
These people, the FBI says, do not believe they have to answer to any government authority
and can cause a number of problems for law enforcement authorities.
But according to Trowbridge's letter, Kluczynski went much further, including "those who
believe America was founded on godly principles, Christians who take the Bible literally, and
'fundamentalists'."
http://www.examiner.com/article/colo-undersheriff-warns-state-police-homeland-security-to-target-christians

How about this news report. it's easy to find if you look in the right places.
http://www.publicadvocateusa.org/news/article.php?article=8530


I don't want to get into 'the dictionary' game here but do you understand what secession means?  So all of your blowhard boyfriends yabbering about how great they think that idea is, are literally people who may reside in the country but have no desire to be part of it.

"the examiner"?  That thing is a fucking rag.  I wouldn't wipe *your* ass with it.  I just went there and for kicks clicked on the Christie page.  It's full of opinion pieces about how the traffic thing is all a liberal plot to make him look bad and hurt his white house chances.



or this...
On April 7, 2009, the Department of Homeland Security issued a controversial report on "rightwing
extremism." Titled Rightwing Extremism : Current Economic and Political Climate Fueling Resurgence in
Radicalization and Recruitment , its warning seems to be aimed at creating a special class of
Americans: those who question and resist the rapid shift to socialism. These targeted groups (who
still appreciate our Constitution and its promised human rights) must now be vilified as "the enemy
of the people" -- a dangerous threat to peace and unity. According to this report,
http://www.crossroad.to/News/homeland.htm

For those who say things about Jihad envy or some garbage like that. I challenge you to find talk like this any where about muslims. This is happening and you are in it.

Do you really want to get into a discussion of how fucking stupid this is?  Let me guess, you're all about Benghazi, Obama being a Muslim/Kenyan, and health care being the new slavery.  Muslims are not a danger to this country right now, its people like you.   


If you are actually a member of the US armed forces are you intimate; you are a disgrace to that uniform and do not deserve to be a representative of this country.
Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #316 on: January 13, 2014, 11:55:52 AM »
Its your belief that eternity goes on forever - there is no proof of that.
As "forever" is the definition of eternity, it requires no proof - it is true by definition. If you challenge it or deny it, simply put, you are wrong. And that is that - case closed.

Carry on and this time try to keep up.
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline MadBunny

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #317 on: January 13, 2014, 11:56:33 AM »
Really.... Who? NOT Obama. He's a muslim. Romney was Mormon NOT Christian. Who has been loud and proud since maybe Regan?
It seems you've bought into the right-wing propaganda aimed at discrediting Obama by any means possible.  Fact is, Obama is no more a Muslim than I am.

And Mormons are a Christian sect, just one that's not accepted by the majority of other Christians.  I mean, their church is called "the Church of Jesus Christ and Latter Day Saints", after all.

He's so Muslim that he CONSTANTLY praises god at the end of every speech and address, attends a Christian church every week, eats non-halal food, lets his wife and kids run around bareheaded and bare armed.

Give a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a night.  Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Offline G-Roll

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Re: Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?
« Reply #318 on: January 13, 2014, 12:01:49 PM »
He's so Muslim that he CONSTANTLY praises god at the end of every speech and address, attends a Christian church every week, eats non-halal food, lets his wife and kids run around bareheaded and bare armed.

Makes me wonder if it would be an issue if Obama was Muslim. If so why? Why does Obama's religious identity matter to them so long as it is not in the extreme? I don’t get these people.