Author Topic: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?  (Read 17732 times)

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Offline magicmiles

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #348 on: October 31, 2013, 04:24:20 PM »
I have a Thor costume just waiting for your visit to the US, you hot Ozzie you. :-*

I've heard it takes about 2 hours just to clear customs in LA. Following a 13 hour flight crammed into an economy seat. (I'm a touch over 6 feet). I don't think I want to visit quite that much. Maybe if a rich relative dies and leaves me lots of cash I can fly business.
Go on up you baldhead.

Offline Astreja

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #349 on: October 31, 2013, 05:22:10 PM »
I'm merely an observer of human nature.

Not a very astute observer, alas.

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All Some women feel guilt after they have an abortion, because it goes against their nature social conditioning, as they were hardwired raised to protect their offspring, to die for them, if necessary.

FTFY.  (And how the Niflheim is a child supposed to survive if the mother dies?)

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Many women lack the mental toughness required to give birth to a child.   That is why I said is too bad men were not the ones who became pregnant because we are not divas and also we obviously much physically stronger than women.

Physical strength has virtually nothing to do with childbirth, Dr. T.  The female body has a few key advantages that males lack -- Slightly more flexible joints, and a very wide pelvic girdle.  If the average man tried to pass even a small full-term baby through his pelvis, he'd probably either bleed to death or crush the baby's skull against the various bony structures below as he tried to eject Junior from his body using brute force.
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Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #350 on: October 31, 2013, 05:29:41 PM »
^^^^Nice visual there, Norsegirl. :P
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline shnozzola

Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #351 on: October 31, 2013, 05:43:57 PM »
Who have I belittled on here?

My bold.

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i don't care about that loser one way or another.       I can see him being the loser in high school who bullied the smart kids for being smart.
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All these dumb Democrat voters complaining about their premiums being jacked up or losing their plans at their companies.
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because all you wanted to do was GET IT ON with some stranger you meet at McDonalds one night.
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most people on here are liberal arts majors, majoring in religion or art history, etc and they have to take one or two biology classes 
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Many women lack the mental toughness required to give birth to a child.

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Many of you live immoral lives, and have had several abortions, and you fear a God will have his revenge.   
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Maybe you are stupid and too stupid to know it.
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You kind of remind of that bimbo Miss South Carolina contestant a few years ago
“The best thing for being sad," replied Merlin, beginning to puff and blow, "is to learn something."  ~ T. H. White
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Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #352 on: October 31, 2013, 05:49:08 PM »
Who has Dr. T not belittled? He actually called me a racist! :? &) ;D
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Nam

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #353 on: October 31, 2013, 05:54:55 PM »
Who has Dr. T not belittled? He actually called me a racist! :? &) ;D

He meant "praisist".

;)

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #354 on: October 31, 2013, 05:58:13 PM »
Maybe he meant to call me a "raisin" because I am black, sweet and of a certain age? No, because that might actually be funny. :P
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Nam

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #355 on: October 31, 2013, 06:03:45 PM »
Maybe he meant to call me a "raisin" because I am black, sweet and of a certain age? No, because that might actually be funny. :P

I think you mean "prune". :P

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline DrTesla

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #356 on: October 31, 2013, 10:39:22 PM »
Who has Dr. T not belittled? He actually called me a racist! :? &) ;D

That is because you called black people "dumb hicks". 

As an African American,  I was offended deeply.  It was almost worse than watching black people get hosed down in Alabama on tv in the 1960s.
"You want to know who just loves abortions? God loves abortions. He performs them all the time and not even for the money. "  NoGodsForMe

"I wish it was men who got pregnant b/c we would squirt out these babies and go about our business.  We don't have be divas on this stuff."  DrTesla

Offline DrTesla

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #357 on: October 31, 2013, 10:49:35 PM »

I have spoken to a number of women about their abortions, and the overwhelming feeling they all report is of relief. GUILT.  They talk about the incredible stress of trying to decide what to do, the pressure from family and society to have the child, or to not to have the child. They felt like they were going mad from the stress. Once they made the decision to have the abortion, the stress was off. And the Guilt was just starting LOL

Some women also report feelings of regret guilt. so young, so old, or with the wrong man, or when they already had three kids, or when they weThey wished they had not gotten pregnant aborted their baby rThey regret not being better about the birth control. They regret having sex when drunk or high, or with a man they were afraid of. But clearly, it is better to regret an abortion than to regret having a child.

Women don't think abortion is good orand fun. Many say the operation itself was

And isn't it too bad that the perfect god made weak, silly women the ones to endure pregnancy and childbirth. Especially when women all over the world do heavy field work, haul wood and water, walk long distances carrying heavy loads without complaining and with babies on their backs. LLOL cough bullchit cough LOL But as weak as they are, they still manage to give birth to as many as 10 children, often without any pain medication or even medical assistance. &)

Clearly big strong tough men could do it better. Although men have less physical endurance, less lower body strength and lower pain tolerance than women they should have been the ones to have the babies.[1]After all, being able to bench press a lot of weight is all it takes to go through pregnancy, labor, childbirth, breastfeeding and childrearing. Wonder why god made such a big mistake? And all through the animal kingdom as well....  :?

Women are Neanderthals who like killing babies, 'cause it's fun! Women are also too mentally and physically weak to have babies. But they should be forced to have children, because they are whiny divas who should just man up and endure every pregnancy, no matter what. And then hand them over to the nearest storefront adoption agency and walk away.

From the way you come across here, you don't really respect women very much, or relate to their life experiences at all. And you obviously don't really care about babies or children.  :P
 1. They could still take over the child care after the baby is born, since they are so mentally and physically strong and all. Wonder why they don't do that.....
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 10:54:37 PM by DrTesla »
"You want to know who just loves abortions? God loves abortions. He performs them all the time and not even for the money. "  NoGodsForMe

"I wish it was men who got pregnant b/c we would squirt out these babies and go about our business.  We don't have be divas on this stuff."  DrTesla

Offline DrTesla

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #358 on: October 31, 2013, 11:02:15 PM »
God Hater,

So I am supposed to care about the woman's stress over the baby?  In other words,  the woman getting "relief" from her stress is what is important here,  not the life of a precious child.

We may be challenging the laws of common decency.  Clearly nobody elevates women more than I do and puts them up on a pedastal they don't really deserve.   But at the same time I think these innocents are being held hostage by their so called "mothers".

I have a question.  Are liberal women still waiting on other people to pay for their birth control.  I assumed Sandra Fluke struck out when she went to testify in front of Congress on this "important" issue.   lol   

Have most women who get pregnant with a parasite (as they put it) even know about birth control?   

Do they not know they can say no to the random stranger at the McDonalds who wants to GET IT ON?   

Women feel guilt about abortions.   Numerous studies have shown this and it is common sense if you understand human nature and the female pysche in terms of being a nurturer while the man is off making the money to support her luxurious lifestyle. 
"You want to know who just loves abortions? God loves abortions. He performs them all the time and not even for the money. "  NoGodsForMe

"I wish it was men who got pregnant b/c we would squirt out these babies and go about our business.  We don't have be divas on this stuff."  DrTesla

Offline Astreja

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #359 on: October 31, 2013, 11:47:34 PM »
Do they not know they can say no to the random stranger at the McDonalds who wants to GET IT ON?

Probably.  Considerably harder to say no to a spouse who refuses to respect that "no," won't give her money for birth control pills and won't wear a condom because he prefers to use his dipstick au naturel

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Women feel guilt about abortions.   Numerous studies have shown this and it is common sense if you understand human nature and the female psyche in terms of being a nurturer while the man is off making the money to support her luxurious lifestyle.

Well,  you apparently do not understand the female psyche.  Oh, and *I* was the breadwinner in My ill-starred 17-year marriage to Whatisname.  My "luxurious lifestyle" involved financing his hobby business (only one barely profitable year, and about $20K in loans, which I paid off to preserve My own credit rating).  At one point I had only $20.00 to feed the family for a week... And I did it.  At another point I couldn't afford laundry soap for My work clothes and was wearing pantyhose with runs in them so that I could buy groceries.  If I  had had a second child, social assistance or bankruptcy would have been distinct possibilities.

After I broomed him to the curb 13 years ago, I was able to finance My own luxurious lifestyle, thank you very much.  (holds up sheaf of season tickets from local symphony and smirks)
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #360 on: November 01, 2013, 03:19:36 AM »
In other words,  the woman getting "relief" from her stress is what is important here,  not the life of a precious child.

Quick question DT - how many children have you adopted?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Nam

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #361 on: November 01, 2013, 03:43:13 AM »
You notice his words "precious", "innocent", etc., these are filler words; they mean nothing, to him.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline Wasserbuffel

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #362 on: November 01, 2013, 08:50:58 AM »
Quote
Do they not know they can say no to the random stranger at the McDonalds who wants to GET IT ON? 

I'm left wondering when McDonald's became such a great hookup spot.  I though most one-nighters started in bars.

Then again Dr. Troll has displayed a staggering inability to exercise any sort of intellectual effort in this thread and others that I'm not surprised he'd see the local burger joint as the best place to pick up women.

Is that where you met the wife you can't seem to remember if you have or not?

Quote
Clearly nobody elevates women more than I do and puts them up on a pedastal they don't really deserve.

HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!

Thanks, I needed that.

Carry on.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 08:52:31 AM by Wasserbuffel »

Offline Angus and Alexis

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #363 on: November 01, 2013, 10:15:12 AM »
Numerous studies have shown this and it is common sense if you understand human nature and the female pysche in terms of being a nurturer while the man is off making the money to support her luxurious lifestyle.

You are sick, you know that?

Not only are females able to take care of themselves, i know for fact that many a women has to take care of their husband too.

Heck, females are genetically superior to males in almost every way too.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #364 on: November 01, 2013, 11:35:37 AM »
Quote for ignore list avoidance

Please don't do that. If someone does not want to read another member's post, that is their prerogative, however misguided you may find it.  Also, let's not perpetuate the name calling. 

Thanks.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #365 on: November 01, 2013, 11:44:43 AM »
So I am supposed to care about the woman's stress over the baby?

Why would you not?  Are you some kind of unempathetic sociopath?

not the life of a precious child.

Granting it even is a child (it's not), what makes its life any more precious than the mothers?  I've asked you already, why do you think the fertilized egg has more right to a woman's uterus than the woman?

Clearly nobody elevates women more than I do and puts them up on a pedastal they don't really deserve.

Clearly you do not, based on your previous post, wherein you call women whiney and weak.  Or the rest of this post.

You really suck.


 
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Offline Jag

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #366 on: November 01, 2013, 12:15:26 PM »
God Hater,

So I am supposed to care about the woman's stress over the baby?  In other words,  the woman getting "relief" from her stress is what is important here,  not the life of a precious child.

We may be challenging the laws of common decency.  Clearly nobody elevates women more than I do and puts them up on a pedastal they don't really deserve.   But at the same time I think these innocents are being held hostage by their so called "mothers".

I have a question.  Are liberal women still waiting on other people to pay for their birth control.  I assumed Sandra Fluke struck out when she went to testify in front of Congress on this "important" issue.   lol   

Have most women who get pregnant with a parasite (as they put it) even know about birth control?   

Do they not know they can say no to the random stranger at the McDonalds who wants to GET IT ON?   

Women feel guilt about abortions.   Numerous studies have shown this and it is common sense if you understand human nature and the female pysche in terms of being a nurturer while the man is off making the money to support her luxurious lifestyle.

Childish Troll,

No one expects you to "care" about anything. Your complete lack of regard for actual people is apparent in every post you've made. Do you really think you are doing any good at all for the Silent Majority you claim to be speaking on behalf of? It's the kind of petty nonsense you've filled this forum with that just keeps bringing people to the side of rational thought - no one wants to be associated with such blatant disregard for actual people.

Thank you for doing your part, no matter how accidental and unintended, to bring more people to reality with your hate-filled, childish rhetoric.
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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #367 on: November 01, 2013, 12:24:37 PM »
That is because you called black people "dumb hicks". 

As an African American,  I was offended deeply.  It was almost worse than watching black people get hosed down in Alabama on tv in the 1960s.
Offended by a black person referring to her relatives (also black people) as dumb hicks?  That's not racism anymore than me (a white person) calling my brother (another white person) an idiot is.

Offline Jag

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #368 on: November 01, 2013, 12:30:45 PM »
Who has Dr. T not belittled? He actually called me a racist! :? &) ;D

That is because you called black people "dumb hicks". 

As an African American,  I was offended deeply.  It was almost worse than watching black people get hosed down in Alabama on tv in the 1960s.

I think this is appropriate*, under the circumstances:

But I'll take any opportunity to promote Tim Minchin so my motives may be suspect.

*but definitely NSFW - he rarely is, but he's consistently hilarious
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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #369 on: November 01, 2013, 12:42:26 PM »
So I am supposed to care about the woman's stress over the baby?  In other words,  the woman getting "relief" from her stress is what is important here,  not the life of a precious child.
It's not your business in the first place.  Especially when your concern about the child fetus stops the moment it's born.

Quote from: DrTesla
We may be challenging the laws of common decency.  Clearly nobody elevates women more than I do and puts them up on a pedastal they don't really deserve.   But at the same time I think these innocents are being held hostage by their so called "mothers".
Oh, please.  If you actually cared at all, you'd let your so-called concern extend to single mothers who don't choose to have abortions and who do choose to keep their child.  Yet somehow I doubt that you're interested in actually helping to provide any support to those women, or even to the adoption agencies you so loudly laud.

Quote from: DrTesla
I have a question.  Are liberal women still waiting on other people to pay for their birth control.  I assumed Sandra Fluke struck out when she went to testify in front of Congress on this "important" issue.   lol
Well, if you don't want those women to have abortions, seems to me that making birth control easily available would solve the problem neatly.

Quote from: DrTesla
Have most women who get pregnant with a parasite (as they put it) even know about birth control?
Probably a lot more than you do, judging from your lack of knowledge on other subjects you decided to expound on.

Quote from: DrTesla
Do they not know they can say no to the random stranger at the McDonalds who wants to GET IT ON?
And I'll bet that virtually all of them do.

Quote from: DrTesla
Women feel guilt about abortions.   Numerous studies have shown this and it is common sense if you understand human nature and the female pysche in terms of being a nurturer while the man is off making the money to support her luxurious lifestyle.
Somehow, I doubt you understand any of this at all.  These are buzzwords that you can toss out to try to get a reaction, not things you've seriously thought about.

Offline Nam

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #370 on: November 01, 2013, 01:45:59 PM »
I love how DT assumes that conservative women don't get abortions.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #371 on: November 01, 2013, 05:17:53 PM »
I love how DT assumes that conservative women don't get abortions.

-Nam

An awful lot of women who get pregnant, even when the pregnancy is unplanned and unwanted, have the child. They manage, they deal, they cope. Or not.  Then the welfare state, social services, police, foster care and emergency rooms have to take over. Of the many women who I have talked to about this kind of thing, the ones who had children even though they did not particularly want them far outweigh the numbers of women who had abortions.

If, instead of making up crap out of his own head, took the time to read through the actual data collected on women who have abortions-- conveniently provided by Jag on a different thread--  Dr. T would see that most US women who have abortions are religious. Many used birth control, many are married and hardly any fit the stereotype of the drunken slut picking up strange men at the local burger joint.[1]

Warning: possibly graphic stuff coming up.

Of the 6 women whose circumstances I know best, only one got pregnant from a random one-night encounter-- with a guy she met at the laundromat whose name she barely knew. She was a pretty messed up babe overall, and definitely did not need to be trying to handle pregnancy on top of her other problems. Think Amy Winehouse, but with no money or singing ability. She had at least two abortions that I knew of.

The other woman who had several abortions-- a Jewish girl from a conservative wealthy family--was also very messed up. She was strung out on drugs and not taking care of herself due to various psychological problems, sexual abuse, etc. She later got her act together, got into therapy, went back to school, eventually got a doctorate, married a smart, caring black man and they now have two cute biracial kids.

Of the rest, one lady was a married housewife with two kids in high school. And they were Christians, very active in their church in a small midwestern town. She had serious reproductive problems (including random non-stop bleeding) that made it hard for her to use many forms of contraception.   When she got pregnant a third time at 40, she had the abortion and a hysterectomy. Talk about relief.

Another was a Catholic woman who got pregnant by her fiancee before the wedding. She would have been disowned by her very well-placed conservative east coast family, so she had an illegal abortion. It was the 1950's and very important to maintain the illusion of a nice Catholic girl who never had sex before the wedding night. After the wedding, she and her husband went on to have three kids.

Two other women were teachers-- one living apart from her husband, not wanting any children, and trying to hold onto her job and the other just not wanting more than one child. Both of them told me specifically how relieved they were to not be pregnant anymore.

If women were absolutely destroyed by the guilt from having abortions-- and I am thinking mainly of the women whose stories I know best-- they would not have been able to become the productive and happy people they are today. It does not seem like they are crippled by all-consuming guilt. These women did not even express much in the way of regret. If they had stayed pregnant, and accepted the societal, economic, physical and psychological consequences, who knows where they (and the unwanted children) might had ended up?

But even if the stereotype were true, and it was mainly horrible, whiney, stupid, lazy, whorish, low-class, weak, liberal, godless, (etc. negative adjective) women who got abortions, why in hell would anyone (who claimed to care for children) want such women to become mothers? Why would anyone want them to be producing the next generation? It boggles my mind.  :o
 1. Somehow the men who "get it on" with these terrible loose women are rarely brought up in the discussions about how awful abortion is.
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Offline epidemic

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #372 on: November 04, 2013, 03:32:32 PM »
People are hurt by those things.

No people are hurt by allowing abortion, unless you count the feelings of the Christian Taliban.

yeah except the fetus that is being crushed.  why do they react violent to the abortion procedure if they do not feel pain.   What is the magical day that they become alive if we rule out conception?    When are they viable enough where it would be murder if we abort them.  Is this day the same for every baby?   Is the day the day he is born?

I don't know the magical day that they should be protected.  However I can suggest that the first 2 months we have a brain and nervous system that is so incomplete as to not be causing pain or discompfort.  Probably 3rd to 4th month to not be causing pain to a sentient being.  5th month may be getting a little grey.  So months 1-4 I cant see any reason not to abort.  Nothing but the most basic of brain function. 

Personally I probably would go all the way up until the 6th or 7th month as the brain is still so primative as to not be considered to be a sentient being, but I have no problem with a compromise of 4 to 5 month.

Offline shnozzola

Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #373 on: November 04, 2013, 05:25:12 PM »
   I have to say, I believe life begins at conception.  I believe abortion is not a good idea because of this.  Anyone coming to me for counsel would get the " you have a tiny innocent life growing inside of you, and that should be a consideration in your decision."

   However, just as many people, I believe the decision still belongs to the woman  (and man, if in the picture).  No one can pretend to stand in those shoes and make the decision for another.  I will never judge the person once they decide.  I guess my post is one more in the never-ending debate.   Sadly, I can see both sides of this debate, but I absolutely despise the view that some women make the choice lightly.  Stand in those shoes.   
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Offline Jag

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #374 on: November 04, 2013, 08:31:13 PM »
   I have to say, I believe life begins at conception.  I believe abortion is not a good idea because of this.  Anyone coming to me for counsel would get the " you have a tiny innocent life growing inside of you, and that should be a consideration in your decision."

   However, just as many people, I believe the decision still belongs to the woman  (and man, if in the picture).  No one can pretend to stand in those shoes and make the decision for another.  I will never judge the person once they decide.  I guess my post is one more in the never-ending debate.   Sadly, I can see both sides of this debate, but I absolutely despise the view that some women make the choice lightly.  Stand in those shoes.

This is closer to my position than any I've read here. I'm not willing to take a stance on when "life" begins - too many variables and frankly, too many definitions. I don't think abortion is the same as murder and for the most part, I agree with nogods position of abortion on demand for all the reasons she typically provides.

I take this position only because the alternative proposed by the opposition is completely unacceptable.  Until such time as we can provide consistent comprehensive sex education to the masses, and we can also ensure easy access to birth control, along with making sweeping changes in social policies, programs and institutions, this is the only position I can take. I can not support restrictions on abortions without addressing the underlying causes FIRST.

This is also part of why I get so angry when adoption is tossed out as the "obvious" solution. It doesn't address the problem, it addresses the consequences of a lack of better solutions that address the actual problem. If it works so damn well, why haven't we seen any noticeable decrease in abortions?
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #375 on: November 05, 2013, 08:34:50 AM »
I have to say, I believe life begins at conception. 

Why do you believe this?  I'm not going to argue back.  But for the life of me, I cannot understand why people think a single cell, or a lump of cells smaller than a fly's brain, is a person.  And absent belief in a soul, I just don't get it.

For me, it is not about "life".  The ova is, technically, alive.  Every one of the millions of sperm cells are alive.  So what?  The questions for me are, when it is a person, and why does it get more right to a uterus than the owner of the uterus?
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Offline Wasserbuffel

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Re: Isn't abortion the kindest thing one can do for another being?
« Reply #376 on: November 05, 2013, 10:30:13 AM »
Quote
Sadly, I can see both sides of this debate, but I absolutely despise the view that some women make the choice lightly.

Some women do though.  I'm thankful to have never had a BC failure, but I did have a scare in my early 20s right before getting my first IUD.  I was a week late, and made the decision to go for a test[1] and abort if needed. 

I didn't hesitate then, and I wouldn't hesitate now. It's not a difficult decision for me at all. Like Screwtape above, I won't argue that zygote/embryo is alive. I just don't consider it a person, because it isn't.  I won't give my body over to its use simply because it's life, even if it is human.

Even with those whose personhood is indisputable, e.g. adults, their rights end where my rights begin. My rights to my own bodily autonomy trump their rights to the use of my body, even if it meant they would otherwise die. No other living thing has rights to so little as a single drop of my blood if I don't freely give it.  Yet people argue than a microscopic bit of genetic material has the right to house itself in my body, cause me discomfort and pain, permanently change my body, and potentially kill me.
 1. OTC test had come back negative, but I didn't want to rely on that.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 12:26:12 PM by Wasserbuffel »