Author Topic: Question to theists  (Read 6450 times)

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Offline Lectus

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Question to theists
« on: June 16, 2013, 07:53:40 AM »
If God asked you to sacrifice/kill your son to prove your love for Him. Would you do it?
Religion: The belief that an all powerful God or gods created the entire universe so that we tiny humans can be happy. And we also make war about it.

Online One Above All

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2013, 08:04:42 AM »
BM.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Jontom10

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2013, 08:08:43 AM »
Cue all theists "oooh no god wouldn't ask that of us these days" "He'd probably just need an extra 50 quid or so"
Hasa Diga Eebowai

Offline nebula

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2013, 05:25:14 PM »
If God asked you to sacrifice/kill your son to prove your love for Him. Would you do it?

This question is based on a false premise so it has no answer.   It assumes there is an individual with the ability to make choices but there is not.   There is only that which existed in the singularity prior to the big bang in a more complex and spread out form.   

Online One Above All

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2013, 05:28:57 PM »
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline jetson

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2013, 05:33:37 PM »
This is an interesting question, and one that has me perplexed on certain attitudes.  In person, not on the internet, I have asked this very question to some Christian friends.  When pushed, two of them admitted that they would follow YHWH's orders to kill their own children.  Although, they vehemently defended the position that YHWH would NEVER ask such a thing.

They also admitted that there have been plenty of examples where people have indeed claimed that YHWH asked them to kill their own children, and they followed through.  Of course, everyone immediately considers these people to be sick, or in some way possessed by Satan, or something.  YHWH would NEVER ask such a thing - even though he has, according to scripture.

I asked these people, who admitted that they would follow YHWH's orders, what they believe would happen if they actually followed through, and they each admitted that they would be arrested, and that the defense of "God told me to kill my child" would likely not work, and most sane people would consider them a horrific parent, at best.

Now, when I confront the very important issue of how "crazy" one would appear if they did such a thing, there is complete silence.  Yes, YHWH asked Abraham to kill his son, but he would NEVER ask a modern Christian to do such a thing, even though, according to some murderers today, he did exactly that.

Bottom line - when something like this happens, there is no God.  Simple.

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2013, 05:34:37 PM »
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline nebula

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2013, 05:38:50 PM »
<snip>

Ever heard of a strawman?

I wasn't making a strawman.   I was stating my own view.   Self consciousness is an illusion.   

Online One Above All

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2013, 05:40:35 PM »
I wasn't making a strawman.   I was stating my own view.   Self consciousness is an illusion.   

My apologies then. I'd refute your view, but, right now, I feel inspired, so I must work on one of my stories.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Online LoriPinkAngel

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2013, 06:39:40 PM »
No.  I would not believe I was hearing from god.  I would seek medical attention.
It doesn't make sense to let go of something you've had for so long.  But it also doesn't make sense to hold on when there's actually nothing there.

Offline The Gawd

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2013, 09:14:12 PM »
No.  I would not believe I was hearing from god.  I would seek medical attention.
I ask you this because I respect your general honesty and willingness to answer questions even though the answers at times dont conform to your theology.

Do you feel that Abraham was sick and in need of medical attention (had it been available) when he was willing to murder his son at Yahweh's request? Do you believe that Yahweh was the voice telling him to kill his son?

Online LoriPinkAngel

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2013, 09:33:43 PM »
No.  I would not believe I was hearing from god.  I would seek medical attention.
I ask you this because I respect your general honesty and willingness to answer questions even though the answers at times dont conform to your theology.

Do you feel that Abraham was sick and in need of medical attention (had it been available) when he was willing to murder his son at Yahweh's request? Do you believe that Yahweh was the voice telling him to kill his son?

I honestly don't know.  Sometimes I think god was an asshole to ask that of him.  Sometimes I think some man/group of men made that story up and handed it down as a way to demonstrate/demand obedience.
It doesn't make sense to let go of something you've had for so long.  But it also doesn't make sense to hold on when there's actually nothing there.

Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2013, 09:41:18 PM »
If God asked you to sacrifice/kill your son to prove your love for Him. Would you do it?

The entity who is asking me to kill my son would have to first prove he is God, and would have to explain why I would have to slay my child.  For example... this being would have to show me the future and show me what will happen if my son is not killed. If this being does prove it, and if this being show's me a proper reason for why my son would have to die.. then so be it.   I cannot kill unless my life or other lives are threatened, so this being would have to be very convincing.

It certainly would have to be more than a big booming voice telling me to do it.   IF that were to occour, I would head to mental health services and tell them what is happening to me.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2013, 09:46:02 PM by WakingDeath »

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2013, 09:45:56 PM »
So God has to prove to you as being god? Funny. How about you just say "yes" then spin your bullshit reason? There's a thought.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2013, 09:47:33 PM »
So God has to prove to you as being god? Funny. How about you just say "yes" then spin your bullshit reason? There's a thought.

-Nam

I would be stupid to just say yes. I have edited my previous post and made an addition while you were replying .  You may want to read it again. 

Online LoriPinkAngel

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #15 on: June 16, 2013, 09:54:30 PM »
If God asked you to sacrifice/kill your son to prove your love for Him. Would you do it?

The entity who is asking me to kill my son would have to first prove he is God, and would have to explain why I would have to slay my child.  For example... this being would have to show me the future and show me what will happen if my son is not killed.

There should definitely be a better reason than proving my love for him.  How fricken insecure is he?  Sorry, my doubts are showing...
It doesn't make sense to let go of something you've had for so long.  But it also doesn't make sense to hold on when there's actually nothing there.

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #16 on: June 16, 2013, 09:55:14 PM »
Um, no. I prefer reading what people actually mean: not the edited version.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #17 on: June 16, 2013, 09:57:06 PM »
Um, no. I prefer reading what people actually mean: not the edited version.

-Nam

I merely forgot to put that part in. It IS what I really meant. Your asumption about that was false man.

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #18 on: June 16, 2013, 10:00:05 PM »
How can there be an assumption on my part if that was the initial conclusion?

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Online ParkingPlaces

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #19 on: June 16, 2013, 10:00:53 PM »
If a god does exist and he showed up in front of me with unassailable proof that he is real, and he asked me to kill my son, I'd tell him he may be all powerful but he doesn't have the ability to lay a guilt trip on me. I'd tell him to f**k off so fast I wouldn't have time to include the asterisks. Sure, they might be my last two words, but at least I'd die satisfied that I wasn't a tool for a power-hungry despot.

The why's of his request would be irrelevant. The most he could come up with would be a litany of excuses, and I've learned from a couple of women in my life not to pay attention to any of those.

If I instead decided to do his dirty work for him and then earned a  trip to heaven, it would suck if I had to spend an eternity with the dude that had me to off my kid.

Game playing is something humans do, so they tossed stories like that into the bible in an effort to impress underlings with the supposed power of their "god". Bribery and threats don't work on me that easily. Even the real, human ones.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #20 on: June 16, 2013, 10:20:34 PM »
How can there be an assumption on my part if that was the initial conclusion?

-Nam

Nam... it is what I actually meant. Even if I had to edit it. If I did not do that, then what I actually meant to communicate would not have been successful.  That last part of my post was a very important part that was omitted by accident.   Your conclusion was indeed a false assumption. You assumed that since I edited my post, I must have posted something insincere.  That assumption was indeed false.

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #21 on: June 16, 2013, 10:26:00 PM »
But not what you actually said.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline neopagan

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #22 on: June 16, 2013, 10:37:18 PM »
My answer would be a resounding NO. I don't care if Yahweh broke out his big booming voice, a lightning bolt in the shape of Liberace's candelabra, or a burning Bush.

 I think ol Abe should have havetold hi  go  to f-off and gone back home to his wife and the slave he was sexually assaulting. What a loser...
If xian hell really exists, the stench of the burning billions of us should be a constant, putrid reminder to the handful of heavenward xians how loving your god is.  - neopagan

Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #23 on: June 16, 2013, 10:41:18 PM »
But not what you actually said.

-Nam


Damn your frustrating.  It IS what I meant to include in what I said.  Jeeze... >:(

Offline jetson

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #24 on: June 16, 2013, 10:49:14 PM »
But not what you actually said.

-Nam


Damn your frustrating.  It IS what I meant to include in what I said.  Jeeze... >:(

Don't let it bug you... ;D

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #25 on: June 16, 2013, 10:50:53 PM »
How do I know you're telling the truth? You added it after-the-fact. All we have here are our words. Whether someone believes it or not is up to the person saying what they mean when they state it. If it were an adage, that's one thing. "I would like to add..." but that's not what you did; you edited it to sound less stupid (it still sounds stupid by the by).

Ex: I tell you I own the Bible. That I have read 15 versions of the Bible. How do you know that's true? How does anyone? Initially they don't until they get to know me, and even then there's no guarantee that they'd believe me.

Everyone has this dilemma on the web; or in person. Especially unknown people.

Get it yet?

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #26 on: June 16, 2013, 10:57:07 PM »
Quote
but that's not what you did; you edited it to sound less stupid (it still sounds stupid by the by).



That is another false assumption on your part Nam. As for the rest of what you said..that could be true of anybody.  No kidding.

Offline Nam

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #27 on: June 16, 2013, 11:06:32 PM »
It's not an assumption, it's an opinion. Stop using "assumption" to fit everything.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline WakingDeath

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Re: Question to theists
« Reply #28 on: June 16, 2013, 11:20:54 PM »
It's not an assumption, it's an opinion. Stop using "assumption" to fit everything.

-Nam

You assume I edited it to sound less stupid.  Your opinion IS a false assumption. I am not that stupid Nam.  Those little tricks do not work on me.