Author Topic: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...  (Read 17221 times)

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Offline RealityCheck

Because God does amazing things through people like this. :)

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Offline Nick

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #1 on: March 18, 2013, 09:56:31 PM »
F*ck that.  Give me my limbs back.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

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Offline The Gawd

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #2 on: March 18, 2013, 11:56:40 PM »
Why cant he do both? Why does he heal cancer?

*throws thread in the bushes*

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #3 on: March 19, 2013, 12:48:13 AM »
Why cant he do both? Why does he heal cancer?

*throws thread in the bushes*

God doesn't know about multitasking. He's stuck in the past.
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2013, 04:05:27 AM »
So god made sure he was born without limbs so that he could spread the word of god.....what a nice guy that god is.
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Tonus

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #5 on: March 19, 2013, 05:29:45 AM »
Imagine all of the amazing things he could've accomplished with two working arms and two working legs.  Seems kind of harsh to inflict him with such a horrible circumstance just to make sure he'd be a nice person.

Offline Bereft_of_Faith

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #6 on: March 19, 2013, 05:43:33 AM »
Imagine all of the amazing things he could've accomplished with two working arms and two working legs.  Seems kind of harsh to inflict him with such a horrible circumstance just to make sure he'd be a nice person.

Thaaaaaaat's God!

Offline screwtape

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #7 on: March 19, 2013, 07:25:42 AM »
I read the OP last night and thought "this guy SO does not get the point of wwgha or the argument behind it".  But I was too tired and lazy to bother getting into it.  I still am.  So, here's a link to where I did get into it
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,22197.msg496338.html#msg496338

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Offline RealityCheck

Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2013, 01:41:18 PM »
It's an illusion - you think you are the ones that can see - but unfortunately you have blind eyes.

Offline Seppuku

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2013, 01:43:46 PM »
Quote
Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...

What about people suffering from angina or CHD?
“It is difficult to understand the universe if you only study one planet” - Miyamoto Musashi
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Offline Dante

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2013, 02:35:50 PM »
It's an illusion - you think you are the ones that can see - but unfortunately you have blind eyes.

If you believe that to be true, then you also must believe that the reason our eyes see or don't see rests entirely with your god.
Actually it doesn't. One could conceivably be all-powerful but not exceptionally intelligent.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #11 on: March 20, 2013, 03:00:25 PM »
Because God does amazing things through people like this. :)

http://www.lifewithoutlimbs.org/knowing-god/
That is unforgivable. You know, don't you, that the guy in the video was born after his mother took thalidomide? Nothing to do with God, unless you believe that God led scientists to Thalidomide, when He knew what it would do, just so that he could make a cheerful cripple.

Of course, as an atheist, I hope you (and, for that matter, every other Christian) do believe that God made that man like that, because that is what the Bible says God does - He makes the lame.

But why does He make the lame and never bother curing them? Well the answer is in several Gospels, He makes cripples to make Himself look good; to show His power.

Great! So you suggest that God made that guy crippled? And now is glorying in people like you who post such unmitigated, delusional garbage?

"Ooo, look everyone God cursed him and he's still a cripple but he loves Jesus! That proves there's a god!"

If I came round and chopped of your limbs, would you be happy? No. You'd wail. To all intents and purposes, your life would have ended. You, like the guy in the picture would have to rely on people to place you on the toilet and wipe your arse, feed you, clothes you. Do everything for you.

I had a friend who was damaged by Thalidomide - like the rest of them, he wasn't happy. Yes, he did well... for a while. But when his parents died and his wife left him, he died slowly. So you think God did that?

Great god, eh? Make you proud to be a Christian? You love god even more because he kills people slowly, whilst making them endure a life without limbs?

You have picked one guy out amongst thousands - what of the rest? Do you think they would like your god to give them real limbs? He will not - why? Because He's not there - the only place he exists is in your mind.

The fact that you should post that video, and claim your god did it, and that it is GOOD, to me indicates that you are totally deluded.

If I said, "I hope each one of your children become severely disabled" would you think that was a blessing?

« Last Edit: March 20, 2013, 03:08:46 PM by Graybeard »
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #12 on: March 20, 2013, 03:20:50 PM »
It's an illusion - you think you are the ones that can see - but unfortunately you have blind eyes.

Why do people with blind hearts always know more things and not sound like infants or complete idiots?
You believe evolution and there is no evidence for that. Where is the fossil record of a half man half ape. I've only ever heard about it in reading.

Offline screwtape

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #13 on: March 20, 2013, 04:14:38 PM »
It's an illusion - you think you are the ones that can see - but unfortunately you have blind eyes.

whom are you addressing?
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Offline RealityCheck

Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #14 on: March 20, 2013, 07:33:51 PM »
Think about it in 3rd person - I think ultimately (if) there is only one God (which I am convinced that there is), and he made the entire universe, I think that the only option left is for the people who He made to trust Him and in His greater purpose. What say do they have? Remember (if) my God is real (which I believe He is), he made both pleasure and pain. Why? Why didn't he just make pain?

Risk/reward - I have absolutely nothing to lose.

If this is all that you have ever, for all eternity - this existence - what are you doing in this forum? Don't you want to spend your last breaths enjoying everything you can in this life as there won't be anything after?

I, of course, don't think this way and I think that anyone who takes a leap of faith in this miraculous guy named Jesus will live forever in His kingdom.

But your risk/reward is far greater than my risk/reward. No matter what I happens after I die, I win! If I am right, I win. If I am wrong, who cares?
« Last Edit: March 20, 2013, 07:36:54 PM by RealityCheck »

Offline The Gawd

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2013, 07:55:38 PM »
Think about it in 3rd person - I think ultimately (if) there is only one God (which I am convinced that there is), and he made the entire universe, I think that the only option left is for the people who He made to trust Him and in His greater purpose. What say do they have? Remember (if) my God is real (which I believe He is), he made both pleasure and pain. Why? Why didn't he just make pain?

Risk/reward - I have absolutely nothing to lose.

If this is all that you have ever, for all eternity - this existence - what are you doing in this forum? Don't you want to spend your last breaths enjoying everything you can in this life as there won't be anything after?

I, of course, don't think this way and I think that anyone who takes a leap of faith in this miraculous guy named Jesus will live forever in His kingdom.

But your risk/reward is far greater than my risk/reward. No matter what I happens after I die, I win! If I am right, I win. If I am wrong, who cares?

You should read about Pascal's Wager, its probably, literally the worst argument you could ever use, and its your go-to move. Did you ever stop to think...."What if the Hindu's are right?" Where does that leave your risk/reward?

Offline RealityCheck

Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2013, 10:18:57 PM »
Better than yours!

Offline RealityCheck

Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2013, 10:20:19 PM »
By the way, I've known about Pascal's Wager forever. I just didn't reference it as that. And I agree its a shallow argument but it sometimes helps people that can not think beyond the realms of logic and reason or physical rules and laws.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2013, 10:26:21 PM by RealityCheck »

Offline RealityCheck

Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2013, 10:24:27 PM »
How about Schrodinger's Cat?

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2013, 11:04:24 PM »
Think about it in 3rd person - I think ultimately (if) there is only one God (which I am convinced that there is), and he made the entire universe, I think that the only option left is for the people who He made to trust Him and in His greater purpose. What say do they have? Remember (if) my God is real (which I believe He is), he made both pleasure and pain. Why? Why didn't he just make pain?

Risk/reward - I have absolutely nothing to lose.

If this is all that you have ever, for all eternity - this existence - what are you doing in this forum? Don't you want to spend your last breaths enjoying everything you can in this life as there won't be anything after?

I, of course, don't think this way and I think that anyone who takes a leap of faith in this miraculous guy named Jesus will live forever in His kingdom.

But your risk/reward is far greater than my risk/reward. No matter what I happens after I die, I win! If I am right, I win. If I am wrong, who cares?

RC

You have one way of looking at the world. We atheists have another. Obviously we can't both be right. Just as obviously, we could both be wrong. Perhaps we were created by an overzealous 4th grader in another universe playing with his chemistry set.

If god is not real, we still have pleasure and pain. Were we all in constant pain, we would have labels like "good pain" and "bad pain". Were we all suffering constant pleasure, we would break that down into types as well. Luckily our interaction with our nervous system allows us to experience both. And yes, philosophical stances have arisen based on those extremes. If, as we atheists think, we merely evolved and our ability to experience both is a result of genetics, then any implication that a god is involved adds unnecessary baggage and little else.

I can't speak for the others, but I spend time on forums like this for two reasons: One, religion all too often causes the aforementioned pain via ignorance, oppression, lies and just plain ickyness. Not all religions or all religious folks fall into this category, but enough do to cause people to be harmed by the bad in religion. I am speaking out against that.

Secondly, I'm not so hung up on time as to worry about ever second I have. What fun would voluntarily adding those stressors be to me. I spend some of my time being productive, other time enjoying my life. I don't think of myself as being on a timetable.

Ditto living forever. Why in the heck would anyone want to do that. What is the appeal? Life is far more interesting when one knows that it is limited. As an infinite condition, it becomes worthless. There is too much of it.

And the whole Jesus thing is so contrived. An infinite and omnipotent being whips out perfection and then gets mad at it when it isn't perfect. Knows he's failed and yet doesn't start over, but rather drowns all but a few and hopes that things will go better, even though he knows they won't because gods know stuff like that. So a bit further down the road he inserts his kid into the one pure human on planet and out comes a savior, who conveniently disappears for a long time then shows up for a few years to save the world. Does so in a conveniently negative environment (what with the roman rulers and all) and gets himself pegged to sticks, theoretically having a few bad days until the elevator arrives. But then anyone who believes the story gets saved, while the rest of us get to burn forever because your god loves us that much.

Note that the Jesus story was told to only one small group. He didn't have brothers running all over the planet trying to save the various cultural groups that existed at the time. Like all god stories, yours was conveniently localized. It is no way different from any of the other stories made up long, long ago.

I'm sure you can type out a screed designed to dash my POV on the rocks, just like I have just tried to do to yours. I am pretty much convinced that the human propensity to be religious or non-religious is genetic, a trait as minor as blue vs. brown eyes but harder to see. That could mean that there is a god and I am incapable of believing in him. Or that there isn't one, and you are incapable on not believing.

Of course, the question there is this: If there is a god, why would he let genes decide who believed and who didn't? If there isn't a god, it is just the side-effect of some necessary genetic mix-and-match. I tend to think that it is more likely that there is no god involved rather than an incompetent one who forgot to make me capable of loving him.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline Tinyal

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #20 on: March 20, 2013, 11:54:04 PM »
By the way, I've known about Pascal's Wager forever. I just didn't reference it as that. And I agree its a shallow argument but it sometimes helps people that can not think beyond the realms of logic and reason or physical rules and laws.

Well, isn't that special!!!

I could say it's because thinking beyond the realms of logic and reason is typically called a fantasy, and that such fantasizing - while great for writing fiction - produces nothing else of any use whatsoever.

I could say all those things, if I had the slightest inkling the person I was talking to was capable of grasping whatever small portion of reality they still have access to.

I have no such inkling - so I won't.

Happy close-to-spring day!
Don't kangaroos skip along the surface of the water?

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2013, 03:30:51 AM »
But your risk/reward is far greater than my risk/reward. No matter what I happens after I die, I win! If I am right, I win. If I am wrong, who cares?

Did you ever stop to think...."What if the Hindu's are right?" Where does that leave your risk/reward?

Better than yours!

Really?  And how do you figure that? 

What if the One True God values atheists more than those who follow a false religion?
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Tonus

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2013, 04:30:29 AM »
By the way, I've known about Pascal's Wager forever. I just didn't reference it as that. And I agree its a shallow argument but it sometimes helps people that can not think beyond the realms of logic and reason or physical rules and laws.
I agree with you, that Pascal's Wager is a shallow argument that is best used once you have left logic, reason, and reality behind.

What do I have to lose by rejecting Jesus?  I lose the opportunity to limit myself for absolutely no reward, since Jesus doesn't exist.  I lose the opportunity to artificially restrict myself and waste time on pursuits that will gain me nothing.  I lose the chance to strengthen the very worst kind of tribalism (religion) that mankind has devised.  I lose the fear of angering a capricious, vindictive, nasty, belligerent, and utterly unreasonable deity who could not possibly exist outside of the addled imagination of ancient man.

The people who fall back on Pascal's Wager rarely, if ever, encourage people to simply roll the dice and select any religion at all.  They are specifically promoting their own religion, and they don't see it as a shot in the dark.  So they are being disingenuous when they use that argument.  If I'm going to use someone else's argument, I prefer that of Stephen Roberts: "I contend we are both atheists, I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

Offline pianodwarf

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2013, 06:47:38 AM »
If this is all that you have ever, for all eternity - this existence - what are you doing in this forum? Don't you want to spend your last breaths enjoying everything you can in this life as there won't be anything after?

Among other things, I'm trying to make the world a better place.  Granted, I won't be here to see it, but I want to be able to take some satisfaction in knowing that I made at least some small contribution toward the betterment of mankind.  The main way (not the only one) in which I strive for this is to eliminate religion because I regard religion as the primary source of most of the world's ills.

Quote
But your risk/reward is far greater than my risk/reward. No matter what I happens after I die, I win! If I am right, I win. If I am wrong, who cares?

I was going to point out that you're using Pascal's Wager here, but I see that others have already taken care of it for you.  If you, yourself, acknowledge that it's such a terrible argument, why are you using it?

I could just as easily turn it around and challenge you with Pianodwarf's Wager: "If god exists but finds favor in honest atheism over faked theism -- or any other kind of theism, for that matter -- then I'm the one who's going to be saved, and you're the one who's screwed."

George Smith takes another angle on it, calling it the Atheist's Wager.  Live your life as an atheist.  If god does not exist, it won't make any difference; if god exists, but is just, you have nothing to fear; and if god exists but is unjust, you have much to fear, but so does the Christian.
[On how kangaroos could have gotten back to Australia after the flood]:  Don't kangaroos skip along the surface of the water? --Kenn

Offline screwtape

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2013, 07:07:38 AM »
I think that anyone who takes a leap of faith in this miraculous guy named Jesus will live forever in His kingdom.

Don't you feel the least bit self conscious saying such a childish thing publicly?  I'd be mortified.
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2013, 08:03:33 AM »
George Smith takes another angle on it, calling it the Atheist's Wager.  Live your life as an atheist.  If god does not exist, it won't make any difference; if god exists, but is just, you have nothing to fear; and if god exists but is unjust, you have much to fear, but so does the Christian.

It's a quote from Marcus Aurelius:

"Live a good life.
If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by.
If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.
I am not afraid."
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline lotanddaughters

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2013, 08:11:32 AM »
Some usernames go a long way. The name of the OP is "RealityCheck". This fact has made my reading of this thread more enjoyable than if this person went by another name, chances are.


Maybe it's supposed to be taken kinda like "Coat Check", where you check your reality at the door!  ;D

Offline Bluecolour

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2013, 08:43:14 AM »
I originally thought that the OP was an attempt at sarcasm. The truth is very distressing.

I didn't want to be accused of hijacking this thread so I started my own.

Offline Azdgari

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Re: Why wont God Heal Amputees? Because He wants to heal their hearts...
« Reply #28 on: March 21, 2013, 09:43:46 AM »
I originally thought that the OP was an attempt at sarcasm. ...

Me too, given the smiley.
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