Author Topic: A question [#2716]  (Read 585 times)

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Offline pianodwarf

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A question [#2716]
« on: January 16, 2013, 07:09:35 AM »
I will begin by saying I do not deny that which is written on the website. I sending this question to be able to further support my arguments.

Now in several parts here it is mentioned that there have been cases of certain cancerous tumors removing themselves (through the effect of one's own immune system). For reference I am referencing the page of why it is important to ask about why god does not heal amputees.

So now I know there are cases in which people claim it miraculous. However do you have any scientific articles which describe it as possible for the immune system to do this?

Thank you for your time and for your website.



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Offline Nick

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2013, 07:36:20 AM »
An answer,
  I guess it is possible because it happens.  Like the brain...there is a lot we don't know about the body and its ability to heal itself.  But like everything else we don't understand...it is a big leap or laziness to just say "God did it".
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline Dante

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2013, 07:41:25 AM »
Google is your friend.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_remission

Yeah, it's wiki, but it does cite sources, and a quick Google search shows about 3.4 million hits. Easy peezy.

edit to add: To be fair, Google shows 3.4 million hits for "natural regression of amputees" too.

http://www.google.com/search?q=natural+regression+of+amputees&hl=en&safe=strict&tbo=d&noj=1&ei=S6b2UPKVCo_49gSK4IHwCA&start=10&sa=N&biw=792&bih=422
« Last Edit: January 16, 2013, 08:12:21 AM by Dante »
Actually it doesn't. One could conceivably be all-powerful but not exceptionally intelligent.

Offline plethora

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2013, 06:44:16 AM »
Fact is, we don't know exactly what the causes are of spontaneous remission in cancer patients. Science is being applied to try and figure it out as understanding how this happens may lead to a cure.

Of course, like so many things we don't know, many people are quick to explain away the unknown with miracles, magic, superstition and other supernatural forces. This is something humanity has done since the dawn of its existence.

People have attributed rain, thunder, volcano eruptions, earthquakes, tsunamis, etc, to supernatural forces ... and somehow continue to do so despite science having explained these natural phenomena.

The problem with explaining things away as miracles is that it doesn't actually answer any questions and isn't in any way useful to us. We can't reliably invoke miracles in order to cure cancer patients. The miracle doesn't explain how the cancer is removed. Basically, it's a useless non-explanation that cannot be tested or proven.
The truth doesn't give a shit about our feelings.

Offline Irish

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2013, 07:00:09 PM »
I didn't search for any direct articles.  However it's easily conceivable to give a mechanism for remission of cancer.  There are cells of the immune system that have the job of locating and killing cells that become cancerous or infected with viruses.  These are the cytotoxic T cells and the natural killer cells (Tc cells and NK cells, respectively).
La scienze non ha nemici ma gli ignoranti.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2013, 12:18:37 PM »
So now I know there are cases in which people claim it miraculous. However do you have any scientific articles which describe it as possible for the immune system to do this?
That has already been answered but I am interested in why anyone might think that it was the Christian god and not some other god who had a hand in spontaneous remission - can you help me here?

There are cases of spontaneous remission in India, Russia, animist Africa, etc. neither Christians nor atheists, Jews nor Hindus, Shintoists or Buddhists seem to be singled out; it doesn't even matter if you have been good, bad or indifferent.

Do you know that there are people who are apparently immune to AIDS; what's God's message here?
RELIGION, n. A daughter of Hope and Fear, explaining to Ignorance the nature of the Unknowable. Ambrose Bierce

Offline Nam

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Re: A question [#2716]
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2013, 10:10:55 PM »
So, whatis this? God must exist because some people with Cancer get spontaneous remissions? Is that what I am reading in the OP (as an implication)?

What about the plethora of other diseases that don't go into remission? Hell, my mother has a disease (I have it too just not to the extent she does) that makes her constantly faint, and have epiliptic seizures. She's been a Christian her entire life, and prays to Biblegod 2+ times a day for it to take the pain and disease away, and what happens? Nothing. Why would Cancer people be special but my mother isn't? Either. It doesn't care about everyone, or it doesn't exist. I am going with the latter.

-Nam