Author Topic: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?  (Read 7482 times)

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Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #174 on: January 23, 2015, 04:54:23 PM »
Also, look at it from another perspective. It is a lot easier to believe there is a grand Designer who orchastrated the order of every single particle in the universe to work perfectly than it is to believe a giant explosion did. Is it easier to believe a bomb suddenly made its own gunpowder and lit its own fuse, exploded, and then made the Mona Lisa? Or is it easier to believe that Leonardo da Vinci carefully chose every color and perfectly made every stroke to create his masterpiece?
You have no idea just how many people have tried to make this argument despite not understanding how badly it fails.

The Big Bang was not an explosion, like setting off a bomb.  It was an expansion, like blowing up a balloon.  Furthermore, the energy in the early universe (which, as far as we know, was already present when the Big Bang happened) was extremely hot.  Billions upon billions upon billions of degrees of hot.  Now, it's long been known that when something that's extremely hot expands suddenly, it cools.  This is how air conditioners and refrigerators work.  And when things cool, they start to form organized structures.  For example, steam is extremely disordered, liquid water is somewhat disordered, and ice is highly ordered.  The same basic process operates for pretty much all matter.  Well, when energy cools, it essentially starts to condense into what we think of as matter.

That's the very quick and dirty way to explain how ordered matter could have come out of the superhot, disordered energy that was all there was when the Big Bang happened.  You don't need a grand Designer (which begs the question of where he came from in the first place) in order to explain how order could come out of chaos.  It doesn't matter whether it's 'easier' to believe or not.  It's easier to believe that the sun goes around the earth, because of the way it looks to us standing here on Earth, but that isn't the correct explanation, is it?
A guide to the many flaws in BibleStudent's understanding of evolutionary theory - http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,28728.0.html

Offline Nick

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #175 on: January 23, 2015, 04:56:51 PM »
GND15, lots of people use religion as a security blanket.  If that helps you then you should do it.  I still don't know what you hoped to achieve by coming here.  Most of us have been religious at one time.  Some for most of our lives.  We broke away or grew out of it.  Now it is impossible to go back after shedding the delusion.  We believe in rational thought and being responsible for ourselves.  We see this life as our only one and work to make it the best we can.  We don't need a Sky Daddy or adult imaginary friend.  If that is too hard for you to understand then that is life.  But we wish you no ill will.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #176 on: January 23, 2015, 07:14:50 PM »

And ParkingPlaces,
I highly doubt you would ACTUALLY trade places with me. I wouldn't want you to have to go through this! I would die for you though. I would die for you if it meant you would believe in God. That's the difference between me and Jesus. I wouldn't die for you if it meant you still weren't going to heaven. It wouldn't be worth it. Jesus died for you knowing you may choose to believe in Him or you may not. THAT is love.

If the technology existed and I had the option, I'd do it for someone like yourself. And yes, even you. I've lived my life and it hurts to see someone so young dealing with something so severe.

Of course, since it isn't a option, you'll never know for sure that I am sincere. And of course, since it isn't an option, I probably don't know for sure, either. But my first instinct is that I would.

I'm no hero, but I'm pretty nice.

Anyone can beat around the bush. But unless you have permission from the bush, you probably shouldn't.

Offline Graybeard

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #177 on: January 23, 2015, 07:57:07 PM »
[a history of real and continuing misfortune snipped - my sympathy goes out to you.]
I apologize for this autobiography! It was the only way I could effectively answer your question.
When people lose control over their lives and there is no clear way out, in desperation, and to clutch at straws, they will invoke a magic being to solve their problems.

The Hindu. the Buddhist, the Jain and the tribal animist all do this. They all have one thing in common, they are asking their god, "O Great god, use your magic! On this occasion, do not make two and two equal four!"
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline Astreja

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #178 on: January 24, 2015, 02:08:03 AM »
I've started to poke around in medical journals, GND15, and I have a nagging feeling that your medical condition isn't entirely neurological.  Because of the stress caused by the headaches, it could be that along the way you've acquired at least one chronic pain syndrome overlapping with the original problem -- Possibly more than one.

My initial suspects (and bear in mind here that I am not a doctor) include fibromyalgia and similar pain amplification syndromes, myofascial pain syndrome, irritable bowel syndrome, and/or an autoimmune condition such as systemic lupus erythematosus.  If you haven't seen a rheumatologist in the past, maybe explore that option with your family doctor.

For the headaches, I've heard promising things about Botox injections to the scalp.  If you take daily analgesics for the pain, be aware that there's a condition called medication overuse headache that might be making things worse.

In general, though, make sure your nutrition is rock-solid (get vitamin and mineral levels checked if you're not sure), get lots of sleep, and do light aerobics like walking and swimming.
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Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #179 on: January 24, 2015, 03:42:12 AM »
Not that you all care, but I am shedding many tears right now. You don't know how difficult it is for strangers to tell me I may never get better. You all don't know what God can do. Sure, I would love to go to heaven. My purpose here is not finished yet. I am so sad not because I was just reminded multiple times that I am dying and may never get better. .....I want to know why. I had no idea there were people out there who would want to purposefully hurt my feelings, discourage my fight to stay alive, and break my heart. Most nonbelievers I meet, even atheists, have been so kind to me. I thought they were great people. Some of you are starting to shift my opinion of the atheist community.

Sorry, but the emotional blackmail doesn't work. 

You came here and YOU used YOUR suffering as an argument for your god, and how wonderful and loving you claim he is.  You put it on the table as a major pillar of your faith, so quit being surprised that THAT is what we are discussing and debating. 

You can't say "THIS is why I believe", and then get all upset when we challenge it.

Contrary to what you would love to believe, not one of us here wants you to be in pain.  We would all love it for you to be well - it's why those with ability like Astreja are offering advice.

And part of why we challenge is your frankly shitty, patronising, and self-aggrandising response to ParkingPlaces, where you said that HE was lying when he would trade places with you....but that of course YOU would die for HIM, no problem.  Can you see what a smug little prig that makes you look?  How insulting it was to him?

And frankly, go right ahead and pray for me and my family, and our health.  Your prayers have done fuck-all for your health, so clearly they will have zero effect on me.  But if that's how you want to throw away your time, go ahead.

- - -

I have been a LOT harsher with you than is my normal style.  But you came here, using your terrible life as a weapon to fight for your god, then jump straight to emotional blackmail when we turn your weapon against you.  So in part I am annoyed at your duplicitous tactics.  I'm annoyed at the way you casually dismissed PPs offer, then made it clear you think that ONLY Christians are really nice enough to make such offers.  But the most anger I feel is against the people who have brainwashed you into the view that - as you clearly showed there - that atheists aren't properly human, aren't worthy of your respect.  You'll pray for us, you say, whether we want it or not - I guess that makes it abundantly clear how much real respect you have for us, or how much you really want to learn.

So yeah, I've been harsh in this post.  But you gave me damn good cause.
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Nam

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #180 on: January 24, 2015, 06:30:46 AM »
As I said: she's a whiner.

-Nam
Quote from: David Garrett Arnold
there are oceans of words aged in prayer,
against geometric lines, and cloudbeaten skies;
credulous allure—slowly captivated in hearts fair—
trees and flowers bloomed in grace upon one's eyes.

Offline Nam

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #181 on: January 24, 2015, 07:25:32 AM »

And ParkingPlaces,
I highly doubt you would ACTUALLY trade places with me. I wouldn't want you to have to go through this! I would die for you though. I would die for you if it meant you would believe in God. That's the difference between me and Jesus. I wouldn't die for you if it meant you still weren't going to heaven. It wouldn't be worth it. Jesus died for you knowing you may choose to believe in Him or you may not. THAT is love.




-Nam
Quote from: David Garrett Arnold
there are oceans of words aged in prayer,
against geometric lines, and cloudbeaten skies;
credulous allure—slowly captivated in hearts fair—
trees and flowers bloomed in grace upon one's eyes.

Offline HAL

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #182 on: January 24, 2015, 08:19:06 AM »
It is up to God as to whether that bandage stops the bleeding and if my blood clots.

So the great god of the universe manages your personal Band-Aids, yet leaves tens of thousands of poor starving people to suffer around the world? Do I have that about right GND15? I'm impressed that your bandages can be so important to the almighty when at the same time suffering people all over the world get no help from this deity and are left to die in the mud.

Quote
I know that probably sounds stupid, pointless, sad, barbaric, etc.

It sure does. The question is - why would you allow yourself to believe such illogical nonsense?


Quote
That is just what I believe.

Someday you should contrast your holy band-aid attention, and what you said above (sounds stupid, pointless, sad, barbaric, etc), with your belief, and ask yourself if it makes any sense whatsoever.

Yea, right, see ya later ...
Seriously, you guys are the meanest people I have ever met.  I hope you are happy and feel really good about yourself. 

Offline DVZ3

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #183 on: January 24, 2015, 08:51:32 AM »

GND15, very sorry about you situation and your condition. I wish you the best.

My colleague I sit next to at work, who is Indian, father recently passed and his mother just had stroke which has left her in very poor condition, in need of care and future very uncertain; this just after the birth do his first healthy baby girl. Anyways, he's not religious in the sense of quoting biblical scriptures like xsians do here, but he keeps a small statue of one of the Indian gods, Ganesh, the remover of obstacles on his desk near the picture of him and his family. He does this out of tradition and it's symbolic meaning.

Anyways, I too wish your life's challenging obstacle to be removed.
Hguols: "Its easier for me to believe that a God created everything...."

Offline DVZ3

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #184 on: January 24, 2015, 09:25:17 AM »
Quote
Wouldn't I have to be a senior about to graduate?

Um, no. I have an online friend who went to MIT at 14. Just asking such a stupid question shows how idiotic you sound and egotistical.


Do you also believe your online friend went to MIT? Also, you said "went" as in past tense so now they've moved on and/or graduated I'm assuming. The company I work for like to hire in-turns from there due to there technology prowess, forefront research and cutting edge technologies that companies like mine and future start-ups will thrive on.

We also have the best brightest minds in the medical field from Harvard and others who do the same only to inspire and promote innovation in fields of research and technology that not only you, but all of mankind will benefit from.  Any chance you can share what this friend went on to do having gone there at such a young age; sounds like he's ahead of the class to be sure.
Hguols: "Its easier for me to believe that a God created everything...."

Offline DVZ3

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #185 on: January 24, 2015, 09:39:27 AM »
Also, look at it from another perspective. It is a lot easier to believe there is a grand Designer who orchastrated the order of every single particle in the universe to work perfectly than it is to believe a giant explosion did. Is it easier to believe a bomb suddenly made its own gunpowder and lit its own fuse, exploded, and then made the Mona Lisa? Or is it easier to believe that Leonardo da Vinci carefully chose every color and perfectly made every stroke to create his masterpiece?

GND15, please read. My sig from a former member who used to post here,  Hguols.

On a lighter note, just thought I would share that when I see and read your avatar name I read "Gandhi15"  ;)
Hguols: "Its easier for me to believe that a God created everything...."

Offline Nam

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #186 on: January 24, 2015, 09:59:25 AM »
Do you also believe your online friend went to MIT? Also, you said "went" as in past tense so now they've moved on and/or graduated I'm assuming. The company I work for like to hire in-turns from there due to there technology prowess, forefront research and cutting edge technologies that companies like mine and future start-ups will thrive on.

We also have the best brightest minds in the medical field from Harvard and others who do the same only to inspire and promote innovation in fields of research and technology that not only you, but all of mankind will benefit from.  Any chance you can share what this friend went on to do having gone there at such a young age; sounds like he's ahead of the class to be sure.

She's a Mathematician, and writes poetry. She lives in New York.

-Nam
Quote from: David Garrett Arnold
there are oceans of words aged in prayer,
against geometric lines, and cloudbeaten skies;
credulous allure—slowly captivated in hearts fair—
trees and flowers bloomed in grace upon one's eyes.

Offline DVZ3

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #187 on: January 24, 2015, 10:03:41 AM »
So she's greatly analytical and still let's the unknown/unsolved poetry of the universe create imaginary numbers.  ;)

https://www.khanacademy.org/math/precalculus/imaginary_complex_precalc/i_precalc/v/imaginary-roots-of-negative-numbers
« Last Edit: January 24, 2015, 10:05:44 AM by DVZ3 »
Hguols: "Its easier for me to believe that a God created everything...."

Offline The Gawd

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #188 on: January 24, 2015, 05:05:46 PM »
ehh this one got interesting...

One thing I do hate as well is when folks try to credit imaginary beings for the hard work of people. Honestly when I do stuff, I dont do it to get a thank you. I really dont care unless they start thanking magical beings. Brings me back to the story of my mom struggling to update her Macbook; and I told her to ask yahweh to explain it to her since he knows literally everything and they talk everyday.

Turns out the people at the Apple Store know more than yahweh.

Anyways, a teenager is going to be fresh in their indoctrination, so I am not shocked by our guest's answers. It'll take more than a day to chisel through all that rock hard nonsense. However, I think the seed has been planted. Hopefully she'll come back and have actual discussions. Perhaps she can get to a place like JB...

Offline Emily

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #189 on: January 24, 2015, 07:49:15 PM »
Hiya GND. Sorry to hear about everything you've been through. However, don't take it personally when people argue against the points that you've raised. We don't believe; you do. And, I cannot speak for other members here but personal testimony isn't really good enough to convince me there is a god, especially when a god has acted so shitty.

I have had the opportunity to tell my story to people who have had parents die at a young age, were raped, are suicidal, etc. Each one could relate to my story even though they have been through way more than me.

If God didn't exist, I would have no reason to keep enduring through this perpetual pain.

Well, for me I've had a pretty shitty life. My darkest day was when I decided to take a handful of sleeping pills and Black Velvet whiskey and tried to kill myself, simply because I didn't want to live in what I thought was shitty, drug and alcohol filled life. It kind of sucked, to be honest. I can say that in hindsight (now) I am glad I ended up puking almost everything up and ending up in the hospital, because now I have an amazing husband and a beautiful almost two year old daughter, and my daughter alone is enough to give me a purpose to wake up every day, because I went from a waste of a person into someone who is able to bring a beautiful girl into the world. The whole time I didn't once believe in a god.

Take the moment and make the best of it.

I am pretty sure, even though I cannot prove it, that everyone on this forum (atheists and theists) have been in very dark places and escaped that place. Whatever helps you cope is whatever helps you cope. You have the right to use it. We have the right to disagree with it and since you posted a testimony about a hard life on a public forum it's completely open for others to critique it, disagree with it, and examine it. That's just the nature of discussion.

All is not lost. Everything will be fine. You can ditch the belief in Jesus and discover that that same hope you think you feel because of him will still be there without him. But, whatever helps you cope is whatever you can use to cope.
"Great moments are born from great opportunities." Herb Brooks

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Offline junebug72

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #190 on: January 25, 2015, 12:05:29 PM »
Hope this day finds you doing well. :angel:

The thing to do, it seems to me, is to prepare yourself so you can be a rainbow in somebody else's cloud. Somebody who may not look like you. May not call God the same name you call God - if they call God at all. I may not dance your dances or speak your language. But be a blessing to somebody. That's what I think.
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« Last Edit: January 25, 2015, 12:20:00 PM by junebug72 »
when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change

Offline junebug72

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #191 on: January 25, 2015, 12:35:03 PM »
As I said: she's a whiner.

-Nam

I think you meant winner! 
when you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change

Offline Mrjason

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Re: Where is the Bible does God say He loves humanity?
« Reply #192 on: January 26, 2015, 05:31:08 AM »
Mrjason,

You all are telling me what you believe to be true and not why. I have told you what I believe to be true and was completely transparent in sharing my life story to explain why I believe it to be true.


You are mistaken, I haven't told you anything about what I believe.

You have shared your life story but haven't said why you concluded "god" because of it.