Author Topic: an observation [#667]  (Read 449 times)

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Offline DL

an observation [#667]
« on: November 12, 2008, 08:28:24 PM »
Hi.  In your short video, "Why won't God heal Amputees" you sound  pretty
darn sure of yourself.  But even if I agree with every last thing  that you said,
there is still a huge lingering question and conclusion.   The question is,
"How did the universe (and we) come to exist?"  There are  indisputably only
two possible answers to this question:

1. By pure happenstance.

2. Some intelligence created it.

Period.  End of story.  Each person has to make a choice.   For me, choice
number 2 is much more sensible.  But this is the essence of  the debate, isn't
it?  If you choose choice 1, you have just as much of a  burden as making
choice 2.....and you don't know any better than anyone  else....it's ALL a
conscious choice between these two.  And (this is the  kicker) by making choice 2, if
you are right, you get everlasting life, if you  are wrong, you'll never know
it!  However, choice 1 is a  losing proposition either way.  So don't be so
sure of yourself!

[name]

Offline GotMooo

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2008, 12:05:41 AM »
Quote
And (this is the  kicker) by making choice 2, if
you are right, you get everlasting life, if you  are wrong, you'll never know
it!

This argument is called Pascal's Wager.  And it sounds like you are more interested in what's in it for you than anything else.  If you are a Christian, I'm sure your master isn't happy with you being more interested in living for eternity in paradise than in him.  I'm sure El Elyon isn't happy with people not putting him first.

If you are interested in talking more, you should register and come chat in this thread.

Offline Dkit

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2008, 10:05:13 AM »
Quote
2. Some intelligence created it.

For me, choice number 2 is much more sensible.

Where did the intelligent creator come from?
"The Bible is a Banquet table not a snack tray!" - Anonymous Facebook User

Offline Cycle4Fun

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2008, 02:51:12 PM »
Quote
2. Some intelligence created it.

For me, choice number 2 is much more sensible.

Where did the intelligent creator come from?

The creator always existed of course.  You see, the premise that everything is created by a being applies to everything but the creator.  I don't care that this invalidates the first premise of the argument.  It doesn't matter to me because I have a very strong desire to validate my belief in the absurd.
How do you define soul?
"A baseless assertion by simple-minded, superstitious individuals"
   -Starstuff

Offline tomthecool

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2008, 03:27:59 PM »
Quote
2. Some intelligence created it.

For me, choice number 2 is much more sensible.

Where did the intelligent creator come from?

The creator always existed of course.  You see, the premise that everything is created by a being applies to everything but the creator.  I don't care that this invalidates the first premise of the argument.  It doesn't matter to me because I have a very strong desire to validate my belief in the absurd.
Close, but not quite right. The creator exists outside of the universe, therefore outside of time - hence it is 100% logical to say he cannot be created of destroyed.

All these scientific technicalities, eh? :P
Some say I am the cool Tom... others wouldn't.

Offline Cycle4Fun

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2008, 04:20:04 PM »
The creator always existed of course.  You see, the premise that everything is created by a being applies to everything but the creator.  I don't care that this invalidates the first premise of the argument.  It doesn't matter to me because I have a very strong desire to validate my belief in the absurd.
Close, but not quite right. The creator exists outside of the universe, therefore outside of time - hence it is 100% logical to say he cannot be created of destroyed.

All these scientific technicalities, eh? :P

But that violates the very definition of Universe! :o
How do you define soul?
"A baseless assertion by simple-minded, superstitious individuals"
   -Starstuff

Offline StPatrick

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Re: an observation [#667]
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2008, 04:49:18 PM »
Quote
And (this is the  kicker) by making choice 2, if
you are right, you get everlasting life, if you  are wrong, you'll never know
it!

And (this is the kicker) by making choice 2, if you pick the right cause out of an infinite set (Yahweh over Zeus, e.g.), you get everlasting life.  If you are wrong, you spend an eternity in hell!

Sorry kid, not gonna fly. 
If we come together and do not fight over religion, class and borders then we hold the key to a peaceful world. There are two possible futures in store; either a March of power and greed or a March of a unified human race.