My 5K was great, thanks for asking Anfauglir .
I never thought I would be relieved to be speaking with you Anfauglir, but after reading your last two responses I have the feeling that we are about to accomplish something here, and I hope others listen in.
I'm particularly happy to talk to someone that might be able to dismiss all this quasi earthquake prediction nonsense you scientific minded people seem to embrace. It's funny that I'm the one talking about premonitions, and having to beat down the foolishness that man has evolved with an increasing ability predict an earthquake.... separate from science, and without the existence of God. You thought I was loopy!
Now I detect that some of you moderator types might be taking on the role of kindergarten teacher making sure to protect the hurt feelings of the slower children by telling them they have good arguments, when they haven't a clue. You may fool them with this patronising, but I have no obligation to protect them from the truth.
I probably should tell you that the earthquake story you have heard is one of three. God 'placed me' for three consecutive earthquakes to prove himself to me, but the first is the only one of the three that He gave me a hint ahead of time. And all three it could be said were as much a surprise to me as they would be to any person when they occurred.
The fact that he gave me a preview of disruption on the first one never translated for me to an earthquake until it actually occurred. So, I didn't predict anything. I've been toying with the term retroactive prophet, because of the number of things God inspired me to write that coorelate to the present.
Now, it could be that he is in fact enrolling me in prophet school here, but I'll make no such claim of knowing the future until enough proof comes in to justify such a claim.
Think of all the goofy things Christian leaders have prophesied that fell flat. (The one from the Mormon leader duely noted and added here after the fact. I'd like to know if he made the statement after we had been to the moon as pianodwarf mentioned. I simply chaulk it up to men, obligated by their earthly office to make proclamations and supplying no mor than their best guess to offer as prophecy. It can be embarrassing.) I'm not invested in defending any man's prophecy, it it can't defend itself.
I'm tempted to go straight into the Obama thing right here because every spiritual message I got regarding him added up to him being reelected, but that reality was straining against my own hope that it could never happen. When He did win, I looked back and thought in retrospect kind of a latent "I told you so!".
The fact is... God told me so, I just didn't like it. So I ran around like a chicken with my head cut off hyperventilating about the disaster that was about to happen, and I even manned phones for Romney thinking I had to do my part to stop what, I was beginning to realise, was God himself, or I should say Satan having been cut loose. A number of you have been ribbing me about my not recognising God's will that Obama be president. You were all right about that, but not for the reason you wish.
Now, let me look at some of your ideas and questions:
So you're all in on this flattery of me about my being a one man earthquake detecting machine huh.
Nope. I DON'T think you are. But then, I didn't for one moment suggest that you were. Nor did you - you were pretty clear that you weren't (albeit using the incorrect term).
Thank you. My faith in reason has been restored.
What I asked you, was how DID you determine that? What makes you so positive that that you have no ability to predict earthquakes?
Though I started by explaining this I'll reiterate, It has never crossed my mind that I could predict them because I have always been certain of the purpose of the vision was a Christian message, not the hope of knowing when to brace for a quake.
After all, you had a vision of one, then later one happened. Was there a connection, or was there not? You seem to be pretty vehement that there is not.....but if that is so, what is the point of the story?
I can't see where I said there wasn't a connection, there clearly was. The point of the story in bible terms played itself out in the following week. One of the posts that got moderated out (deleted) included an illustration of Christ returning to earth. I will attempt a second time to post it here with its story.
You may recall that I mentioned that I joined the LDS Church, having been brought up as an evangelical. The earthquake was on Oct. 1. I was baptised LDS Oct 16th following, a Saturday. In the intrim, the local mission leader invited me to a meal at his home where I recounted for him the wonder of the earthquake. The elements of the vision, the disruption, the screaming, the laughing, the column of light pouring in the door, caused the mission leader to escort me to his livingroom to look at a piece of art on the wall, and he said that my description of the event makes him think of this picture.
So lets see how the coorelation causation thing applies to a God induced vision. Please explain.
The point, I suspect, is this - that you are saying that YOU are not the earthquake predictor, but rather than your god is. And that is where the correlation/causation thing comes in.
That sounds about right.
The evidence that you are presenting to us is that "Wayne experienced a vision of an earthquake. Later, an earthquake happened". If we assume the truth of the two events described, then there IS potential for correlation. I don't think anyone would deny that, given, as I said, the assumption of truth, and with the proviso that to definitely assert correlation we would need to track ALL your earthquake visions and ALL the earthquakes that occurred to see if there really IS a correlation between the two. That part is the thrust of the statistical analysis that others have been discussing with you.
A minor correction: I think you understand that the vision was of a disruption. I completely failed to think of it as an earthquake in the vision. I honestly think there is a reason for that that other of my writings illustrate. Just as the Darkknight premonition left me no imagination of impending disaster, neither did the disruption vision translate into an earthquake until it's fulfillment (one 23 years later, one two days later).
Now either I'm an inept interpreter of very clear prophetic warnings, or God intended me to miss the meanings until his good time. The latter is the reality, wether or not it was His intent. However, that imagination has never troubled me, as though I was too stupid to understand something the first time, they are instead just amazing and even playful surprises, and that is how I have taken them.
I noted and will repeat here that of three consecutive earthquakes that clearly had meaning to me, (I can't wait to tell you of the other two), only one had a vision preceding it so we can stop imagining any of this as even a divine scheme to employ me as an early warning system. what fun would an earthquake be if we all knew it was going to happen anyway?
YOU, however, are further asserting two things. Firstly, that there is not only correlation, but causation as well - that your incidence of an earthquake vision had an effect on the real earthquake that happened: essentially, that the vision HAD to be followed by the real earthquake (for it to be a vision as opposed to a fantasy). We are asking, time and again, how you determine the causal effect, how you determine that it is NOT plain chance. The statistical analysis we have been discussing is an important factor here.
Having a divine purpose, (an illustration of Christ's return) kind of throws all the statistical analysis out the window I would say. The vision didn't cause the earthquake, God caused the vision, and he may have caused the earthquake as well, which is an interesting thing to think about. It would be awfully flattering to me that he would have said, I'm going to blow Wayne's mind and cause an earthquake for his sake when he says the word IMPACT. Alternatively he, being omniscient, knew the precise moment and simply got me up, put me in the car, guided me to Paul's, had those ladies waiting, and a seat open, then gave her the idea to talk about Pat Robertson, had me respond at precisely the time that the earthquake had been scheduled for the millenia. The second scenario is a little less flattering to me and so that is the one I tend to believe.
But I have to be careful, because I don't want to limit God's power to say that he didn't just line up the earthquake with my words. He did break the diaphragm on my gas pump spontaneously, (or made sure that the batman movie and that particular Colorado screening of it waited until my gas pump was ready to fail). See the problem?
The more of these incidents kind of pile up in my dossier, the less apt I am to trouble myself with statistical analysis, and I think you can understand why in my case. I'm glad for your forensic questioning though and intend to clarify any points that you want.
And secondly, your strong assertion here that YOU did not produce the vision - that YOU do not have the earthquake-detecting skill. You are quite clear that you do not claim this skill. And I think you are correct. But - and this is a serious question - on what basis do you make that claim? How can you be so sure that you are not the world's first earthquake-detector? You poo-poo the suggestion, and I do not fault you for doing so....but I think it would be helpful if you explained exactly WHY you have decided to eliminate that possibility before looking for an alternative explanation. What is it that leads you to think "human earthquake predictor? Impossible!"
It is not impossible, it is just unnecessary as I have explained.
I'm sure you think it is a ridiculous question to ask, and I can quite appreciate why you would think that. But I promise you, despite the appearance it IS a crucial question - and I'm sure that most people here would agree with me.
That is crucial to an atheist maybe but not to me. Enough with the silliness.
Edited to say:
Moderator, could you please edit thi post to place the graphic in the text where i attempted to put it, and PM me with a tutorial. I looked in help and couldn figure it out. It jsut ends up[ on the bottom.
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