I'm not being dismissive. I'm just not ready to speak for others capacity. I don't think I'm that special, just that I beg a lot. (pray)
What does you praying have anything to do with what happens? I mean that. Seriously. You are asserting things again, yet you have no proof of it at all. You only imagine it does. As does every other person who does a rain dance, kneels toward Mecca, or pokes needles into voodoo dolls. None of it works but you all think it does. Prove to anyone that it works and show us the evidence. So far, you've given nothing that a rational person would deem useful.
My claims of unusual frequency for me are that I'm not surrounded by many people who have shown me their list of incidences. Nothing scientific in my claim, it is a great queston though.
Then you admit that you could be wrong about it, and the frequency at which unusual things happen to you could be the same as everyone else, right?
I get your point. I can only assure you that if I was knowingly telling a lie that my nose would drop off, or grow or whatever. I'm not kidding about any of it, and I can't prove it either. It is a testimony that you will just have to make with what you will. Thanks for entertaining it as far as you have.
I'm not insinuating that you're lying. I'm insinuating that you don't have any evidence for making the claims that you do and it seems to be a major trend with you. You might really believe that you get more than the next guy, but your beliefs about it have nothing to do with whether or not its true.
I express my desire for honesty and you need to insult it. That's ok.
I'm sorry if you don't like it Wayne, but your position deserves ridicule. It's ridiculous. Ridiculous things should be ridiculed. It might be the only way to get you to see just how dumb it is and take a second look at the thing you're asserting. How else do you get through to someone who is immune to reasonable and logical argumentation, and blinded by faith? If you've got another idea, I'm listening.
I get your point about the gas. The only thing you are missing is that if I interpreted the message accurately as God meant it for me to be interpreted because of God's specific way of communicating to me, God may just be laughing at you right now.
God isn't real Wayne. And if God isn't real, then what do all three of the 'gas' instances lead up to? Vague coincidence. Not even serious coincidences, but vague ones. I don't hear God laughing. Neither do you.
At some point you have to start at a neutral standpoint and ask yourself whether or not it's possible that all 3 of those things were completely unrelated. Step outside of your God belief and examine whether or not God has
to be real in order for all 3 of them to have happened. What conclusion do you come to? It's not difficult.
You're take on them is completely without merit or proof. You're just assuming they are connected for no apparent reason. It is completely non-sensical.
If you know bible stories, you know that miracles can be abstact.. donkeys talking bushes burning, birds feeding a man, manna from heaven, flaming tongues of fire. It's all weird stuff. Abstract, but to those to whom the message is meant, meaningful, and if I may say worthy of fully documenting for further scrutiny and edification. Thanks for helping me with it.
I know bible stories. And if you were to read stories about talking donkeys, burning bushes, people rising from the dead in any other book, you'd dismiss them out of hand as fictional tales. The bible is just a book, Wayne. It deserves no more respect or different consideration than any other book ever written, and furthermore, if you DO give it special consideration, then you are adding a personal bias to your assessment of one book over another, and that is special pleading. A big, fat, juicy fallacy.
Maybe. Critics say they are dark and tend to give the villain more attention than the good guy, and the good guy is dark in his own right. Think about that. Maybe God thinks that's a bad combination, dark heroes fighting dark villians. Try thinking like god and you may find the over all message is one that needs to be gassed.
A dark good guy? Kinda like a 'good guy' God that lets children get slaughtered because it's somehow better for the universe if they die rather than live?
A few million people have seen it and gone on with their lives like any other movie. Why don't you
think about that
? If God didn't want the movie made, would he have allowed it? What about all the people he didn't scare out of the movie with a gas leak? Considering that well over 80% of this country is Christian, it seems he let shit loads of Christians go in without a hitch. Yet you, in your narcissistic world, believe you're special. That you're something different. I got news for you Wayne. You're not. You just think you are and it's embarrassing to see. If you could see it from the outside... how you felt like you had to apologize for your prayers causing the gas leak... as if you're little self-imposed lunacy had caused the theater to shut down... it's absolutely stupid. Really, it is. As deeply deluded as you are, I think making fun of you is just about the only way to get a point across to you. And even that has a slim chance.
Do you actually believe that you think like God does, Wayne? You ask me to try thinking like God as if that will let me see things differently, because I assume that's how you approach it. You think like God. I don't know if I've ever heard such an egocentric, narcissistic position in my life. For someone to actually claim that they know how God thinks... It must feel real good to have convinced yourself that the most powerful being in the universe is looking out for you specifically and shitting on everyone else. I bet you'd fight real hard to keep hold of that delusion, wouldn't you? The problem is that it's not true. Atheists are just as happy and healthy as everyone else. If I were the God of the bible, I'd be hammering on the atheists. Yet He's not. Maybe He's not real after all?
It's all fake.
Go ahead. Maybe you do. Don't misinterpret what I'm saying here. The re-warder thing is a bible verse, if God was lying about it take it up with him.
If only he were real, maybe I could.
You ask what I cannot provide beyond what you have already read. If you don't see anything extraordinary in what I say happened, leave it at that. I'm doing my best, and I'll try harder, if I can think of how. I have a bunch of stories like this. I think that they are worth writing, because I'm not writing fiction, I'm reporting incidences. i hope you can forgive my my fascination for it all.
Your fascination comes from the fact that your agency detection system is way the hell out of whack. You simply don't have the brain power or the knowledge about probability and statistics to overcome that imbalance and come to a different conclusion than the one you're coming to. Strange things happen all the time to everyone. As I said before, in 42 million minutes, you're going to get that. You even admit that coincidences happen, yet when they happen in a way that seems to fit with your preconceived notions about the universe, you take those coincidences to mean something different. Yet it's not proof of anything and you know it. Only things that could not have happened without the intervention of a deity should be taken as some sort of evidence for God. Nothing else. Even if something as highly improbable as Adam Lanza's social security number being 143-98-2294 and your own phone number being 143-998-2294 is FAR more likely a pure coincidence than it is the hand of God. Know why? Because there are millions of phone numbers and millions of social security numbers!
But I find it profoundly believable not because I'm gullible, but because I know the God that is able to protect. It's the God that stopped me short of a slaughter of cows on the road. You may decide that it is entirely natural for a man to have four bullet holes in his coat with no injury, and so there is nothing to report. The Indian, Washington, and I might beg to differ.
If you believe that your prayers affected a gas leak in a movie theater, then absolutely yes, you're gullible. That's really stupid.
Did you know that Adolph Hitler survived 16 assassination attempts by his own people? What does that say to you about God? Is that just a coincidence? Could someone who believed that there was a god and that god was evil not point to this as absolute evidence of the supernatural? If you asked good ol' Adolph before he died whether or not God was watching out for him, would you really be surprised if he said yes? This same thing is all you're doing here. Nothing more.
I hope my responses so far have helped. the rest of your post was pretty angry. I'm not dismissing it, but I'll leave it for now.
Thank you for the time you spent.
I was nicer than you deserve, as have been most of the people you've encountered here so far. You've insulted our position many times and I deleted an entire paragraph at the end of my post before sending it, because it was angry ranting that frankly you have coming. You're judgement of us stems from a long history of being told how evil and awful we are, yet you goad us on by calling atheists rude, amoral, and telling us that atheism caused the deaths of those children. How do you expect us to react to that? How would you react if we said your religion was responsible for their deaths? A bit upset, right? Shocking! Yet you're nipping and pecking at us with sly little digs every so often with the idea that we mean old atheists are going to attack you for it and slide right on in to that stereotypical spot you already took us for, yet we restrain ourselves as best we can under the circumstances. It won't change your opinion of us though, because you're too deeply deluded to think otherwise. You'll just go back to thinking of all of us as those bastards who took away my right to shove my religion down other people's throats! Excuse me for thinking you're being a dick about it.
And you harp on Madelyn Murry O'Hare as if she represents every one of us and frankly, it pisses me off. She didn't believe in God. That's the thing we all
had in common with her. That is the sum total of atheism. You keep talking as if atheism is some sort of view on the world, but it's not. It's just a big, fat, 'Nah' to your position. It says nothing of what we DO want for this world. And if you bothered to take the time to get to know any atheists and step outside of your stereotyping, you might find that we're better and nicer than just about all the Christians you know. As far as M. M. O'Hare goes, I agree with some of her positions but not all of them. I'd assume you have something in common with theists like Fred Phelps, Jimmy Swaggart, and David Koresh, but you don't see me bashing you with those people, do you? Do their actions speak for you? If not, then cut the crap.
Everything bad that you've been told about us is likely a lie and you've been led to believe it because your side isn't winning the intellectual battle; so making you hate us is easier than fighting our points on even terms. It's been going on for 2000 years, and you are a prime example of the outcome. You bought it, and it's just easier for you to think bad things about us than to work at finding out the truth. You know we're bringing up good points. You know we're smarter than you, and you're probably disconcerted on some level that the smarter people don't buy the bullshit God stuff.
You're just wrong Wayne. You really are. God isn't real. It's completely fake. My advice to you is to take the time to explore what the other side is saying about God before dismissing it. We have really good reasons to think that God isn't real, and if you haven't explored them, then what makes you think you can claim you're right? Many of the people here are ex-Christians, meaning they've seen both sides of the question and decided where the truth was. Maybe you should do the same at some point. You're intimately familiar with one side of a very 2 sided argument. Stop mentally masturbating with Fox News and Glen Beck and start listening to the other side of the argument.