Author Topic: Moral laws of the Bible  (Read 14316 times)

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Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #174 on: April 30, 2012, 11:29:23 PM »
Negative Karma is the way we identify Christians on the board. If they are positive, we get confused, and attack the wrong people.
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Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #175 on: April 30, 2012, 11:29:48 PM »
I really am just a glutton for punishment.  And I come from a long line of people that like to argue.
Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #176 on: April 30, 2012, 11:30:47 PM »
I really am just a glutton for punishment.  And I come from a long line of people that like to argue.

That's a common JW trait. They need it to go door to door.
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Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #177 on: April 30, 2012, 11:31:10 PM »
I must sleep now.
Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

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Offline Zankuu

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #178 on: April 30, 2012, 11:54:00 PM »
Now look what you've done... making me reply and go slightly off topic.  :P

^^ for fuck's sake, just look up mental illness traits or something[...]

Don't get your panties in a twist. My field of study is psychology, so when I read a flimsy and unclear passage like "A mentally ill person would swing from side to side, or display irrationality in a vulgar manner..", it makes my brain glaze over, which is why I asked what you were talking about.

I just mean bipolar indications are emotional swings that turn on a dime for no reason.

Your wording is more clear here, but it isn't exactly correct. People that have Bipolar I disorder don't have mood swings that "turn on a dime for no reason". Their depression is triggered by chemical imbalances/drops in primarily serotonin and dopamine levels, which is why we see such great results from medicines like seroquel that bind to these receptors.

This person doesn't display bipolar behavior.  Jst also doesn't display behavior for depression, suicidal thoughts, thinking people are out to get him, thoughts of hurting others, no traits for major anxiety, no traits for sleep disorders, he doesn't say that he 'hears angels or demons talking to him', he doesn't say that he 'sees things that other people don't see (with his eyeballs)', etc.

And you're making such a bold diagnosis from what? Jst's hefty post count?
Leave nothing to chance. Overlook nothing. Combine contradictory observations. Allow yourself enough time. -Hippocrates of Cos

Offline Astreja

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #179 on: May 01, 2012, 12:45:34 AM »
The baby suffers no ill effects at all.  In fact, it is really a benefit to the child.  This child will certainly be resurrected onto a paradise earth.

This is one of the most unspeakably hideous rationalizations of murder that it has ever been My displeasure to read.

A religion that leads people to see pain and death in such a callous light is not fit to accompany humanity into the future.
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Offline One Above All

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #180 on: May 01, 2012, 01:52:15 AM »
A religion that leads people to see pain and death in such a callous light is not fit to accompany humanity into the future.

Would you mind if I used this as my sig?
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Offline Ivellios

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #181 on: May 01, 2012, 03:12:22 AM »
The baby suffers no ill effects at all.  In fact, it is really a benefit to the child.  This child will certainly be resurrected onto a paradise earth.

A religion that leads people to see pain and death in such a callous light   as a benefit is not fit to accompany humanity into the future.

I agree with Astreja, but I fixed to reflect what I feel like JWB was really saying.

Edit: Post #777 *Perfection*  8)
« Last Edit: May 01, 2012, 03:15:00 AM by TruthSeeker »

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #182 on: May 01, 2012, 03:42:22 AM »
His rationalisation that babies automatically go to heaven is from the hellist version of Christianity. In the hellist version, God automagically knows whether you were going to be a sinner or not, so you don't need to get a life. But there can be no automagic path to heaven, if killed as a newborn, or else it would be better to kill all babies.

An unfortunate part of Christian "morals" is that they don't seem to be able to separate hell or OT punishment from them. It becomes moral to torture a "witch" to repent, or lie to people about evolution. It becomes moral to kill someone for putting their penis in the wrong hole. They want to view the punishments as separate from the morality, so that they don't have to judge a fictitious God for slashing and burning people.

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Offline Seppuku

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #183 on: May 01, 2012, 06:55:57 AM »
Why would you ever do something so delusional and personally intellectually dishonest?

To clarify about interpretation, you must allow the Bible to interpret itself to derive at correct meanings.  If something is unclear then look elsewhere in the Bible on similar topics and the meaning will become more clear. 

Enlighten me on my previous post. I did exactly this. Jesus talked about the old law, so I checked in different parts of the bible to derive correct meanings. The meanings are in fact that the old testament is relevant. But I thought Jesus was kind, merciful and loving so there was no way he could mean the dark and terrible teachings of the old testament? Sure enough, when calling the Jews hypocrites (for praising God but following man's law) he quotes one of the dark teachings from the Old Testament to them. Those who curse their parents should be put to death. Line that up with all those quotes about Jesus and the old way, He means every single piece in the is still in effect.

There's multiple quotes to back THAT up. "I have not come to abolish the law of the prophets", "not an iota, not a dot will pass the law until all is accomplished", "All scripture is inspired by God", "the scripture cannot be broken", "it is easier for the heaven and earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid."




The post I made has been posted twice and probably the third or fourth time I've mentioned it. I will keep bugging you because I think what I've addressed is important as your claims go because they're very clear statements taken directly from the bible (NT & OT) that contradict your claims. I suggest going back and reading it when you have the time.
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #184 on: May 01, 2012, 07:44:46 AM »
No I read the Bible.  Then I concluded it was true.

How did you conclude that?  You must have had some criteria by which to determine whether it was true.  What was it?  Be specific.

I interpreted things completely different after starting with the assumption God is love. 

It is funny how stories can take on different meanings when you make assumptions at the very begining.  If you assume Garfield is a psychotic halucination of Jon, you will see the comic in a totally different way, the true way. 

I came to know the personality of Jehovah.

No you didn't.  You assumed it.  Remember? In the sentence right before this, you said you assumed god was love.  So you did not come to know anything.  You assumed it.

I could not help but love him. 

Try this: assume Omen is god.  Then you will come to know just how loveable he is.


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Offline Seppuku

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #185 on: May 01, 2012, 07:56:16 AM »
I wouldn't say Omen is as bad as God, at least I'd be tempted to give Omen a big hug, God on the other hand, I'd run the other way. If the God of the bible were real, I think it would be in our best interest to destroy him. Kind of like the gods of the Mesopotamian creation story, they managed to kill their creators. Heck, they made the earth from the body of Tiamat - I wonder what we could do with Yahweh's body?


I'm sure not even our JW friend here wants to kill Omen. :)
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Offline One Above All

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #186 on: May 01, 2012, 07:58:19 AM »
I wonder what we could do with Yahweh's body?

Crucify him, then eat him and gain magical powers.
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Offline velkyn

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #187 on: May 01, 2012, 09:27:13 AM »
And I need to make a correction.

1000 year reign begins first and then resurrection.

You forgot that your god simply "must" allow the imprisioned "beast" up to corrupt more people after your god has killed all of those who didn't beleive in him and has had JC doing that "thousand year reign".  Whee, what a good god to give his buddy Satan another turn at people. 
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Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #188 on: May 01, 2012, 10:09:45 AM »

It is funny how stories can take on different meanings when you make assumptions at the very begining.  If you assume Garfield is a psychotic halucination of Jon, you will see the comic in a totally different way, the true way. 


When you see the Garfield cartoons which have only Garfield in them, you can see Christianity in a different way, because the idea that Jon is hallucinating was just stuck on the end of the series, like Christianity was stuck onto Judaism. You can see the Old Testament like the Simpsons; where every episode has a new and bizarre situation, with no narrative continuity.

http://ceebeegeebee.wordpress.com/2007/08/28/garfield-is-dead/

Here's a whole load of ad-hoc reinterpretations:
http://open.salon.com/blog/emagill/2010/07/27/8_twisted_reinterpretations_of_pop_culture_favorites
.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2012, 10:33:47 AM by Add Homonym »
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Offline screwtape

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #189 on: May 01, 2012, 11:16:16 AM »
I actually had in mind the garfield comics with garfield removed.

http://garfieldminusgarfield.net/

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Offline jeremy0

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #190 on: May 01, 2012, 02:37:03 PM »
Now look what you've done... making me reply and go slightly off topic.  :P

My field of study is psychology<snip>
Your wording is more clear here, but it isn't exactly correct. People that have Bipolar I disorder don't have mood swings that "turn on a dime for no reason". Their depression is triggered by chemical imbalances/drops in primarily serotonin and dopamine levels, which is why we see such great results from medicines like seroquel that bind to these receptors.
Your field of study may be psychology, of which I only took one class, but you are incorrect in stating that mental illness is triggered by chemical imbalances/drops in primarily serotonin and dopamine levels.  Now you are getting into a domain of study I am much more equipped to talk about...
Mental illness' traits are characterized not by increases in dopamine levels, but rather overactivity of dopamine/serotonin receptors.  This is why the drugs we make target D2/D3/H5 receptors.  The unwanted side effects are characterized by the affinity of receptors at other sites in the brain.  The reason the more novel drugs in the pipeline show a more favorable side-effect profile is due to not having high affinity in other receptor sites, while having very high affinity at d2, d3, h5 receptor sites..
If each condition was characterized by a rise in dopamine levels in the brain (Note - drops in dopamine levels do not cause anything), then the drug Fanapt would have been a miraculous treatment for people, since it lowers dopamine levels in the brain.  However, in practice, we have found that Fanapt is largely ineffective on almost every patient, and only outperforms a placebo 'nothing'. 
Additionally, we are finding that mental illness' causes are characterized by GABA dysfunction - basically enzymes in the brain that regulate dopamine/serotonin receptor activity - the dysfunction of MGluRs may be related to regulation of d2, d3, and h5 receptor activity...
So, in accordance with the GABA theory of mental illness, which is being confirmed on rat studies (keep in mind we have previously been testing drugs on rats by giving them PCP, but now we can give similar traits through overstressing the rat), we are now concentrating pharmacology efforts in the area of mental illnesses on GABA or M-GluR PAMS (positive allosteric modulators).  Modulating such a thing has a potentially much lower incidence of a side-effect profile, and also may lead to treatments that can prevent the onset of such diseases, which are arguably the worst type of diseases that a human can possibly have..

Now, to get back to your field of study, psychology, you may be interested to find that in that field as well, there exists common characteristics of each person you are trying to give therapy to.  For example, you may find that people of all traits need an escape, or something else to concentrate on, that what you do to help with one condition can also help with another (guided imagery/meditation/etc)..

Provided, I haven't studied psychology enough to actually give therapy, only solutions that can help with a range of issues that a person may be characterized with..  If I were to give therapy to people it would probably be ineffective and brutal, however I have a bipolar person here at work and simply talking with him and making him see that all the conspiracy theories he has bought into are mumbo-jumbo, he has become very much more normal, and has been getting therapy himself - which seems to be helping him greatly..

I find these topics particularly interesting, as they affect the state of the mind.  I also find that at least some understanding of psychology is very helpful, especially since at some point in life most people should get some form of therapy according to what they may have to go through.  It is still a useful tool aside from medications that can help greatly with mental stability, as well as restoring certain bodily states..
Quote
This person doesn't display bipolar behavior.  Jst also doesn't display behavior for depression, suicidal thoughts, thinking people are out to get him, thoughts of hurting others, no traits for major anxiety, no traits for sleep disorders, he doesn't say that he 'hears angels or demons talking to him', he doesn't say that he 'sees things that other people don't see (with his eyeballs)', etc.

And you're making such a bold diagnosis from what? Jst's hefty post count?
I specifically said I wasn't diagnosing this person - only stating that at the time he wasn't saying anything that would indicate a mental illness, in his defense at the time, based on what he was saying...
« Last Edit: May 01, 2012, 02:47:33 PM by jeremy0 »
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Offline Zankuu

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #191 on: May 01, 2012, 04:19:02 PM »
Your field of study may be psychology, of which I only took one class, but you are incorrect in stating that mental illness is triggered by chemical imbalances/drops in primarily serotonin and dopamine levels.

I said depression can be triggered by chemical imbalances, which is true. You seem to have a firm grasp on pharmacology, so I don't have to explain why fluoxetine and other inhibitors work. A bit more off topic, but it is up for debate whether or not you should give antidepressants to those with bipolar because while it does get them out of the depression faster, it may destabilize them more in the weeks to come. Although with every case I've been involved with I've never seen adverse effects from doing this. *I just scrolled down and noticed you do cover this issue with the GABA side effect profile.

Mental illness' traits are characterized not by increases in dopamine levels, but rather overactivity of dopamine/serotonin receptors.

I never said anything about mental illness being associated with increases in dopamine.

This is why the drugs we make target D2/D3/H5 receptors.

What are you peddling, Saphris or Latuda?  ;)
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Offline jeremy0

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #192 on: May 01, 2012, 04:32:47 PM »
I never said anything about mental illness being associated with increases in dopamine.
You said it was related to decreases in dopamine levels, which is wrong - we thought it was due to increases in dopamine levels..  unless I read your post wrong.
Quote
This is why the drugs we make target D2/D3/H5 receptors.

What are you peddling, Saphris or Latuda?  ;)

I'm just stating the obvious.  But I am peddling over-the-counter morphine.  And marijuana as a side-treatment..  (just joking around)  Thanks - glad we got straightened out..
"If you find yourself reaching for the light, first realize that it has already touched your finger."
"If I were your god, I would have no reason for judgement, and you have all told endless lies about me.  Wait - you do already. I am not amused by your ignorance, thoughtlessness, and shallow mind."

Offline Gnu Ordure

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #193 on: May 01, 2012, 04:56:36 PM »
Quote
When King David arranged the death of Bathsheba's husband, God punished him by killing his new-born son.

Does that seem ethical to you?

Yes.
Then I've answered your question (or at least provided an example) of where secular humanist morality departs from biblical morality.

Humanists think it's wrong to execute a child for the crimes of the parent. You don't.

Quote
The baby suffers no ill effects at all.  In fact, it is really a benefit to the child. This child will certainly be resurrected onto a paradise earth.
If so, Christians who truly love their children, and who are prepared to make sacrifices for them, should kill them before they grow up, thus ensuring their eventual resurrection.

Offline nogodsforme

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #194 on: May 01, 2012, 05:24:11 PM »
Jst, this is your friendly fellow former Witness here. You have stated that you read the bible and believe it to be true. According to religious studies, the JW faith is the most biblically literal of all the fundamentalist Christian denominations.

That is, people who are attracted to JW faith are people who want/need black and white, binary explanations of the world. No room for nuance or shades of gray. People who like "always" and "never", instead of "maybe" and "sometimes". ( Islam is also attractive to people who want there to be the answer.)

I have a few questions of the kind that helped me stop thinking the bible was true. Leaving aside all the impossible stuff (the flood) incorrect stuff (light created before the sun) in the bible --I know, I know, if it is nonsensical, it must be a metaphor for something else that does make sense....--do you know how the bible was written and then edited and put together?

Do you know who wrote each part of the bible, when and why?Are you aware of all that was taken out of the bible, like books written about or by women? Have you heard about the Roman Era councils that decided what was true Christian doctrine and what was heresy? Do you know that parts of the bible were re-written, based on the contemporary political issues and power struggles? 

Do you think all the OT laws and rules (circumcision, dietary, treatment of slaves, how to make proper sacrifices, how to deal with crimes like rape) are appropriate for today? If not, how do you know which to keep and which to ignore? 

Why didn't Jehovah God (or any other) tell us how to sterilize water to kill germs, the single action which would have saved millions of lives over the millenia? Is god opposed to water purification? Is god opposed to people learning how the universe works through science?

Finally, why would Jehovah God (or any other) need a book
Extraordinary claims of the bible don't even have ordinary evidence.

Kids aren't paying attention most of the time in science classes so it seems silly to get worked up over ID being taught in schools.

Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #195 on: May 01, 2012, 06:04:45 PM »
I appreciate all the honest questions stated above.  I will try my best to get to them all tomorrow (my last work day).  I have been up past my bedtime several days this week taking part in petty squabbles and I am very tired and have a splitting headache (from too much time on the computer).   I must get some rest.

I hope everyone has a good evening.

Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

Isaiah 43:10

Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #196 on: May 01, 2012, 06:07:46 PM »
Quote
When King David arranged the death of Bathsheba's husband, God punished him by killing his new-born son.

Does that seem ethical to you?

Yes.
Then I've answered your question (or at least provided an example) of where secular humanist morality departs from biblical morality.

Humanists think it's wrong to execute a child for the crimes of the parent. You don't.

Quote
The baby suffers no ill effects at all.  In fact, it is really a benefit to the child. This child will certainly be resurrected onto a paradise earth.
If so, Christians who truly love their children, and who are prepared to make sacrifices for them, should kill them before they grow up, thus ensuring their eventual resurrection.

I have made a new thread "Clearing Jehovah's Name" in the "Shelter" board related to your questions.  However it will likely be moved or deleted.  For now I must go.
Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

Isaiah 43:10

Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #197 on: May 01, 2012, 10:19:27 PM »
Seppuku

Quote
Matthew 5: 17-20 - I have not come to abolish the old law, I have come to fulfil it.

The law has been fulfilled.  There is no longer a need to fulfill it again.  That is not to say the Hebrew law has no applicatoin to christians at all because it does.  One major difference however is that in christian times the punishments are no longer handed out by man but by God.  This is why you do not see one christian kill another for breaking the law. 

The christian's command is to "remove the evil man from among you".  By disfellowshipping a member the christian congregation thereby prounounces the death sentence.  It is only a matter of time before it is carried out to the most EXTREME sense.  I will explain.  You seem knowledgeable in the Bible so I will not quote scripture unless you require it.

The Bible shows there are two types of death.  The first type of death is the death that all people experience.  Those that die this type of death go to "Sheol" or "Hades" which is the common grave of all mankind.  The other type of death is the death symbolized in Revelation as the lake of fire.  Gehenna also symbolizes this.  Revelation itself interprets what the lake of fire symbolizes.  "This means second death."  The vast majority of people from pre christian times are in hades, even faithful Abraham.

The Bible shows that all those in Sheol or Hades will be resurrected.  However those that experience second death as symbolized by the lake of fire will never be resurrected.  When an apostate christian dies he does not enter hades.  He enters gehenna and is therefore dead for all eternity. 

So the law has not changed.  Only the manner in which the punishment is carried out has changed.

TruthSeeker I do not believe demons cause illness.

Add Homonym I do not believe babies go to heaven.  Please check my posts above.  I do believe the innocent and the ignorant will be resurrected but onto a paradise earth.  However their continues survival is not gauranteed.  This would not be fair.  They all must face Judgement Day.

Screwtape Because when I looked around I could see that everything was exactly as the Bible described it thousands of years ago.  At least those parts that I could personally verify.

My assumption came from the following.  Everything I could verify showed the Bible to be truthful.  Why should I doubt it when it says "God is love"? If you had a friend that told you the truth time after time after time and then one day he told you something new would you doubt him?

velkynThe Bible doesn't say this beast is imprisoned.  It shows it comes from the "sea" of tumultuous mankind.

nogodsforme If you are a former Witness then you can probably challenge my beliefs better than most since you should actually know what they are.  However you question about how light before the sun makes me question your actual knowledge of JW teachings since they have a clear explanation of this.  I have been avoiding this topic but I will eventually get around to it.

In answer to your questions, I am aware of some of the things you mentioned.

I do not know the answer to the sterilization question.  I must search the Bible.

No god is not opposed to man learning through science.  He has endowed man with a great yearning to learn and provided an immense amount to learn.  If he does exist then he could properly be called The Great Scientist.

Why a book?  He certainly doesn't need one.  But why not a book?  I assume God did/does certain things just because he wants to.  Maybe God has created life elsewhere and did things differently.  As far as I know he could have created an infinite number of different intelligent lifeforms, all doing things differently.  I cannot rule this out.  He does like variety it seems.

[Everyone] I know these are very short answers.  Please bare with me in the "Shelter" as I attempt to more thoroughly answer questions I have received.
Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

Isaiah 43:10

Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #198 on: May 01, 2012, 10:59:32 PM »

nogodsforme  However you question about how light before the sun makes me question your actual knowledge of JW teachings since they have a clear explanation of this.


http://www.watchtower.org/e/200609a/article_01.htm

Hillarious (velkyn trademark).

Perform this thought experiment for me JW: imagine that science had proven that the world was created in 7 days, and the sun/moon/stars were created 3 days after day and night. Would you put such effort into saying what this article says? No, I don't think so. You'd say that the text literally describes true creation, and everything about it is consistent. You wouldn't be talking about clouds and stretching days. Imagine how stupid an atheist would look if he did what you are doing.

Atheist: "Look, look.. there's a slight ambiguity in the opening sentence, which allows for the first day to be 14 billion years long."
Theist: "But the first day has been proven to be 24 hours long"
Atheist: "No it hasn't, and the ambiguity in the text suggests that it was really 14 billion years long"
Theist: "Where do you get that from? Where is 14 billion mentioned?"
Atheist: "It's implied"
Theist: "I don't see any implication, and I don't see any mention of clouds either."

The Genesis text is perfectly clear what it means. The fact that you can worm out of it, and then attack evolution is just ...........(word fails me)........... Let's face it, words have to fail me, because anything I say can be interpreted as anything you want.


  One major difference however is that in christian times the punishments are no longer handed out by man but by God.  This is why you do not see one christian kill another for breaking the law.

It had to be that way. Christians stole the religion off the Jews, and took it out of Jewish context, where no punishments could be handed out (legally). If it remained in Jewish context, then they could have made punishable laws. It was more applicable to universal proselyte/conversion, if they made all the punishments in the afterlife. In other words, they were desperate, so they had to change it this way.

« Last Edit: May 01, 2012, 11:07:18 PM by Add Homonym »
Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #199 on: May 01, 2012, 11:05:42 PM »
So if science does not contradict the Bible you then interpret the Bible as you see fit to assure it does?
Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

Isaiah 43:10

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #200 on: May 01, 2012, 11:12:29 PM »
So if science does not contradict the Bible you then interpret the Bible as you see fit to assure it does?

The interpretation of 7 days is what is perfectly implied by the text, and it's what the bulk of YECs believe, and probably what Kepler would have believed.  It's no coincidence. The Genesis description is also consistent with what people in that era believed. The writer puts the sun in the upper atmosphere, where the birds also fly, like Icarus. He simply pastes the sun moon stars into the picture, because he has no idea of the way they really work - just like most people of that era.

I'm not stretching the Bible. That's what it bloody says.

Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline Jstwebbrowsing

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #201 on: May 01, 2012, 11:23:54 PM »
Of course.  And I would take your opinion over theirs? 

And what is YEC?

Ye are my witnesses, saith Jehovah, and my servant whom I have chosen; that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me.

Isaiah 43:10

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Re: Moral laws of the Bible
« Reply #202 on: May 01, 2012, 11:33:36 PM »
And what is YEC?

YEC = Young Earth Creationism or Creationists
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.