Author Topic: Why would God fear your curiosity?  (Read 7068 times)

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Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #116 on: April 05, 2012, 09:30:19 AM »
I guess you can't since we are on a website...

What does the limitation of this communication being on a forum matter?

How would I differentiate you from someone who is mentally ill or someone of a different religion making a similar claim?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Alzael

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #117 on: April 05, 2012, 09:32:12 AM »
MonicalLynn, being new here allow me to mention that the text written in bold green indicates that I am speaking to you as a moderator as opposed to a regular member at this moment.

Please use the quoting function when responding to other posters. It makes it much easier to tell who you are talking to at any point in time and allows the conversation to flow better.

If you need to, there is a test area where you practice around with the sites functions so that you can get it down.


http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/board,28.0.html
"I drank what?!"- Socrates

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Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #118 on: April 05, 2012, 09:32:25 AM »
It is right if it is loving. There should be no wars in God's name after Jesus came. It is not biblical. These people who claim god told them are running on self will, and they are wrong. I understand your position though. Thre was a point I Did not believe. I needed proof. Then I thought how silly it was that I was trying to prove God to myself. No one else has been able o prove His existence, how could I? Well, we all know the answer to that.
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Ice Monkey

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #119 on: April 05, 2012, 09:33:16 AM »
@ ice monkey- I have publicly rebuked this jerk and am apologizing on behalf of him as a claimed "believer" . Is tis sufficient?

Hey ML.  No, as it wasn't your name he was using as his authority to be a dink.  It's not you who's integrity is in question.  I appreciate the fact that you have no trouble calling a fellow believer out, though.  That's all too rare.  But God's silence on all the atrocities committed in his name is deafening. 
Religion. It's given people hope in a world torn apart by religion." -- Charlie Chaplin

Offline Alzael

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #120 on: April 05, 2012, 09:33:25 AM »
I guess you can't since we are on a website...

This is why you need evidence. Which is what he's getting at. If you can't provide any evidence that what you say is true, how can one differentiate it from the ravings of a lunatic.

It is right if it is loving. There should be no wars in God's name after Jesus came. It is not biblical. These people who claim god told them are running on self will, and they are wrong. I understand your position though. Thre was a point I Did not believe. I needed proof. Then I thought how silly it was that I was trying to prove God to myself. No one else has been able o prove His existence, how could I? Well, we all know the answer to that.

This is simply an assertion however. If I assert that you're wrong then we are simply at square one. We both have two positions that are equally likely to be right, and no means of knowing what the truth is.

That's the difference, we actually care about the truth. We want to know what's true and what isn't.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 09:35:49 AM by Alzael »
"I drank what?!"- Socrates

"Dying for something when you know you'll be resurrected is not a sacrifice.It's a parlour trick."- an aquaintance

Philip of Macedon: (via messenger) If we enter Sparta, we will raze all your buildings and ravage all your women.
Spartan Reply: If.

Online One Above All

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #121 on: April 05, 2012, 09:33:37 AM »
BM
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #122 on: April 05, 2012, 09:35:31 AM »
I guess you can't since we are on a website...

What does the limitation of this communication being on a forum matter?

How would I differentiate you from someone who is mentally ill or someone of a different religion making a similar claim?


I don't think someone can be diagnosed mentally ill via messages. Besides, I think I'm okay. Didn't  used to be ;)
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #123 on: April 05, 2012, 09:36:40 AM »
Okay, I'm a lunatic. You guys got me.
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Ice Monkey

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #124 on: April 05, 2012, 09:37:43 AM »
Okay, I'm a lunatic. You guys got me.

I doubt you are.  I've never seen you at the meetings.
Religion. It's given people hope in a world torn apart by religion." -- Charlie Chaplin

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #125 on: April 05, 2012, 09:40:18 AM »
Can we get back to the on versatile, or should we all submit paperwork stating our sanity?
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #126 on: April 05, 2012, 09:42:22 AM »
*conversation ( auto correct, sorry )
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Ice Monkey

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #127 on: April 05, 2012, 09:44:32 AM »
Can we get back to the on versatile, or should we all submit paperwork stating our sanity?

The two aren't mutually exclusive.  Up to you.
Religion. It's given people hope in a world torn apart by religion." -- Charlie Chaplin

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #128 on: April 05, 2012, 09:44:49 AM »
Can we get back to the on versatile, or should we all submit paperwork stating our sanity?

No, you just have to deliver a claim or explain how you know what you claim, that allows us to separate you from someone who is mentally ill or someone of a different religion making claims in a similar way.

So, again ( since you didn't answer me directly ) how would I differentiate your claims from someone who is mentally ill or someone of a different religion making a similar claim?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Alzael

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #129 on: April 05, 2012, 09:45:11 AM »
Can we get back to the on versatile, or should we all submit paperwork stating our sanity?

We could, but the point remains valid. If you can't prove anything you're saying, then how can anything you say have any weight? Everything you say has no value except as a theoretical exercise. Lacking evidence the only thing a rational person can do is reject the claims. Which is what you should be doing about your own claims (assuming you were a rational person), rejecting them.

*conversation ( auto correct, sorry )

Look up next to your post. There's an edit button for you to alter posts. You don't need to make a whole other post just to fix it.
"I drank what?!"- Socrates

"Dying for something when you know you'll be resurrected is not a sacrifice.It's a parlour trick."- an aquaintance

Philip of Macedon: (via messenger) If we enter Sparta, we will raze all your buildings and ravage all your women.
Spartan Reply: If.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #130 on: April 05, 2012, 09:50:21 AM »
Oh, sorry. Very new at this. Yes, you're right, I should reject my faith. I did. As a result, God had an opportunity to prove himself to me by giving me a faith that was not f my own will. It was bizarre, but really cool. Can't really explain it, but if I could it wouldn't matter anyway. Everyone has their own journey. Do you guys think I'm here to convert you ? I'm not btw. Just sharing my experience. If you get something, cool. If not, makes no difference.
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #131 on: April 05, 2012, 09:51:25 AM »
Oh, sorry. Very new at this. Yes, you're right, I should reject my faith. I did. As a result, God had an opportunity to prove himself to me by giving me a faith that was not f my own will. It was bizarre, but really cool. Can't really explain it, but if I could it wouldn't matter anyway. Everyone has their own journey. Do you guys think I'm here to convert you ? I'm not btw. Just sharing my experience. If you get something, cool. If not, makes no difference.

So a voice spoke in your head and you believed it?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Alzael

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #132 on: April 05, 2012, 09:55:58 AM »
Oh, sorry. Very new at this. Yes, you're right, I should reject my faith. I did. As a result, God had an opportunity to prove himself to me by giving me a faith that was not f my own will. It was bizarre, but really cool. Can't really explain it, but if I could it wouldn't matter anyway. Everyone has their own journey. Do you guys think I'm here to convert you ? I'm not btw. Just sharing my experience. If you get something, cool. If not, makes no difference.

Evidence is something that can be shown or demonstrated. So he didn't actually prove himself. It goes back to Omens question about how to tell the difference between your faith and insanity (or some other process such as a brief hallucination). What you're really saying is that you experienced something that you couldn't explain and decided to attribute it to a god because you wanted to. At no point was anything proven.

This is why in science you subject things to peer review. Because ones person experience proves nothing.
"I drank what?!"- Socrates

"Dying for something when you know you'll be resurrected is not a sacrifice.It's a parlour trick."- an aquaintance

Philip of Macedon: (via messenger) If we enter Sparta, we will raze all your buildings and ravage all your women.
Spartan Reply: If.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #133 on: April 05, 2012, 09:59:01 AM »
No, that would make me a lunatic ;)

I just made the decision to ask for proof, and I consulted wht is said to be " the word of god" , and there my answers were. Those things that seemed preposterous the day before, made sense in a very deep way. that's about as far as I can explain it I guess. I asked, and I received. It's like one plus one for me. I will always know it to be two. Didn't learn it the same way, but it's the same assurance.
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #134 on: April 05, 2012, 10:00:47 AM »
Have you ever tried asking for proof? Sincerely and not just to disprove God?

Also, what are the Darwin  points to the left about?
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Ice Monkey

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #135 on: April 05, 2012, 10:01:55 AM »
Oh, sorry. Very new at this. Yes, you're right, I should reject my faith. I did. As a result, God had an opportunity to prove himself to me by giving me a faith that was not f my own will. It was bizarre, but really cool. Can't really explain it, but if I could it wouldn't matter anyway. Everyone has their own journey. Do you guys think I'm here to convert you ? I'm not btw. Just sharing my experience. If you get something, cool. If not, makes no difference.

Personally, i don't have a big issue with people who are sincere in an attempt to get me to change teams.  No biggie.
And I'm not going to ask for evidence while you speak of your own experiences.  I don't think you're obliged to, but by the same token, nobody will feel obliged to believe your conclusions.   You're welcome to share them publicly.  But you nailed it.  It won't make any difference, other than giving me insight into why you believe what you do. 
Which is something, I suppose, assuming you'll stick around.  There are many believers who do drive-by's.  Come and proselytize with horrid arguments my teenagers could reduce to ashes.  Most posters here have seen this often, and grow tired of the same old same old.  Their annoyance is understandable, but isn't always understood by the new believer.  The guys here aren't really as abrasive as they may seem.
Religion. It's given people hope in a world torn apart by religion." -- Charlie Chaplin

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #136 on: April 05, 2012, 10:04:04 AM »
No, that would make me a lunatic ;)

How does the following make you any less of a lunatic:

Quote
I just made the decision to ask for proof, and I consulted wht is said to be " the word of god" , and there my answers were. Those things that seemed preposterous the day before, made sense in a very deep way. that's about as far as I can explain it I guess. I asked, and I received. It's like one plus one for me. I will always know it to be two. Didn't learn it the same way, but it's the same assurance.

Ok, so how do I differentiate your claims from someone who is mentally ill or someone who claims a different religion as 'truth' in a similar way?

If you now have possession of magical knowledge, how do explain the bible having virtually no historical basis whatsoever and barely coinciding with history in the 8th century BCE?

If you now have possession of magical knowledge, how do you explain the fact that Jewish Eschatology has nothing to do with the claims of Jesus ( as a messianic figure ) and the rest of jewish eschatology is swept under the rug of the 'second coming'?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #137 on: April 05, 2012, 10:04:52 AM »
Have you ever tried asking for proof? Sincerely and not just to disprove God?

Also, what are the Darwin  points to the left about?

How do you separate your 'proof' from being mentally ill?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #138 on: April 05, 2012, 10:09:10 AM »
Yeah, that's too bad. Discipleship classes teach people to " plant a seed" if they cannot convert someone, but they don't consider what kind of seed they are planting. Many times, it is a bad one. Really, we should develope relationships with each other and let them judge if we are what we say we are before just following blindly, but I guess if you want a bunch of morons in your church, the first approach is okay.
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #139 on: April 05, 2012, 10:09:58 AM »
Yeah, that's too bad. Discipleship classes teach people to " plant a seed" if they cannot convert someone, but they don't consider what kind of seed they are planting. Many times, it is a bad one. Really, we should develope relationships with each other and let them judge if we are what we say we are before just following blindly, but I guess if you want a bunch of morons in your church, the first approach is okay.

Why is it that you believe that you are not planting a bad seed today, by being intellectually dishonest with us?
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Alzael

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #140 on: April 05, 2012, 10:11:51 AM »
Have you ever tried asking for proof? Sincerely and not just to disprove God?

Also, what are the Darwin  points to the left about?

That makes no sense. If you aren't trying to prove or disprove something then proof is meaningless in any event. The mere fact that you're asking for proof indicates that you're trying to disprove god.

Besides which, what you're really suggesting is called confirmation bias. That if you go looking for evidence for a supposition hard enough you'll convince yourself that you've found it.

It also shouldn't be necessary. You and every religious person should already have mountains of proof readily available to show me. If there were any substance to your beliefs at all that is and you're not just dressing up your own make-believe fantasies as deities.
"I drank what?!"- Socrates

"Dying for something when you know you'll be resurrected is not a sacrifice.It's a parlour trick."- an aquaintance

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Offline MonicaLynn

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #141 on: April 05, 2012, 10:13:13 AM »
Let's say a child lost his father he never knew to a war. All he had was his fathers diary. In that diary, his father wrote that he loved him very much and gave directions on how he thinks his son should conduct himself. Would it be mentally ill of the son to believe that his father loves him and tht he should do his best to follow his father's instructions?

If that is the seed received, so be it. I don't even know what intellectually dishonest means.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 10:15:29 AM by MonicaLynn »
Only here to befriend and exchange ideas. I do believe in God, but i don't think you're going to hell.

Online One Above All

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #142 on: April 05, 2012, 10:14:56 AM »
If there was absolutely no evidence of said father and the diary was inconsistent with reality itself, yes.
BTW, that's a false analogy. Religious texts were not written by their respective deities. They were written by men.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

A.K.A.: Blaziken_rjcf/Lucifer/All In One.

Offline Omen

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #143 on: April 05, 2012, 10:15:43 AM »
Let's say a child lost his father he never knew to a war. All he had was his fathers diary. In that diary, his father wrote that he loved him very much and gave directions on how he thinks his son should conduct himself. Would it be mentally ill of the son to believe that his father loves him and tht he should do his best to follow his father's instructions?

That analogy has nothing to do with your god claim ( fallacy: False Analogy ).  You're purposefully misconstruing objectively known constraints with nonsensical supernatural subjective claims. 

Plus, we could objectively verify that a war occurred, that there was a father, and that that father left a letter.

We can't objectively verify your god exists, your claims about your god are true, or that your claims are different from someone who is mentally ill.  Not to mention someone of a different religion that contradicts your own, but claims their own truth in a similar way.
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Offline Ice Monkey

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Re: Why would God fear your curiosity?
« Reply #144 on: April 05, 2012, 10:17:58 AM »
I don't know how much of her bad arguments/theology is on purpose, Omen.
Religion. It's given people hope in a world torn apart by religion." -- Charlie Chaplin