Being nice to theists

[One Above All]

kymer, tell me when you're ready to put up. I'm sure everyone would like to see it.

[kymer]

Kaziglu bey...

If it's difficult to remain diplomatic, that's hardly the other person's fault. No, I don't find anything said by anyone as an insult to my intelligence, I don't take it as an insult. I don't know, maybe it's my upbringing, but I just don't get flustered by other people's statements, I find it very easy to to keep my cool, it's actually no effort for me. I really don't care how wrong ILY or any other theist may be, I simply don't take his opinions as a personal attack, and I feel no defensiveness about it whatsoever.

Why is almost everyone arguing with me? Answer : because it infuriates them that I don't share their point of view when it comes to being diplomatic with theists. Insanity is repeating the same old thing again and again and expecting the same result. Move on.

[Omen]

I am sorry for ignoring you. However I am afraid I will disappoint.

Then you have absolutely nothing to say of merit.

[kaziglu bey]

Kaziglu bey...

If it's difficult to remain diplomatic, that's hardly the other person's fault. No, I don't find anything said by anyone as an insult to my intelligence, I don't take it as an insult. I don't know, maybe it's my upbringing, but I just don't get flustered by other people's statements, I find it very easy to to keep my cool, it's actually no effort for me. I really don't care how wrong ILY or any other theist may be, I simply don't take his opinions as a personal attack, and I feel no defensiveness about it whatsoever.

Why is almost everyone arguing with me? Answer : because it infuriates them that I don't share their point of view when it comes to being diplomatic with theists. Insanity is repeating the same old thing again and again and expecting the same result. Move on.

Arguing with you? You presented a question regarding ILY's posts, and I answered it as meaningfully as possible. It would be nice for you to actually address the answer to the question you posted, rather than dismissing what I say and blaming inexcusable ignorance on me. If people just believed this nonsense and kept it to itself and it's church, it would be fine. But here in the US, religious zealots are actively seeking to undermine or prevent people from having civil rights. When fanatic legislators seek to pass laws that would force women requesting an abortion to essentially be raped, we have an OBLIGATION to be outraged. If you are not outraged by such a thing, I am really not sure what sense of morality you possess. When these people want LIES taught in school as equivalent to science, I will be outraged, and justifiably. And when these same people use for the justification of their position a collection of ancient, violent, racist myths and expect us to take them seriously and grant them unquestioning respect and authority, we have every right to criticize them for it.

[Omen]

I don't think many atheists here

Continue to slander and insult everyone here using equivocating ambiguous rhetoric.

Support anything you claim? Nope.

[Omen]

However the pejorative view that all theists are zealots is unfair. In my own life this is not my experience.

@Penfold: What I have been saying is honestly held and I have every confidence that it would be apparent to anyone examining the discourse theist have to offer on this forum.

Note, its fair and I'm not going to answer for any request for evidence to support that assertion.  I have three reasons:

1. I'm not claiming a moral high ground, I'm just insinuating through a pejorative related to a pleaded ethical qualification and then shifting the goal posts when held accountable.

2. I don't want to name individuals, I just want the ability to bad mouth people as I wish based on vague accusations not supported by a reasonable comparison to evidence that literally supports my claims.

3. I'm so busy in real life, gosh darn it, its hard to spend 5 or 10 minutes to find an example ( like an atheist calling theist idiots literally when they first visit this forum ).  Since I reject any notion of actually giving an example of what I'm talking about as I insultingly dismiss the entire community here, what does it matter anyway?

I apologize for not doing what I should do, but I'm not going to do it anyway.  Instead, I'm going to keep making vague pejorative insinuations about the community and expect to be taken seriously on nothing more than that.  This is the kind of peaceful conversation I want and I'm not doing anything wrong.

[bertatberts]

We don't criticise an infant for saying "ma-ma" rather than "mother"; its a process. If kids are praised for making an effort they will be more inclined to make an effort in the future. It's simple science (ref Pavlov, Skinner).

That's the second time you've used that fallacious argument. We are not nurturing children and infants, we are conversing with adults.
Unless you're suggesting that all theists are the equivalent of children and infants.
We don't talk to people as though they are not capable of comprehending what we are saying.
We expect adults to act like adults and to have the courage of their convictions.
Hence, when they don't, they get either sarcasm or angst. 

[Omen]

Examining the posts of ILY.

This was his first post:

http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,21086.msg477424.html#msg477424 

From this post on, ILY was greeted kindly, casually talked with, and asked questions about his claims.  His posts in return were often dismissive, non-explanatory, and in the absence of credible reason/evidence to support his position.  The questions and requests for him to support his position increased and at no point did anyone attack him, insult him, or do anything at all except desire to bring him back to task on his constant dodging.

Eventually, after 89 posts of not being insulted, ILY began to play the victim card:

http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/forums/index.php/topic,21086.msg479014.html#msg479014

Based on nothing more than being asked to support his position, he begins slandering us for bothering to take him to task and hold him accountable.  Even the posts that occurred after ILY's slanderous and insulting accusation of us offered nothing but calm explanations of how he has a misinformed bias, behaving unfairly towards us, or wasn't effectively answering anything asked of him.  Unapologetic questions continued and ILY obliged by dodging virtually anything put before him, he continued to insinuate that he only responds to those who 'treat him kindly' which translates into those who allow him the most room to equivocate through red herrings or don't take him to task immediately.

In fact, I went on to review over a hundred posts after that one.. and not a single solitary person attacks his character by insulting him.  They certainly ask him questions he wants to avoid and not acknowledge, but that isn't an insult and on the contrary.. that is insulting to us.

[kymer]

Not that I should even have to do this, but what the hell, HAL is going to start a thread just for me and ILY. It's going to be a lesson in diplomacy, so get your notebooks out.

[HAL]

Not that I should even have to do this, but what the hell, HAL is going to start a thread just for me and ILY. It's going to be a lesson in diplomacy, so get your notebooks out.

I will return in a few hours and set it up, but I have no idea if ILOVEYOU will agree.

[One Above All]

Finally, after getting 43 smites, kymer is going to put up. If this doesn't work, I expect[1] you to shut up, or the smites will continue.

1.	Metaphorically speaking.

[kymer]

Oh no, lucifer is going to smite me. Woe is me.

[One Above All]

Oh no, lucifer is going to smite me. Woe is me.

That's actually what you've been complaining about since you started complaining. Well, you weren't complaining about me specifically, but all the smites you've received.

[Seppuku]

If it's any consolation, in the end we're all gonna be smited by God, because we're all a bunch of godless heathens. Consider it preparation for when the day comes.

[gonegolfing]

Penfold:

I have had many engaging discussions with theists in my time. Some of the greatest intelligences debaters I have known are theists.

Cheers mate.....just thought I'd change that to what it should say.

Surely a perfect and all powerful god's admiration for intelligence in a good theist, is about the same as the level of admiration in a Warden for the intelligence of an inmate serving a life sentence ? 

[kymer]

HAL, will ILY be allowed to "preach" in our debate?

[One Above All]

HAL, will ILY be allowed to "preach" in our debate?

I know I'm not HAL, but I think that it would be unfair for him not to be, given that that's what you've been doing.

[Omen]

HAL, will ILY be allowed to "preach" in our debate?

Its only fair that someone engages in the same poor level of discourse as you yourself engage in.

[kymer]

Thank you for your response lucifer. Yes it would be best if he was allowed to "preach", so that I can demonstrate to certain members how to be diplomatic.

Ooops, I didn't notice omen posting pretty much the same thing as you lucifer. Funny how that just happens sometimes.

[Omen]

Thank you for your response lucifer. Yes it would be best if he was allowed to "preach", so that I can demonstrate to certain members how to be diplomatic.

Ooops, I didn't notice omen posting pretty much the same thing as you lucifer. Funny how that just happens sometimes.

You do realize that you have to have a subject to debate in a debate, right?

If you're only action is going to be to simply agree to disagree, then you're not debating anything.  That is not diplomatic and it accomplishes nothing.

[kymer]

Well, let's just agree to disagree on that, omen. I'm just kidding. Yes, of course. What do you think the subject ought to be? Make a list of good possible subjects.

[Omen]

Well, let's just agree to disagree on that, omen. I'm just kidding. Yes, of course. What do you think the subject ought to be? Make a list of good possible subjects.

Not my job, that's yours.

Can you also provide the examples of bad behavior you claimed of the community?

So that, in fairness, we have something to compare it too?

[kymer]

Haha, nice try omen. Why don't we just wait until later and then we can all enjoy a lively debate between me and ILY. I think the debate should be about how ILY came to be a christian.

[Omen]

Why don't we

We've already been waiting for you to support with evidence your insinuations and insults about the community here.

just wait until later and then we can all enjoy a lively debate between me and ILY. I think the debate should be about how ILY came to be a christian.

How is asking someone how they became a christian a debate?

What would be your position?

Do you know what a debate is?

[kymer]

Well that's what I think it should be about, omen. I'm sure ILY will be only too happy to talk about that. As I told you before let's just wait and see how it goes.

[Omen]

Well that's what I think it should be about, omen. I'm sure ILY will be only too happy to talk about that. As I told you before let's just wait and see how it goes.

de·bate/di?b?t/
Noun:   
A formal discussion on a particular topic in a public meeting or legislative assembly, in which opposing arguments are put forward.

What is your opposing argument or counter position?

[Omen]

Kymer, why can't I find a single insult towards ILY even up to the 89th post where ILY accused others of 'hatred' without explanation or citation?

[kymer]

What is your opposing argument or counter position?

Like I said to you before let's just wait and see.

[Omen]

What is your opposing argument or counter position?

Like I said to you before let's just wait and see.

If you don't have one by the time it starts, then it is not really a debate.