Author Topic: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers  (Read 761 times)

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Offline velkyn

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This time in Tennessee

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2012/03/23/still-more-religious-insanity-in-tennessee/
Quote
Proposed by state representative Andy Holt (a Republican, of course), the bill (SB 3632/HB 3616) prohibits restrictions on students giving “reasoned” religious answers to questions on tests or essays, or from bringing their faith into the classroom.


http://www.tennessean.com/article/20120322/NEWS0201/303220018/Bill-purports-protect-schools-when-students-pray-express-faith?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Quote
Under the bill, school districts also would require teachers to treat a student’s faith-based answers to school assignments the same as secular answers. But while the bill allows faith-based answers, those responses must be justified like any other student’s.

I'm guesing that "the bible said so" would be insisted as "justification" enough.   If so, then saying "my medicine man said it was so" should be equally as valid.  But you know that these Christians don't mean it that way at all.   Pure hypocrites and liars.

Nothing like making kids stupid and then expecting them to get a decent job. 


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Offline Nick

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2012, 01:13:18 PM »
Put "God did it" on every answer.  Man, it will be easy to pass biology now. 

They might be surprised when they get to college...oh, wait, this is Tenn.  Forget that...they don't go to college.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline ParkingPlaces

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2012, 01:25:53 PM »
Okay, here is what I propose. Anyone using god as an excuse for ignorance will have to let him guide them through their whole life. Buy a new chainsaw? No manual, just a piece of paper that says "Let god guide you." Same with Ikea desks.

That'll teach 'em. Or their survivors.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline changeling

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2012, 02:15:57 PM »
That bill wouldn't accomplish anything anyway.
There is no such thing as a "reasoned" religious answer.
The level of dumb they have to sell, is only made remotely possible by the level of flocking their sheep are willing to do in the name of rewards for no thought. quote: Kin Hell

"Faith is the enemy of evidence, for when we know the truth, no faith is required." Graybeard

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #4 on: March 23, 2012, 02:46:33 PM »
Okay, even reading the summary, that bill was confusing.  Seems to me that they should spend some time cleaning it up.

Offline Nick

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #5 on: March 23, 2012, 02:53:30 PM »
HOw about spending time getting people back to work.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

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Offline velkyn

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2012, 02:59:25 PM »
seems that no legislators want to bother with that.  here in PA, they're all about making a "year of the bible", trying to get days of prayer, forcing their religous will on women, etc.  Golly, with such a schedule how dare anyone think that they could work on jobs or infrastructure or anything that isn't religious based.


this is why we always have to push back and push back hard.
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Offline Tinyal

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #7 on: March 23, 2012, 03:34:27 PM »
I've  given up hope for many of the Southern US states - Tenn, Miss, Ark, Texas, FL, Virg, the Carolina's, Penn - to one degree or another, most of the southern states are drifting (sometimes slowly, sometimes more quickly) into fear-based insanity.  In many instances, a majority of the residents of these states want to make this country a christian theocracy, setting us back hundreds of years.

Christrian fundamentalism, Dominionism, and multi-generational bigotry are rampant.  As far as I'm concerned, many of these states might as well be another country - and I personally would have no problem whatever if they split off into their own insane country.

It's extremely depressing - and worrisome.  Sooner or later, some kind of civil war/extensive unrest is definitely not out of the question.
Don't kangaroos skip along the surface of the water?

Offline Graybeard

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #8 on: March 23, 2012, 03:48:04 PM »
This time in Tennessee

http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2012/03/23/still-more-religious-insanity-in-tennessee/
Proposed by state representative Andy Holt (a Republican, of course), the bill (SB 3632/HB 3616) prohibits restrictions on students giving “reasoned” religious answers to questions on tests or essays, or from bringing their faith into the classroom.
I do hope that goes right up to Doctorate level for all subjects. I could see myself as Graybeard PhD with a small income from Graybeard M.D. I may even have a chance to operate on Andy Holt.

I promise that any answer I gave would be "inspired by God."
« Last Edit: March 23, 2012, 05:01:26 PM by Graybeard »
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline Omen

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #9 on: March 23, 2012, 04:09:10 PM »
Text of HB3616-1

SUMMARY OF BILL:    Requires local education agencies (LEAs) to treat a student’s
voluntary expression of a religious viewpoint in the same manner that the LEA treats a student’s
voluntary expression of a secular viewpoint on an otherwise permissible subject. Prohibits
LEAs from discriminating against a student on the basis of the expression of a religious
viewpoint. 
 
Requires LEAs to adopt a policy that includes the establishment of a limited public forum for
student speakers at all school events where a student will speak publicly. This disclaimer shall
be provided at all events where the LEA feels there is a need to dispel confusion over the LEA’s
sponsorship of a student’s speech. Prohibits student expression on an otherwise permissible
subject from being excluded from the limited public forum because the expression is based on a
religious viewpoint.
 
Authorizes students to express their beliefs about religion in assignments and requires such
expression to be free from discrimination based on the religious content of their submission.
Requires homework and classroom assignments to be judged by ordinary academic standards of
substance and relevance and against other legitimate pedagogical concerns identified by the
LEA. Prohibits students from being rewarded or penalized on the basis of the religious content
of their work.
 
Authorizes students to organize prayer groups, religious clubs, or other such gatherings before,
during, and after school to the same extent that students are permitted to organize other non-
curricular student activities and groups. Requires religious student groups to be given equal
access to the school facilities for assembling as those given to other non-curricular groups.
Requires religious student groups that meet for prayer or other religious speech to be allowed to
advertise or announce their meetings in the same manner that the LEA authorizes other non-
religious student groups. Authorizes LEAs to disclaim school sponsorship of non-curricular
groups and events in a manner that does not favor or disfavors groups that meet to engage in
prayer or other religious speech.
 
Model Policy Articles I and II:  Sets forth a model policy that LEAs may use and adopt in order
to implement a policy establishing a limited public forum and voluntary student expression of
religious viewpoints. Requires any LEA that voluntarily adopts the model policy to be in
compliance with it. The model policy establishes the limited public forum for the voluntary
student expression of religious viewpoints applicable to certain students. 
 

 
 
HB 3616 - SB 3632
2
The model policy also requires the LEA to create a limited public forum for certain other
speakers and to treat a student’s voluntary expression of a religious viewpoint on an otherwise
permissible subject in the same manner that it treats a student’s voluntary expression of a
secular or other viewpoint. 
 
Model Policy Article III: The model policy sets forth requirements for student speakers at
graduation events. 
 
Model Policy Article IV: The model policy that is adopted by the LEA shall authorize a student
to express their belief in homework, artwork, and other assignments and requires such
expression to be free from discrimination based on the religious content of their submission.   
 
Model Policy V: The model policy that is adopted by the LEA shall authorize students to
organize prayer groups, religious clubs, or other religious gatherings before, during, or after
school to the same extent that students are permitted to organize other non-curricular student
activities and groups. 
 
The model policy authorizes school authorities to disclaim sponsorship of non-curricular groups
and events; as long as they administer the disclaimer in a manner that does not favor or disfavor
groups that meet to engage in prayer or other religious activity.
 
The bill will be applicable beginning in the 2012-2013 school year.
 
ESTIMATED FISCAL IMPACT:
 
 
Increase Local Expenditures – Not Significant   
 
 
Assumptions:
 
• LEAs continually revise and make new policy. This policy will be established in the
normal course of LEA revision and meetings without a significant increase in local
expenditures. 
• No fiscal impact on state expenditures. 
   
   
  CERTIFICATION:
 
 
The information contained herein is true and correct to the best of my knowledge.
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline Omen

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #10 on: March 23, 2012, 04:11:25 PM »
Authorizes students to express their beliefs about religion in assignments and requires such
expression to be free from discrimination based on the religious content of their submission.
Requires homework and classroom assignments to be judged by ordinary academic standards of
substance and relevance and against other legitimate pedagogical concerns identified by the
LEA. Prohibits students from being rewarded or penalized on the basis of the religious content
of their work.


1. A student can provide a religious answer.
2. Teachers judge by ordinary academic standards.
3. Teachers can't penalize a student on the basis of a religious answer.

Right.
"Religious faith is the antithesis to knowledge, it is the opposition to education, and it has to act in animosity against the free exchange of ideas.  Why? Because those things are what cause harm to a religions place in society most." - Me

Offline bgb

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #11 on: March 23, 2012, 04:25:14 PM »
They are getting as bad as the Muslims.  Theocracy will destroy us.
The whole point of science is that most of it is uncertain. That's why science is exciting--because we don't know. Science is all about things we don't understand. The public, of course, imagines science is just a set of facts. But it's not.  Freeman Dyson

Offline Brakeman

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #12 on: March 23, 2012, 08:18:50 PM »
Perhaps this is a dying gasp of desperation. Theists sense that education destroys faith and are desperate to fight this way to save their SPAG religion. The internet is making people more accustom to new ideas, and this is fatal for the theists.
Help find the cure for FUNDAMENTIA !

Offline Frank

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #13 on: March 23, 2012, 08:54:09 PM »
I've  given up hope for many of the Southern US states - Tenn, Miss, Ark, Texas, FL, Virg, the Carolina's, Penn - to one degree or another, most of the southern states are drifting (sometimes slowly, sometimes more quickly) into fear-based insanity.  In many instances, a majority of the residents of these states want to make this country a christian theocracy, setting us back hundreds of years.

Christrian fundamentalism, Dominionism, and multi-generational bigotry are rampant.  As far as I'm concerned, many of these states might as well be another country - and I personally would have no problem whatever if they split off into their own insane country.

It's extremely depressing - and worrisome.  Sooner or later, some kind of civil war/extensive unrest is definitely not out of the question.

Actually I agree with this. America has a country within a country. These states have nothing in common with the rest of America other than providing cannon fodder for the army. They don't appear to be getting any saner and if Obama wins a second term they will in all likelyhood get worse. The crazier elements of the rightwing have given up trying to get their crackpot ideas accepted at the federal level so they have taken to trying to undermine the authority of the government at state level. The rightwing in these states are without doubt acting in a co-ordinated fashion to produce an endless stream of anti women, science, education, union, well really anti everything, bills that they know will get challenged and struck down in court. Thus giving them the chance to act the wounded martyr and encourage even greater extremism.
I think it will come down to armed conflict in the end otherwise America will simply become ever more ungovernable.
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Offline joebbowers

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2012, 03:37:04 AM »
It's extremely depressing - and worrisome.  Sooner or later, some kind of civil war/extensive unrest is definitely not out of the question.

I think it's downright inevitable. Think American Christians today aren't violent? That's only because they mostly get their way. Stop letting them impose their beliefs on others and they will be out for blood in a very real sense.
"Do you see a problem with insisting that the normal ways in which you determine fact from fiction is something you have to turn off in order to maintain the belief in God?" - JeffPT

Offline joebbowers

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2012, 03:51:53 AM »
If I were a teacher I could see a way through this. They bill says that it "Requires homework and classroom assignments to be judged by ordinary academic standards of substance and relevance..."

Ok, so in order for any student to use a religious answer, they must prove that their religion is the only true religion and that God is real. Good luck with that, kids.
"Do you see a problem with insisting that the normal ways in which you determine fact from fiction is something you have to turn off in order to maintain the belief in God?" - JeffPT

Offline Historicity

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Re: tennessee - more trying to get myths taken as scientific answers
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2012, 07:58:19 AM »
I've  given up hope for many of the Southern US states - Tenn, Miss, Ark, Texas, FL, Virg, the Carolina's, Penn -

Brevard County, Florida (my county) is OK:

Catholics                   79847   16.77%
EvangelicalProtestant   59301   12.45%
Mainline Protestant   35901   7.54%
Other                            8663    1.82%
Orthodox                    2804    0.59%
Unclaimed                 289714    60.83%

(as once reported in a survey by our local newspaper, Florida Today)