Author Topic: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment  (Read 510 times)

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Offline DavidQ

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Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« on: February 14, 2012, 04:01:32 PM »
The ACLU tells me that the U.S. Senate is seeking to give religious institutions a means to deny health care coverage they object to (birth control) by way of the "Blunt Amendment" to be attached to S. 1813, the highway funding bill.

Their petition against this action is at https://secure.aclu.org/site/Advocacy?cmd=display&page=UserAction&id=4085&s_subsrc=120214_Blunt_ar, and here's what I had to say . . .

I am utterly sick and tired of Religions seeking to shove their (what should be personal) beliefs down the throats of everyone else. I'm likewise incensed by efforts of the Right to help them do it!

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof ..." The First Amendment clearly speaks as much to freedom FROM religion (NO ESTABLISHMENT) as to freedom to practice it. Yet Religions and the Right seek to impose their faith based beliefs at every turn.

The Grand Old Party's grandstanding looks ignoble, undignified, mean, and worthless.

Please, stop it. Get back to days gone by when government worked for the common interests of all the people.

Offline velkyn

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2012, 04:22:18 PM »
in the usual deceitful attempts to get legislature through, an amendment has been introduced to the new highway bill in congress.  The highway bill sucks but this is even worse.

ACLU has this

Quote
Within hours, the U.S. Senate could vote on a measure that could give any insurer or employer the right to refuse people coverage for any health care service required under the Affordable Care Act. All they'd have to do is cite undefined "religious beliefs or moral convictions."

Amendment is this http://blunt.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/12ca4c96-d98c-4b37-920a-cdb15edb24d4/S.%201813%20Amendment.pdf

so any religious person can deny anyone who has the misfortune to be working for them, *any* medical treatment that they don't like.   No blood transfusions, no mental health care, and gee, if we have the idiots who think all sickness is God's will, no health insurance at all. 

so now we see what *some* Republicans, and theists, really want, their freedoms to be considered more important than other Americans.  They aren't interested in creating jobs or fixing infrastructure, they want a theocracy. 
"There is no use in arguing with a man who can multiply anything by the square root of minus 1" - Pirates of Venus, ERB

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Offline Nick

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2012, 04:52:11 PM »
It is very simple.  They want women to be baby machines and nothing more.  Duggers all over the place.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline Nick

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2012, 04:55:58 PM »
Those days are long gone.  The Republican party has been taken over and they have their claws deep into it.  As I memntioned in another post they seem to want women to be nothing more than baby machines.  The dugger lady was at the CPAC conferece this last weekend.  That is what they want.  Complete control over a woman's body.  Have you noticed the ones screaming the most (Church leaders and congressmen) are old white men.
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline Chronos

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #4 on: February 14, 2012, 05:07:54 PM »
Using birth control should be construed as free speech, so why do some people actively have their First Amendment rights violated for others whose First Amendment rights are not infringed? There is zero inconsistency in requiring all health plans to offer the same, consistent coverage. If the members of the affected religion do not wish to partake of birth control, then nobody is forcing a pill down their throats.

This is also an obvious case showing the need for universal health care -- divorced from the employment process and consistent for all.

John 14:2 :: In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Offline Chronos

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #5 on: February 14, 2012, 05:10:13 PM »
My religion does not allow me to address any other human with a title. I can only address people by their first names. My religion also does not allow me to write down anything, so I can only file my taxes verbally.
John 14:2 :: In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Offline DavidQ

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #6 on: February 14, 2012, 05:14:29 PM »
It has always struck me that when laws and courts exempt religious institutions from rules and regulations governing everyone else that they are flying in the face of the First Amendment. When, for example, the city zoning board says that a church can disregard the established zoning for a particular area, then they are establishing a preference for religion. I'd think that religions would only be protected in a case where someone specifically seeks to keep out a church by establishing new zoning.

When the Supreme Court exempts churches from Fair Labor laws, then they are establishing a preference for religion.

And, I've wondered, if you have a situation where two constitutional liberties conflict with each other, which one trumps? :?

Offline Tero

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #7 on: February 14, 2012, 05:32:03 PM »
The last time Republicans cared about you, you were a fetus.

Offline jaimehlers

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #8 on: February 14, 2012, 05:32:26 PM »
Never attribute to malice what you can attribute to stupidity.

Chances are they aren't actually trying to give a religious exemption to any health care coverage provided under ACA, but they're in such a hurry to try to exempt birth control out of it that they didn't pay attention to how stupidly-worded it was.

Personally, though, anyone dumb enough to let that slip by mistake needs to be kicked out of Congress, preferably headfirst into a sewer ditch.  It might even improve their intelligence.

Offline Chronos

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #9 on: February 14, 2012, 07:57:22 PM »
Making laws (or regulations which are born from laws) that exempt religious institutions, effectively, is making laws regarding the establishment of religion.

It's rather simple.  This entire issue comes about because religious institutions offer health insurance plans to their employees. If these institutions didn't offer health plans, there would be no moral or legal dilemmas to resolve. I would like to know why the bishops don't get riled about the previous laws requiring this coverage, the Catholic institutions that voluntarily provide this coverage nor the other prescriptions or procedures that violate other moral issues within their religion. This was a purely political crap shoot by Catholic bishops.

John 14:2 :: In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Online ParkingPlaces

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #10 on: February 14, 2012, 09:22:23 PM »
Al Franken should introduce legislation that says you can't get health insurance unless you have a brain. We'll see how they like it when they are unfairly excluded from a program.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline mrbiscoop

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Offline Chronos

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2012, 05:52:34 AM »
 //  Topics merged, re-titled.  //

John 14:2 :: In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

Offline Historicity

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #13 on: February 15, 2012, 06:34:09 AM »
A Slate magazine article said insurers will be happy to provide contraception coverage; it's cheaper than abortion and much cheaper than childbirth.

Offline atheola

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #14 on: February 15, 2012, 09:29:33 AM »
Maybe every female able to have children ought to do so at once then dump several million orphans on these so called adoption providers and when they're suddenly overwhelmed with millions and millions of unwanted kids and stuck with all the child birth hospital bills...... Yeah, I know...a tad drastic, huh?
The problem then is they would pull a Newt and repeal every child labor law, anti-slavery law and all min wage law overnight under some fucked up appropriations bill.
« Last Edit: February 15, 2012, 09:35:12 AM by atheola »
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Offline DavidQ

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Grammar police
« Reply #15 on: February 15, 2012, 11:42:01 AM »
... so I can only file my taxes verbally.
:police: Verbally is using words, either spoken or in writing. I think orally more precisely means what you mean, but what do I know. :police:

Offline DavidQ

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #16 on: February 15, 2012, 11:46:22 AM »
A Slate magazine article said insurers will be happy to provide contraception coverage; it's cheaper than abortion and much cheaper than childbirth.

Money trumps all. That's why the Supreme Court's Citizens United gift to the Nation will do such wonderful things for our democracy.

Offline velkyn

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Re: Health care, religious beliefs, the Blunt Amendment
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2012, 11:52:52 AM »
I was thinking about this whole thing and it seems to make a great argument for universal healthcare provided by a neutral body, like, oh the government.   ;D  then no one would have to care about the health care decisions made by someone else offending them.
"There is no use in arguing with a man who can multiply anything by the square root of minus 1" - Pirates of Venus, ERB

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