snipped here and there for brevity
These most recent comments continue to project a ……demonstrated how theist efforts to promote an agenda were interfering with their life. I got limited answers and even the ones that were offered did not hold up under closer examination. They were unsubstantiated perceptions.)
You are correct, most theists are ignorant and ill-educated. There is nothing “dishonest” about how the ToE disproves your myths. It simply does. it does not mirror the actions of theist to have their religions forced on people because we have evidence that the ToE is an accurate and useful reflection of reality. No religion has proven that it is this. And which thread is this that you claiming you’ve asked for how theists efforts were interfering with an atheist’s life? I do want to see these supposed “limited answers”. Why? Because I know you misrepresent these things constantly.
I, and many others, are particularly concerned about the type of efforts being suggested in the OP to continue making their way into academia and I gave an example as to why these concerns arise. Here it is again, in case you missed it: http://www.evolutionnews.org/2008/08/inherit_the_spin_the_ncse_answ010631.html
Within this thread, I also provided links to websites that are reporting on some of the dishonesty and obfuscation coming out of the scientific community as respects the ToE.
I’m sure that many theists are concerned that their lies are not being accepted as the “TRUTH”. BS, you are a prime example of what the OP described
They don't understand evolution in the slightest degree, and when you tell them that, they just say that they do and then continue on saying things that prove that they have no clue about what you're talking about. Then when you tell them that they don't know what they are talking about, they get defensive, even if I'm being as respectful as possible.
The article you’ve linked to is the same. Creationists are constantly promising “any day now” that they will have scientific evidence that supports creationism, and they have yet to provide it. You have yet to provide that there is any reason to accept your creation myth or any other myth. They all fail to be shown as a valid and accurate depiction of reality. You have claimed that there are flaws in evolutionary theory, but when you are asked to demonstrate them, you ignore the question. That article is quite good since it shows the many ways that ignorant creationists try to attack something that they do not understand in the least. The usual attacking of superseded information (the Miller Urey experiment), the utter misrepresentation of the Cambrian explosion (no, “all major animal groups appear together in the fossil record fully formed” didn’t happen, and wells obviously knows nothing about the Cambrian or fossil formation or anything else he attacks. Nice to see how a man can have presuppositions just like poor BS complains about and lie and lie and lie.. Pity even Wells has no evidence for creationism even with him being a “scientist”. Gee, BS, do you follow the Unification Church too?), making claims that are simply untrue, like his claim that scientists claim that certain fossils are “ancestors” of archaeopteryx. AS usual, since creatonists have no evidence, they resort to lies.
In summary, my argument (in simplistic form) goes like this:
1.The ToE does not explain the origins of life nor does…..at I was incorrect and I believe I received more than one response conceding that these terms are still being used, both inside and outside of the scientific community.
Nice to see that like other creationists, BS, still finds it necessary to create strawmen, lie, etc. Cute attempt to invoke a conspiracy here too. The same events and mechanics of evoluition are present in both “macro” and “micro”. I have picked up “any” scholastic biology book and BS is wrong. Nice to also see that no matter the evidence, BS won’t chnge his mind. Gee, he’s just so interested in following the evidence where it leads
. The pervsion of micro and macro evolution by creationists is thoroughly documented. Biologists and paleontologists do not use microevolution as a way to avoid admitting evolutionary theory works like creationists do. I do like to see creationists use the word since it shows how far they’ve come in disavowing earlier creationists who would never have admitted that any type of evolution has occurred. As always, theists are always playing catchup to reality.
2.Abiogenesis as a means for explaining the origin of life is a hypothetical. To date, no scientific discovery has been made that explains how life arose from non-life. That is a fact.
No it’s not a fact. Many scientific discoveries have been made to show the possible sequence of how life could arise from non-life. For example, it has been discovered that phospholipids can form lipid bilayers, a basic component of cell membranes. There has been experiments that show that amino acids form in various environments, from ice to ocean vent “smokers” that are the basis for life. Peptides have been shown to form in models of early earth. Your claims depend on remaining ignorant of current science and all depend on a baseless claim that we haven’t found the evidence yet so we never will and “goddidit”.
3.The ToE is a falsifiable theory meaning it should NEVER be interpreted as a bulletproof explanation for evolution or any implication that it offers a reason for believing that abiogenesis occurred.
Every thing we have discovered and observed has supported the ToE. You have been told that it is not “just a theory”, http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-misconceptions.html
, and you have ignored that. You have not provide any other falsifiable alternative for either abiogensis or evolutionary theory.
4.Given 1 - 3 above, people (particularly young ones) deserve to know these truths and they also deserve a level and fair playing field that offers alternative scientific views being offered, such as IDT.
Ah, the delusion that all opinions have equal merit. Sorry, no, BS. You have no evidence for your claims and they are not “truths”. You can’t even show your god exists much less has done anything. Evolutionary theory has been proven to work, abiogenesis gains support every year. You have claimed that there is evidence for creationism/intelligent design and that it is scientific. We have a level and fair playing field called the scientific method. If your god and its actions are so evident, why can’t you produce any evidence.
Most people are hungry to discover the truth of humanity’s origins and how we have arrived where we are today. To be told that the science of the ToE and the future discovery of an abiogenesis event fully explains all of this is horribly dishonest. To further suggest that some effort is necessary to educate the ignorant masses of this un-truth is akin to the motives of a dictatorial empire.
And again, an attempt to claim that since we don’t accept your baseless claims, we are close minded. No, I simply demand the evidence you claim to have and I demand that it be examined by experts in the field for any flaws. The claims of creationists so far have *all* been found wanting. Until you provide any evidence to the contrary, the science that supports the ToE and abiogenesis *does* explain humanity’s origins. A myth about a mud man and a rib woman created by a god that is no more intelligent than a human, a myth about a god that came from a cosmic egg or a myth that a cow licked gods free from magical ice, are all equal in their ridiculousness and total lack of matching up with the evidence.
People do need to be educated with the facts and again the ToE is supported totally by those facts. You have yet to show that it isn’t, BS. People used to believe that some magical god was responsible for all illness in the world, its “wrath”. But we found that this was totally wrong. Now educated people know that humans can cure illness and we can avoid getting sick too, just by doing certain things, no god needed. It’s so funny to see you make such claims that educating people is “dictatorial”. Was it dictatorial to teach people that breathing during the evening wouldn’t make them sick? Was it dictatorial to teach people that eating bacteria tainted meat would make them sick? Your indignation only comes up when your religion’s claims are under scrutiny. What a hypocrite.
If the ToE is truly falsifiable, then you are constrained by logic to concede that there could be an alternate view that explains what you feel the ToE and any abiogenesis hypothical explains. …… admittedly incapable of presently offering an absolute truth…..and that is what people are looking for….a truth.
The ToE is falsifiable and does reflect reality e.g. the truth. Come on BS, you’ve been asked how many times to provide the evidence that it’s wrong and you fail to provide anything that can stand up to the scientific method that you claim to respect. Show how the ToE is wrong and your claims are a better explanation. I don’t have to concede that any of your baseless nonsense is a viable alternate view. People have been looking for alternatives for at least a hundred year and no surprise, they’ve not found one. The facts don’t care about curiosity or creativity. Hypotheses are formed from observations and depend on facts to support or disprove them. All of your claims have been disproven by the facts. No facts have been presented to support creationism/ID, only lies told by creationists. Why should we teach demonstrable lies, BS? To make you feel better?
Only educated people can make decisions based on facts. We still have ignorant people who kill children because they still believe in witches. Do you believe in witches, BS? Many Christians are intent on taking away those decisions by lying about evolution and abiogenesis like you do. You seem to think that you have some right to take away the chance to make a truly informed decision.
But I’ll tell you what, BS, if you really advocate teaching all sides, let me teach science in your church: biology, archeology, paleontology, geology, etc and let me teach about other religions. It’d be easier to get a church to let me in rather than working through the bureaucracy of a school district. Let me show every theist exactly how reality demonstrates that your religion is based on myths just like every other one and that your religion’s claims aren’t born out by evidence. Then everyone can make their own decision about religion and science. If your religion is some “truth” it should become very evident very quickly because you would show me your evidence for it compared with my evidence for the various scientific theories. This would be the first step in showing just how interested you are in really finding a truth. So, how about it? If I’m not close enough to teach, I’m sure someone on this form would be willing to.