Where do I find them?

[velkyn]

wow, we've got one theist who is ignorant of the subject he attacks and one that is so desperate for external validation that he has to pretend to be psychic. 

shame that nothing ever changes. 

[dloubet]

Grant - we're done. I don't correspond with folk who just insult.

Don't pull that crap with us. If we're willing to correspond with people who think we deserve to burn forever in a lake of fire, then you can put up with a few insults.

[bgb]

Seems to me that time and timed again theists don't have knowledge about reason, logic or the sciences.  All this discussion is over their heads.  Zoooooooooooooooooooooooom!

[truthfinder]

Logically we should think about vacuum universe (nothing at all) since there is no originator or creator,we should know
first the starter before thinking about the universe and evolution

If I said I didn't like jesus because he liked NASCAR and I don't, would that make any sense? I thought not. I'm making that up. You are making up science.

You are confusing your guesses about what science is saying with what science is actually saying. And you are responding to said guesses rather than actual research and discoveries. This is a common problem here on the site. Christians and other believers who either guess wildly about what we must have found or who memorize three or four common and equally ignorant theist rants on science (you haven't found the missing link so evolution must be false), which are equally wrong but more popular.

If you are unwilling to even read a one page wikipedia article on something before commenting smugly, this will not go well. I would in fact suggest that you limit your comments to stuff on which you have some actual knowledge. Or at least experience. Efforts to use incredibly wrong and wild-assed guesses to shed light on atheistic and scientific ignorance are doomed.

In other words, you'll sound much smarter if you say smart things.

i was very clear but it depends on how others will receive and analyze my comments.

you should realize first that i am talking about logic and not science,then we should also
know that evolution is a theory such as to say that we were evolved from chimpanzee,
thanks for the nature and evolution that they did manage to remove our tails and
improve our shapes,that was a good work really.

i dont claim that i am smart and i am not trying to be so,but as my nickname shows
that i am looking for the truth.

for me to understand evolution and the universe,i should start to think about the universe
as vacuum (nothing at all),i am not talking about god,that there should be god,but at least
i cant accept a theory to discuss evolution from vacuum,and even if there was a single atom,
then how it was created from nothing,please note that i am talking about logic here so you will
not think that i am making smart out of myself 

[velkyn]

[i was very clear but it depends on how others will receive and analyze my comments.

you should realize first that i am talking about logic and not science,then we should also know that evolution is a theory such as to say that we were evolved from chimpanzee, thanks for the nature and evolution that they did manage to remove our tails and improve our shapes,that was a good work really.

Wow and more pure willful ignorance about evolutionary theory.  No, we did not evolve from chimps. If you don't even take the time to learn about the science you attack, how can you even guess that it's somehow wrong?

i dont claim that i am smart and i am not trying to be so,but as my nickname shows that i am looking for the truth.

No, you are looking for something to agree with your mistaken beliefs. If you really were looking for any kind of truth, you'd not repeating such ignorant lies about evolution. 

for me to understand evolution and the universe,i should start to think about the universe as vacuum (nothing at all),i am not talking about god,that there should be god,but at least i cant accept a theory to discuss evolution from vacuum,and even if there was a single atom, then how it was created from nothing,please note that i am talking about logic here so you will not think that i am making smart out of myself 

A vacuum is not "nothing at all".  And you again try to conflate abiogenesis and the BBT with evolution.  Again, more evidence that you are not interested in learing anything at all.

I'm guessing that english is not your primary language but that doesn't excuse you from reading all of the science books in whatever language you are most fluent in. 

[monkeymind]

    i dont claim that i am smart and i am not trying to be so,but as my nickname shows that i am looking for the truth.

So have you read though any of the threads in the appropriate section of the forum?

Have you read the rules?

Have you learned anything at all about the difference between how things started and how spieces evolve?

[12 Monkeys]

Logically we should think about vacuum universe (nothing at all) since there is no originator or creator,we should know
first the starter before thinking about the universe and evolution

If I said I didn't like jesus because he liked NASCAR and I don't, would that make any sense? I thought not. I'm making that up. You are making up science.

You are confusing your guesses about what science is saying with what science is actually saying. And you are responding to said guesses rather than actual research and discoveries. This is a common problem here on the site. Christians and other believers who either guess wildly about what we must have found or who memorize three or four common and equally ignorant theist rants on science (you haven't found the missing link so evolution must be false), which are equally wrong but more popular.

If you are unwilling to even read a one page wikipedia article on something before commenting smugly, this will not go well. I would in fact suggest that you limit your comments to stuff on which you have some actual knowledge. Or at least experience. Efforts to use incredibly wrong and wild-assed guesses to shed light on atheistic and scientific ignorance are doomed.

In other words, you'll sound much smarter if you say smart things.

i was very clear but it depends on how others will receive and analyze my comments.

you should realize first that i am talking about logic and not science,then we should also
know that evolution is a theory such as to say that we were evolved from chimpanzee,
thanks for the nature and evolution that they did manage to remove our tails and
improve our shapes,that was a good work really.

i dont claim that i am smart and i am not trying to be so,but as my nickname shows
that i am looking for the truth.

for me to understand evolution and the universe,i should start to think about the universe
as vacuum (nothing at all),i am not talking about god,that there should be god,but at least
i cant accept a theory to discuss evolution from vacuum,and even if there was a single atom,
then how it was created from nothing,please note that i am talking about logic here so you will
not think that i am making smart out of myself 

a thought about monkeys and self awareness and that they may be on their own evolutionary chain to self awareness (more than they have now)and in a few million years may become more evovled than they are now.  Oh to hell with explaining here is a video to explain FOR me (warning video is GRAPHIC)

[truthfinder]

are we talking about theories of evolution and bing bang or it is absolute science,
because to my simple knowledge it is all about theories,but most of you are talking
about science.

Can evolutionists give us an answer how the bird would evolve a wing as so to  survive
better in their environment ,the birds adapt and change through million of years in order
to survive ,is that science, then cats should evolve also wings to better catch the birds

[One Above All]

truthfinder, since you apparently have poor reading skills, I am going to quote myself:

1: Stop using paragraphs in the middle of your sentences.
2: Learn proper grammar.
3: Learn about everything you want to discuss.
4: Learn about fallacies.
5: Come back.

[monkeymind]

Please create a thread in Evolution and Creationism section.

Please learn the rules of the forum.

[truthfinder]

Please create a thread in Evolution and Creationism section.

Please learn the rules of the forum.

i will, thank you for your advice

[nogodsforme]

Damn. I feel dumber having read through all that.

[velkyn]

are we talking about theories of evolution and bing bang or it is absolute science, because to my simple knowledge it is all about theories,but most of you are talking about science.

Can evolutionists give us an answer how the bird would evolve a wing as so to  survive better in their environment ,the birds adapt and change through million of years in order to survive ,is that science, then cats should evolve also wings to better catch the birds

same thing. The scientific method supports these theories.  The same science that you enjoy the benefits from is that which indicates that these theories are, if not completely correct, largely so.  And I can see, that no, you haven't a clue about evolutionary theory.  I would suggest actually learning about it, and not attacking something you haven't a clue about, only repeating the nonsense creationists claim.  Here's a good site: http://www.talkorigins.org/  Please ask for help if you need things explained. 

And yes they can show why birds have evolved wings:  http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/evolution/library/03/4/l_034_01.html

and cats can jump and climb which catches lots of birds, so no attributes that would lead to wings are being selected for.   Again, your ignorance shoots you in the foot.     

[Ambassador Pony]

i have a question?

QFT

[voodoo child]

  then cats should evolve also wings to better catch the birds

cats learned over time. that a bird has to get off the ground, cats can jump strait up, up to 10 feet in some domesticated species. of course there is my cat. very clumsy and usually trips or wipes out, then stalks easy prey, a mouse.

[magicmiles]

I'm going to pull the plug on this thread now  - simply too many posts for me to respond to. I have a good idea on what makes some of you tick, which was my intention. Thanks.

I'll still be active elsewhere on the site I hope.

[hickdive]

Thank you Sir Robin.

[voodoo child]

I have a good idea on what makes some of you tick, which was my intention. Thanks.

I do not think that you do.

[ParkingPlaces]

Truthfinder, you need to set some higher standards for yourself. Relying on what you call logic will get you nowhere. Unless you're already where you want to go. Go ahead and learn something. Study a few things. It should take you less than fifteen minutes to get explanations about the early universe that make the vacuum thing you love so much go away.

But it will take some effort on your part. That's logical. Right?

[grant]

Grant - we're done. I don't correspond with folk who just insult.

Don't pull that crap with us. If we're willing to correspond with people who think we deserve to burn forever in a lake of fire, then you can put up with a few insults.

Thank you dloubet.

The point I was trying to make when I said

Perhaps you should change to "hope", "wish", "believe" or "feel"

was that I don't believe that mm was actually applying any critical "thinking" when he states things like:

I thought Atheists are 100% adamant that God DOESN'T exist?
Personally I think people who passionately rail against God and swear blind he doesn't exist are much closer to finding God that those who aren't sure or just don't care

If those sort of findings are the resust of his "thinking" about them, rather than "feeling" (or even "understanding") for example, I pity his rationality.

The whole persona of mm is condescending, offensive and insulting. A dim witted smart arse who thinks he knows fuck everything, but really knows fuck all.

[ungod]

this is exhausting..i had no idea I'd get this level of discussion as a new member. I can't keep up...time out OK?

Translation: I came here to preach, not to debate!

[Azdgari]

Or, he really was overwhelmed by the volume of replies to keep up with.  Is that interpretation off-limits somehow?

[One Above All]

Or, he really was overwhelmed by the volume of replies to keep up with.  Is that interpretation off-limits somehow?

This. He made 59 posts in one single day. That's a lot of replies, if you're not used to it.

[velkyn]

I'm going to pull the plug on this thread now  - simply too many posts for me to respond to. I have a good idea on what makes some of you tick, which was my intention. Thanks.

I'll still be active elsewhere on the site I hope.

wow, it goes to show that your initial posts were just as much to be an asshole as I thought.  You have found you can't compete here and now lie, claiming that you just wanted to makes "some of us" tick.  What a good Christian that has no respect for your own god that hates lies and liars.  This is what makes me disbelieve the claim that there was too many responses to answer to.

If you are having trouble keeping up, request a one on one debate.  We've had many of them.  But I'm pretty sure you aren't interested in actual honest debate at all.

[ungod]

Or, he really was overwhelmed by the volume of replies to keep up with.  Is that interpretation off-limits somehow?

With the ALL-POWERFUL OMNIPOTENT on  your side, how could you be overwhelmed by anything?

 

[Azdgari]

Because...God Wills It^tm.  Or something.

Seriously, folks really can get overwhelmed on here when they're addressing a crowd.  MM's said plenty of questionable things that merit responses without people picking on him for being human.

[Mr. Blackwell]

Hey magic,

Sorry it took me so long to get back to you. Somehow I didn't even realize that you had addressed my comment. At any rate welcome to the forum, I hope you enjoy your stay.

Now, my first inclination is to interpret your response as "I feel compelled to strongly promote my belief that there is no absolute source of right and wrong ( the Christian God ) in order that my children don't get the wrong idea about what is right and wrong"

Is that a reasonable summary of what motivates you to promote atheism?

It is a reasonable summary, however it is not an accurate summary. I do from time to time defend atheism...or more specifically, atheists. But I don't promote atheism.

I didn't want to teach my kids that Santa was "real" because it just confuses them and is dishonest. Has nothing to do with an absolute source of right and wrong. Has nothing to do with God. My plan was to teach them the tradition of hanging stockings and santa clause and all that fun holiday stuff but from the understanding that it isn't "real" in the sense that some creepy fat man is judging their behavior all year.

As far as Gods go, I don't want to teach my kids that some all powerful entity is judging their behavior their whole life. It's just confusing and is dishonest. My plan is to teach them to respect themselves and treat others with respect. To try not to judge others and not worry too much about being judged by others.

[Turbo SS]

[you should realize first that i am talking about logic and not science,then we should also
know that evolution is a theory such as to say that we were evolved from chimpanzee,

Velkyn already called him out that we didnt evolve from chimps.  But this is the kind of stuff that bugs me.  Christians (not all, dont want to make assumptions its just a common theme) just jump to conclusions about what scientists believe in their respective fields without even reading even the basic information from them.  You would think something as important as the origin of universe would merit reading a little bit of reading about evolution, big bang etc than just relying on what they hear in casual conversations and what their preachers say science believes.  Get it from the horse's mouth and not rely wholly on others with agendas to tell you things.

[nogodsforme]

[you should realize first that i am talking about logic and not science,then we should also
know that evolution is a theory such as to say that we were evolved from chimpanzee,

Velkyn already called him out that we didnt evolve from chimps.  But this is the kind of stuff that bugs me.  Christians (not all, dont want to make assumptions its just a common theme) just jump to conclusions about what scientists believe in their respective fields without even reading even the basic information from them.  You would think something as important as the origin of universe would merit reading a little bit of reading about evolution, big bang etc than just relying on what they hear in casual conversations and what their preachers say science believes.  Get it from the horse's mouth and not rely wholly on others with agendas to tell you things.

But if they did that and were intellectually honest, they might find themselves on our side of the fence...