Are you saying that because of this:?
29) And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or wife or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.
Gee, do you think so since I *bolded* that verse?
Rather than ask a question that is this ridiculous, how about explaining why you think I’m wrong, OS? Tell me why this doesn’t mean what it says literally
Oh that's right...back in your Christian days.Is that what you mean?
Poor OS, still can’t show that he’s any better a Christian than I was when I was a Christian but has to try to cast doubt on the fact that I was. I’ve read the bible at least twice completely, once as a believer and once as not and probably more than that piece by piece. Have you read it, OS? Many Christians haven’t. But one would think they would since this is the only indication that their god even *might* have existed. Unfortunately, nothing else supports that conclusion.
That is about "the rich" don't you think?It only refers to them as written , anyway.What about Zacchaeus.He was rich .Why did he get a deal?
One of my favorite bible school songs. “Zacchaeus was a wee little man…”. Well, let’s look at the words again. Rather than post this again since it’s so long, I’ll just post a link so everyone can see it and read at their leisure: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%2019&version=NIV
We have a man who asks what good thing must he do to get eternal life. JC replies that he’s not the source of good, only the “One” is aka God. God has given the commandments and they should be followed. Are you arguing that no one else has to follow the commandments, OS? Many Christians want it to only be these commandments, literally mentioned by JC, though this doesn’t work so well since JC said that all of the commandments come down to “love your neighbor as yourself” and of course love god (Matthew 22), with the additional recommendation that one loves one’s enemies to be perfect as God is perfect (Matthew 5).
JC also says give up all you have, sell your possessions and give to the poor and you will have treasure in heaven. And he finishes “then, come follow me.” This is repeated as a thing to do by the apostles when they say that they have done exactly what JC said to do (chapter 19, verse 25). JC replies by telling them that they will indeed get the eternal life that the wealthy man was asking for. They did all of what he said to do so they get the reward he promised.
Earlier in Matthew JC also expounds on this idea of that worldly attachments are to be refused
Matthew 6:19 “Do not store up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moths and vermin destroy, and where thieves break in and steal. 20 But store up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where moths and vermin do not destroy, and where thieves do not break in and steal. 21 For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
and goes on to tell his followers to not worry about clothes or food, etc but that to trust in god to take care of them. We also have in Matthew that one should also not love one’s family more than JC.
Mathew 10: 37 “Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. 38 Whoever does not take up their cross and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds their life will lose it, and whoever loses their life for my sake will find it.
It tracks very well with the messages in the rest of the book e.g. the context. Leave your family and follow JC. He’s more important. The same message is repeated again and again and not only to the “rich”.
As for Zacchaeus, he’s mentioned in Luke (chapter 19, one of my favorites with that great parable of the minas) . And yes he does get a deal, a tax collector that says he’ll give *half* of his belongings and if he’s cheated someone, will pay them back 4 times the amount. JC says he’s saved! It is a strange thing, that just in the chapter preceding, JC doesn’t think this is enough: http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Luke%2018&version=NIV
I’ll have to thank you, OS, for showing one more contradiction in your bible. Was JC lying before or now to Zacchaeus?
This seems to be specific to the "12".
well, golly, this part is.
And the next?
He didn't get your memo I guess. A spare shirt sound like they already ...have a shirt . According to you that should have been sold, right? Everything , correct.?
I love it, OS. You now want to create a strawman, how cute. Ooooh, they have a shirt, and this means that they didn’t sell *everything*, so JC didn’t mean it really and for true.
Oh noes, we’ll have nekkid apostles! Your JC isn’t quite so silly as you or as you’d try to claim I was.
Considering how much your god needs people covered up, yep, we need those shirts. We have these verses that say that *everyone* who leaves their family, their livelihood and their homes will benefit, just like the disciples who have done exactly that, they will get the gift of eternal life, just like the wealthy man was asking for. So, to get eternal life, have you given up your family, your livelihood and your home, OS?
You can't "trust" and have a checking account?Insurances might be mandated.
So then, do you think Paul showed a lack of Faith because he continued at times to work as a tentmaker? Somebody, somewhere was working or had money to support ministry.To think otherwise seems to be ludicrous according to my limited Scripture reading.
This is even better! Now you seem to be hiding behind the gov’t in that oh,it’s not my fault I don’t trust my god, it’s the gov’t forcing me.
And I would say, yep, you can’t have a checking account, or a savings account or insurance per your supposed savior. He says have faith that god will take care of you no matter what, do not put up treasures on earth for they get between you and this faith, etc.
And yep, I do find Paul pretty amusing for his ignoring of this supposed savior. Per JC, he should have never had to have worked while spreading the “good news”. But he was certainly stuck. JC was preaching for an immanent return of God and that never happened. Paul had to revamp a religion to excuse this failure. We have these post-JC Christians so concerned about money that people are killed for keeping some back for themselves (Acts 5). In the “gospels” no one needed to support the ministry at least that’s what they’d have you think. They went out with nothing, no money, not a bag for traveling, etc (oh yes, except their shirts and belts – Matthew 10
) and trusted god to provide. What’s amusing about this is that in Luke 8, to free the men from having to sully themselves with earning a wage, they had to depend on women to support them. Lovely bit of hypocrisy there. Sounds like some hippie communes I’ve read about.
I’m sure it does seem ludicrous to your indeed “limited Scripture reading”.
Really a lot of em want to claim that? You'd be surprised at what I've heard people claim lately...oy vay!!
that’s the excuse to have bank accounts, insurance, a nice car, 401K plans, etc. Seems that you’re using it too. It comes down to the “god wants me to have…” excuse, where unsurprisingly god agrees with the human’s desires. And yep, people make lots of baseless claims. I see many of them on this forum. And I see the claimants unable to support their nonsense. Like you.
I don't understand the " holding sins" thing but basically ...no I don't agree.
Oh, OS, I love how you fixate on one word as if it will save you. Your bible does say that your JC was the receptacle for all of humanity’s sins (e.g. took on everyone’s sins) so we could be redeemed, yes? And of course you don’t think it’s hyperliteral to claim that magic happened with no evidence as long as it’s a part that you want to believe really happened. You, like all Christians, create your own religions by deciding what is literal and what is metaphor according to your own opinions. Of course, all of you claim that what you say is what this god “really” meant, but never have any evidence of this.
All differing? Where are all Christians differing? Did you point that universal out in the post somewhere?Every commentary I looked at differs with you but agrees with each other.
Yes, OS, all differing in what they claim that the bible “really” says and what their god “really” wants. Ah, the usual desperate attempts to delay the inevitable. You really should read more and not solely depend on your willful ignorance. It fails every time. We have Christians who are sure that the creation myth is just a metaphor and some who think it is literal. We have Christians who think the flood myth is just a metaphor and some who think it is literal. We have Christians who think that God will save everyone eventually, Christians who think there is a literal fiery hell, Christians who think hell is only a “separation” from this god, etc. We have Christians who are sure only certain people will be saved and only if you do things a certain way per their sect. We have Christians who believe that only grace will work and Christians who think that any good person is perfectly fine with this god.
Now, I’m pretty sure that this will simply end up in you claiming that those people who disagree with you aren’t TrueChristianstm
. And I’ll have to ask you again, please do show me how I can tell you are this TrueChristiantm
and again how you can show that you were any different then me when I was a Christian. Oh and evidence that your god exists at all please.