Author Topic: Key Point [#2633]  (Read 1051 times)

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Offline pianodwarf

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Key Point [#2633]
« on: December 14, 2011, 06:23:15 AM »
It’s true. God does not heal amputees. And yes, most Christians make a fool of their religion because of what they believe concerning prayer and healing. But this does not disprove the existence of God.
“Only in a world where faith is difficult, can faith exist.”
 
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.
 
Respectfully,
[name removed]
[On how kangaroos could have gotten back to Australia after the flood]:  Don't kangaroos skip along the surface of the water? --Kenn

Offline One Above All

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2011, 06:24:57 AM »
So absence of evidence is evidence of existence? I think you have that backwards.
The truth is absolute. Life forms are specks of specks (...) of specks of dust in the universe.
Why settle for normal, when you can be so much more? Why settle for something, when you can have everything?
We choose our own gods.

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Offline plethora

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2011, 06:59:00 AM »
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.

"Faith" is something people use as an excuse to justify believing in something without evidence. Funny how they only apply it to their particular brand of god.

How about I suggest you have blind faith in Allah or Kirshna or Ganesha? They each have their holy books and millions of believers.

I bet you "taking it on faith" doesn't fly with you when it comes to gods other than your own does it? So why the hell should I take yours on "faith"?
The truth doesn't give a shit about our feelings.

Offline free

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2011, 07:13:38 AM »
It’s true. God does not heal amputees. And yes, most Christians make a fool of their religion because of what they believe concerning prayer and healing. But this does not disprove the existence of God.
“Only in a world where faith is difficult, can faith exist.”
 
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.
 
Respectfully,
[name removed]

We are aware of what faith is.  We just believe that faith is not something to praise, but rather a technique the founders of religion used to control people and force belief in their system.  We also believe it is used today to control the religious masses.  I'll quote from Freethought Today, FFRF's periodical. "Fundamentalist religion made [the unbalance of wealth] possible.  Evangelical fundamentalism helped empower the top 1 percent....Why? Because without the fundamentalists and their "values" issues, many in the lower 99 percet could not have been convinced to vote against their (our) economic self interest"

There is a perfect example of the powerful using faith to get the weak many to do what the powerful want.  Republican Party: Your religion says no to abortion, vote for me! Oh and by the way, I'm going to totally screw you lower and middle class people by decreasing unemployment benefits and tax provisions for you.  But GOD is on our side right guys?

Offline Add Homonym

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2011, 07:34:28 AM »

God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 

Incorrect. If amputees spontaneously healed, we would think nothing of it. It's only because they don't, that we use it as proof against a god that heals. It's fairly obvious anyway that god does not heal people.

You misunderstand faith. It should not be so hard to believe in god. The point of Christianity is not to be so obscure that you are always in doubt. The point is to inherit the spirit of Jesus, and be saved by the sterling message in the NT. You should have faith to follow Jesus, and give away all your money, for the end is nigh. But you don't have any faith at all, really, do you?

Your assertion that faith is like so, is tantamount to admitting that you are in doubt about the existence of god, yet you seem to be an apologist for a god that doesn't do anything identifiable, which is against the specifications of the Christian God.

Humans, in general, don't waste any opportunity to be unfathomably stupid - Dr Cynical.

Offline pianodwarf

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2011, 07:44:39 AM »
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith.

Nope.  The bible is absolutely crammed, practically to the point of bursting at the seams, with instances of people interacting with Yahweh directly.  They were shown, with certainty, that he existed, no faith required -- right from the very beginning with Adam and Eve.  Thomas was even given explicit proof when he expressed doubt.  So if them, why not us?

Quote
Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.

We understand perfectly what faith is.  Faith is believing something without having any evidence or reason to think that it's true.  (Believers don't like that definition, of course, but it's accurate.)
[On how kangaroos could have gotten back to Australia after the flood]:  Don't kangaroos skip along the surface of the water? --Kenn

Offline rev45

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2011, 07:48:57 AM »
Amazing how millions of people today see evidence of their god when they proclaim to see a miracle.  How does that not scream "I EXIST" to those people?  And why did the Christian god decide to show himself so much to people in the Bible and yet refuses to today?  Hell he even showed Moses his ass.  Why won't god give me a cosmic mooning?
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Offline Nick

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2011, 07:50:55 AM »
Hey, Denver has won 6 games in a row with God Boy Tebow.  What more evidence do you need for a God? ;)
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline Anfauglir

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2011, 08:43:22 AM »
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.

Hmm.  So evidence that god exists is in fact evidence that he does NOT exist, since god would not provide evidence of his own existence?  Okay.  So.....

The Bible is evidence that there is no god.
When a Christian says "the evidence is all around me" they are denying their god.
Moses, Noah, Adam, and Job (to name but four) were all hallucinating, since your god would NEVER be so crass as to present himself to his creation.
Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid.
Why is it so hard for believers to answer a direct question?

Offline Hatter23

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2011, 11:18:38 AM »
The point of having faith the your shoes fly around when you are asleep and no recording devices are present is that it is difficult to believe that your shoes fly around when you are asleep. If they did so when you could record them flying....It would miss the point of faith.


An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Offline velkyn

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2011, 11:23:10 AM »
It’s true. God does not heal amputees. And yes, most Christians make a fool of their religion because of what they believe concerning prayer and healing. But this does not disprove the existence of God.
“Only in a world where faith is difficult, can faith exist.”
 
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.
 
Respectfully,
[name removed]
wow, then why did god have miracles done in the bible? Why did JC say that to believe in him/god that one should beleive in the miracles he was doing for that exact purpose.

Nice excuse by a Christian who realizes that god does no miracles and has to excuse that, and who is utterly ignorant of their own bible.
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Offline Hatter23

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2011, 11:53:07 AM »
It’s true. God does not heal amputees. And yes, most Christians make a fool of their religion because of what they believe concerning prayer and healing. But this does not disprove the existence of God.
“Only in a world where faith is difficult, can faith exist.”
 
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.
 
Respectfully,
[name removed]
wow, then why did god have miracles done in the bible? Why did JC say that to believe in him/god that one should beleive in the miracles he was doing for that exact purpose.

Nice excuse by a Christian who realizes that god does no miracles and has to excuse that, and who is utterly ignorant of their own bible.

Yes I always notice that those that argue the miracles cannot happen because it would damage faith follow a book full of miracle some of which were done, expressely, in order to bolster belief.

How they cannot notice the utter disconnect is beyond me.
An Omnipowerful God needed to sacrifice himself to himself (but only for a long weekend) in order to avert his own wrath against his own creations who he made in a manner knowing that they weren't going to live up to his standards.

And you should feel guilty for this. Give me money.

Online Nam

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2011, 12:06:32 PM »
I understand faith.  It's the absence of evidence.  It's believing in something based on untruth; or a truth that only holds to one person -- which doesn't make it a truth but to them.

-Nam
This thread is about lab-grown dicks, not some mincy, old, British poof of an actor. 

Let's get back on topic, please.


Offline screwtape

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #13 on: December 14, 2011, 12:08:13 PM »
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.

Why does god want this?  Why does he want us to not use our brains?
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Offline Ivellios

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #14 on: December 14, 2011, 01:03:18 PM »
So comes the parable of Talents.

If you use your talents (and increase them) God will reward you. If you squander or neglect your talents God will burn you. If there is a God, that God gave me at least one talent and that is using my brain. Also wisdom comes from experience.

"Don't believe everything you hear/read."
"If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is."

Have you ever heard of scam artists or snake oil salesmen? They love people of Faith. A synonym of Faith is Gullible. If you empty your bank account and donate it to TS Ministries, God will reward you ten-fold! Just listen to these paid actors' "testimoneys!"

"I was living paycheck to paycheck, I had no idea how I would make it if I even missed an hour of work. I heard TS's request to aid his ministries. I withdrew every penny we had, and taking my next paycheck, I mailed them to TS. My wife was so mad. She almost left me over it. Three days and three nights later I won the $85 Million Lottery. God certainly rewarded my faith." Jimbo - Arkansas
« Last Edit: December 14, 2011, 01:08:44 PM by TruthSeeker »

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2011, 05:26:56 PM »
Why does your "real" god have the same requirements as all the "false" ones. Faith.  How can one differentiate the faith some have in said "real" god and all the "false" faith others have in their gods? 

Not to mention the variation in beliefs in your one god. Lutherans, snake handlers, quakers, mormons. What is your god doing wrong as he does nothing to cause all the mistakes made by presumably earnest people who want to be righteous?

Loving? I don't think so.
Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.

Offline Astreja

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2011, 01:30:14 AM »
Hey, Denver has won 6 games in a row with God Boy Tebow.  What more evidence do you need for a God? ;)

I don't like Tebow.  I think Denver should lose their next game.  ;D
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Offline Samothec

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2011, 03:18:12 AM »
It’s true. God does not heal amputees. And yes, most Christians make a fool of their religion because of what they believe concerning prayer and healing. But this does not disprove the existence of God.
“Only in a world where faith is difficult, can faith exist.”
 
God healing amputees is equal to God writing in the sky – I EXIST! BELIEVE IN ME!
 
This is not how God wants us to trust in Him by Faith. Your website misunderstands the concept of faith.
 
Respectfully,
[name removed]

So you seem to be saying your god will NEVER answer any prayer that asks for results that could show that your god exists. Correct?
Faith must trample under foot all reason, sense, and understanding. - Martin Luther

Offline Historicity

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2011, 06:36:15 AM »
Not to mention the variation in beliefs in your one god. Lutherans, snake handlers, quakers, mormons. What is your god doing wrong as he does nothing to cause all the mistakes made by presumably earnest people who want to be righteous?

You forgot my favorite example:  The Thirty Years War.  It was the last Crusade.  There had been a number of internal crusades in Europe: Against the Lithuanians, the Albigenses and the Norman Conquest was authorized as a Crusade.  Yes, the Pope authorized that any Norman who died killing the Anglo-Saxons went straight to Heaven and the English went to Hell.  All of these were successful but the crusade against the Lutherans (1618 to 1648) was a failure.  It ended with the borders in about the same places. 1/3 of Germany dead, the Lutheran Church authorizing polygamy, France (run largely by a cardinal!) choosing nationalism over religion when it joined the Lutheran side and the foundation of the Krupp weapons firm.  God[1] didn't send a sign that He was on either side. 
 1. Hypothetical

Online wright

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #19 on: December 16, 2011, 04:14:11 PM »
You forgot my favorite example:  The Thirty Years War.  It was the last Crusade.  There had been a number of internal crusades in Europe: Against the Lithuanians, the Albigenses and the Norman Conquest was authorized as a Crusade.  Yes, the Pope authorized that any Norman who died killing the Anglo-Saxons went straight to Heaven and the English went to Hell.  All of these were successful but the crusade against the Lutherans (1618 to 1648) was a failure.  It ended with the borders in about the same places. 1/3 of Germany dead, the Lutheran Church authorizing polygamy, France (run largely by a cardinal!) choosing nationalism over religion when it joined the Lutheran side and the foundation of the Krupp weapons firm.  God[1] didn't send a sign that He was on either side. 
 1. Hypothetical

It's exactly this kind of sh*t that I want to scream at people (especially in the US) who insist that secularism is a horrible thing in civilization. Holy Bastet, it makes the civil (literally) society they enjoy possible! Without it, we'd be back to sectarian violence on a level that would make those meatheads soil themselves, if they had the imagination.

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Offline Historicity

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #20 on: December 16, 2011, 06:25:17 PM »
Thank you, Wright.  I wrote another point but I deleted it for clarity.

The War of Religion, which should be known as the Failed Wars of Religion, were an impetus to the subsequent Enlightenment.

As TIME-Life's Great Ages of Man volume The Reformation concludes the introduction, "The purpose of the Reformation was to spiritualize man.  Instead, it secularized him."

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Re: Key Point [#2633]
« Reply #21 on: December 16, 2011, 10:36:12 PM »
The variation in religion, especially Christianity, demonstrates both that made up stuff is very customizable and that individuals and groups use it mostly to help them pretend that the world is indeed exactly the way they hope it is.  The world stays the same, but it gets a lot of very differing interpretations. 

And of course some sort of love from on high is needed, because these folks have otherwise made existence down here close to unbearable.

All of this would be fascinating, except for the part that many people suffer and even die to keep the various charades going. That's sick.

Not everyone is entitled to their own opinion. They're all entitled to mine though.