One logical reason god might not heal amputees

[One Above All]

He doesn't heal amputees right now because it would be a very powerful prove of his existence, and he wants us to have faith on him, in the Bible it says Jesus healed an amputee.

So you need to believe before you actually have evidence to believe. Your god must really hate rationality

God bless you all, I will pray for you really hard, and try to explain the best I can why you are mistaken, hopefully you will understand the TRUTH.

IE: You're all fucking retarded and I will cast a magic spell to make you see "da truth"

[Zankuu]

He doesn't heal amputees right now because it would be a very powerful prove of his existence, and he wants us to have faith on him, in the Bible it says Jesus healed an amputee.

Can you tell me, in your own words, why you place such a high value on faith? If this isn't a drive by post, I would be more than happy to explain to you why faith is disgusting and harmful.

[pianodwarf]

He doesn't heal amputees right now because it would be a very powerful prove of his existence, and he wants us to have faith on him

Why is it so important to Yahweh that we believe in his existence without having any evidence of it?  What's so bad about having proof?

[Revival]

I forgive you Blaziken_rjcf for your ignorance and agressivity, it only proves how hurt you are...

Is not racionality what he dont like, is materialism. This world have been delivered to Satan, so, the more you feel confortable in this world, the more you will be away from God. By having faith without seeing, you start your way back to the Father, and I think you really need him.

Zankuu, I'm not here to listen to atheists giving "reasons" why god doesn't exist, that would be a waste of time, for I can prove you dont exist too, from certain point of view, for example: if you dont think you have a soul, and you haven't really done anything that would change the world, you are merelly atoms and particles organized on certain form, which is not meant to last too much... your existence is not more significant in the universe than the existence of a stone, according to your point of view.

From my point of view, you are just a lonely sheep who needs to understand the truth and return to your rightful place, so: I'm here to answer any doubt people might have in hopes to help them understand the truth; I will pray for you too Zankuu... for I believe you should experience the blessing of God.

[Zankuu]

Zankuu, I'm not here to listen to atheists giving "reasons" why god doesn't exist, that would be a waste of time, for I can prove you dont exist too, from certain point of view, for example: if you dont think you have a soul, and you haven't really done anything that would change the world, you are merelly atoms and particles organized on certain form, which is not meant to last too much... your existence is not more significant in the universe than the existence of a stone, according to your point of view.

From my point of view, you are just a lonely sheep who needs to understand the truth and return to your rightful place, so: I'm here to answer any doubt people might have in hopes to help them understand the truth; I will pray for you too Zankuu... for I believe you should experience the blessing of God.

Oh, so you aren't here for a civilized debate or discussion about your god, you just want to preach or troll us. No one is going to waste their time with you.

[One Above All]

I forgive you Blaziken_rjcf for your ignorance and agressivity, it only proves how hurt you are...

Nope, just pissed off that you called me an idiot. Twice.

Is not racionality what he dont like, is materialism. This world have been delivered to Satan, so, the more you feel confortable in this world, the more you will be away from God. By having faith without seeing, you start your way back to the Father, and I think you really need him.

So I need to be in pain like patients who refuse treatment because of religion or have diseases which cause a lot of pain or are receiving treatments which result in pain? That sounds like masochism, and that's one of the things I'm not into

[Revival]

Zankuu: I dont want to enter into a debate because my religion is not about that, instead, you could try to point your arguments as questions so I can reply, and you can get your debate.

Blaziken_rjcf: I didn't meant anything I said as an insult, please dont take it like that. If my posts offend you, maybe you shouldn't read them, there is no point in reading something that is not good for you.

God is not about pain exactly, it's about "ignoring" the pain and understanding what is vanity / useless and what's important, so, maybe you should ask yourself: what's important?

[One Above All]

Blaziken_rjcf: I didn't meant anything I said as an insult, please dont take it like that. If my posts offend you, maybe you shouldn't read them, there is no point in reading something that is not good for you.

Or maybe you should stop offending people. And yes, you did mean it as an insult. Saying that my "aggressiveness" shows my "ignorance" is insulting. You should read the Bible sometime, pretty sure "Don't lie" is in there somewhere

God is not about pain exactly, it's about "ignoring" the pain and understanding what is vanity / useless and what's important, so, maybe you should ask yourself: what's important?

You just said your god created this planet, not for us to feel good here, but for us to feel uncomfortable here. That sounds like "God wants suffering"
And I have asked myself what's important a long time ago

[jetson]

I forgive you Blaziken_rjcf for your ignorance and agressivity, it only proves how hurt you are...

Is not racionality what he dont like, is materialism. This world have been delivered to Satan, so, the more you feel confortable in this world, the more you will be away from God. By having faith without seeing, you start your way back to the Father, and I think you really need him.

Zankuu, I'm not here to listen to atheists giving "reasons" why god doesn't exist, that would be a waste of time, for I can prove you dont exist too, from certain point of view, for example: if you dont think you have a soul, and you haven't really done anything that would change the world, you are merelly atoms and particles organized on certain form, which is not meant to last too much... your existence is not more significant in the universe than the existence of a stone, according to your point of view.

From my point of view, you are just a lonely sheep who needs to understand the truth and return to your rightful place, so: I'm here to answer any doubt people might have in hopes to help them understand the truth; I will pray for you too Zankuu... for I believe you should experience the blessing of God.

Revival,

When you registered on this forum, you agreed to abide by the forum rules.  There is no preaching allowed on this forum, so I suggest you either stop preaching, or find another forum where preaching is allowed.  We welcome all members on this forum, but we do not tolerate ignorance of the rules.

Jetson

[Alzael]

I forgive you Blaziken_rjcf for your ignorance and agressivity, it only proves how hurt you are...

......this is going to be one of those conversations isn't it.

Is not racionality what he dont like, is materialism.

Then why is everything about him and his faith irrational? Why does he go out of his way in the bible to keep humans as stupid as possible. Even punishing them when they try to improve themselves?

By having faith without seeing, you start your way back to the Father, and I think you really need him.

So you admit that by following god you are required to give up your rationality. That seems in direct contradiction to what I previously quoted from you.

From my point of view, you are just a lonely sheep who needs to understand the truth and return to your rightful place, so: I'm here to answer any doubt people might have in hopes to help them understand the truth; I will pray for you too Zankuu... for I believe you should experience the blessing of God.

Just to be clear. From our point of view you're an arrogant, preaching prat who is already violating the rules of this forum that he agreed to when he first signed up here. You've already declared that you aren't going to engage in any sort of honest conversation, so you're also dishonest and a waste of our time.

So far your behaviour is rather disgraceful for what a christians should be, don't you think? Hardly the way to spread your word to anyone.

[Avatar Of Belial]

I forgive you Blaziken_rjcf for your ignorance and agressivity, it only proves how hurt you are...

What a high opinion you have of yourself. Ignorance is the only thing you have offered so far. You actively state that you don't want a discussion, so why have you come? We value knowledge, logic, rationality, and proof. Materialism has nothing to do with proof, or rationality, or logic, or knowledge. Do you even understand these concepts or are you just copying what someone else told you?

For that matter, are you really so stupid to think we haven't heard about your religion before? That we haven't read your bible and studied your traditions? Do you honestly believe that we have never spoken with Christians about their beliefs? Do you actually think "Blind Faith" is going to convince us? You said your god doesn't hate rationality, but you certainly do, and your own pride (something I'm quite sure your religion warns against) does you in before you even begin. You are already a proven hypocrite and liar. Plus, such willful ignorance can only be labeled evil.

The facts are simple; your God has done nothing, because he doesn't exist. Unless you can actually prove otherwise, you're being purposefully dense. But don't worry, I'll chant my magic ritual to the one true god, THE FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER so you can be cured of this lunacy. [/sarcasm]

Also, this is hilarious:

for I can prove you dont exist too, from certain point of view, for example: if you dont think you have a soul, and you haven't really done anything that would change the world, you are merelly atoms and particles organized on certain form, which is not meant to last too much... your existence is not more significant in the universe than the existence of a stone, according to your point of view.

First off, you have once again shown your ignorance about our "point of view". Second off, assume that we did have that world view for a second- that means we don't think you have a soul either, meaning that you're just a bunch of atoms and particles organized on a certain form. Therefore, from this retarded point of view you seem to think we have, you don't exist either, and we can safely dismiss anything you have to say!

Fun, isn't it? Here's a hint: Don't tell us what we think. We know what we think. We're the ones who have been thinking it, you haven't. So now that that is out of the way you have two options. First Option: Actually prepare for some rational discussion with proof and logic ready, a willingness to learn, and enough sense to shut up when your blathering lunacy isn't going to contribute to the discussion. Second Option: Leave. We aren't going to listen to another lunatic preacher. We get enough of those on city corners proclaiming the end of the world and you sound just as bat-shit insane as that lot.

Really, is rational discourse too much to ask?
And before you reply, know that whining about anyone being "aggressive" just gets people to look down on you as another child. Grow up and get some logic skills in you, kid. We aren't here to babysit you.

[Revival]

Moderators: Should I leave? I'm not sure of what exactly you are asking me, if you are asking me to debate God's existence, that would be an insult to my believes, if you are asking me to stop inviting people to change and believe in God, that goes against my believes too. I would suggest you, to check the rules, for I consider some of them are against freedom of religion and freedom itself, this would only cause that true christians never visit this forum, at least that's the eay I see it. Personally I would ratther die than giving up to my believes or falling in non productive discussion that would offend my Father.

Blaziken_rjcf: So, what do you think it's important? also, it's not God's fault that this world is so full of misery and pain, it's our fault.

Alzael: I'm a girl, as an administrator I think you should show some respect to people in the forum, specially to girls, even wondered why you feel forced to "attack"? about your arguments against the Bible, please take into consideration it was written by men, and twisted by the devil.

[One Above All]

Blaziken_rjcf: So, what do you think it's important?

That's the kind of stuff I keep to myself

also, it's not God's fault that this world is so full of misery and pain, it's our fault.

You just said that's what he wanted. You are making no sense, I suggest you take a step back (WAY back) and rethink your position

[Revival]

hahaha, your post is pretty funny Avatar Of Belial...!

Let me know when you have some questions about God so we can discuss like human beings, I think your post just proves atheists as non racional people.

Blaziken_rjcf: God created the world, people turned into what it is because God gave us freedom of choice, I hope is more clear now, if not, let me know so I can explain it again as many times as you need it.

[pianodwarf]

Moderators: Should I leave?

You're a believer, obviously.  To be honest, I'm hoping you'll stay because one of the biggest gripes that we "regulars" have here is that we don't get enough believers here.  But I want you to stay only if you're willing to abide by the rules.  If you can't or won't, then yes, you should leave.

I'm not sure of what exactly you are asking me

As the forum rules say, the forums are not for simply advertising your opinions.  You are expected to make an effort to back up any claims you make, which brings me to this:

if you are asking me to debate God's existence, that would be an insult to my believes

If you do claim that God exists, then yes, backing up your claim -- i.e., debating the matter -- is exactly what we expect you to do; the forum rules require it.  If you're not willing to defend your claims or be challenged about them, then WWGHA is not the place for you.

if you are asking me to stop inviting people to change and believe in God, that goes against my believes too.

You are perfectly free to try to persuade people here to accept your religious beliefs.  But that means giving them reasons to think they're true, not just proclaiming them.

I would suggest you, to check the rules, for I consider some of them are against freedom of religion and freedom itself

Hard cheese.  If you want to trumpet your religious beliefs without being challenged on them or expected to defend them or anything like that, then this simply isn't the place for you.  It's not an infringement on your freedom in any way.  You are free to either obey the forum rules or find another forum more to your liking.  No one is restricting your freedoms in any way, shape, or form whatsoever.

[Revival]

Well, it's a problem... I guess I'll stay until I see some resolution, I might leave sooner if I find people in here is not really open to God. I think this rule is one of the reasons you dont have much christians in this forum, I guess mostly people with little information on God would come here to be devorated by atheists, I dont think that's what you want... young ignorant believers.

So, it's a weird rule: How can I back up God's existence in every post? I dont even want to do it even if I could, because it's against God's will. And about backing up anything else, I could post some versicles, but I dont see you for example backing up what you just said, or anyone else who have replied to my posts. I would say it's unfare, with all respect.

Just let me know (administrator) and I'll leave you all alone, no need to bann me.

[Alzael]

Alzael: I'm a girl, as an administrator I think you should show some respect to people in the forum, specially to girls, even wondered why you feel forced to "attack"? about your arguments against the Bible, please take into consideration it was written by men, and twisted by the devil.

1.I support women's lib, so no I don't have to show you any extra respect for being a girl.

2.Being a girl does not excuse you for your being dishonest, or for breaking the rules. Or for being rude and wasting everyones time with your inanity.

3.How do you know it was twiste by the devil?

4.Even if it was, then that means that anything it says is unreliable, so how do you know anything is true. For all you know your current set of beliefs come from Satan.

5.Try to say something of substance, please.

[Revival]

Basically, you dont need to read the Bible to know what it's all about, because you have a notion of what's good and what's not. That's why you shouldn't care about what have been twisted and what have not, you will notice it yourself without much problem, for example:

- Job's suffering...?
- Jesus preaches...?
- Kill everyone...?
- You shall not kill...?

What do you think have been introduced by twisted men, satan, fake christians?

What do you think is pure and good?

If you read about Jesus, you could become fascinated by his words... some of that could just be something you would like to try, even being an atheist... now, for regular people is very hard to change, God helps people to change, you might have heard some stories, like a thief or a murderer... people in the street with any kind of bad habits that change when meet God, so... you might get interested in God once you start reading. From that point, you can do some researches on internet and find some information about what have been faked in the Bible, just know you cannot stop there, the best tool is to trust your judgement, because the good is inside you.

[hypagoga]

Let me know when you have some questions about God

Is your god omnipotent?

[jetson]

Moderators: Should I leave? I'm not sure of what exactly you are asking me, if you are asking me to debate God's existence, that would be an insult to my believes, if you are asking me to stop inviting people to change and believe in God, that goes against my believes too. I would suggest you, to check the rules, for I consider some of them are against freedom of religion and freedom itself, this would only cause that true christians never visit this forum, at least that's the eay I see it. Personally I would ratther die than giving up to my believes or falling in non productive discussion that would offend my Father.

If you cannot follow the forum rules, then you should not stay here.  If you truly want to engage in discussion about why the god of the Bible does not heal amputees, then you are free to stay, as long as you follow the rules.

Blaziken_rjcf: So, what do you think it's important? also, it's not God's fault that this world is so full of misery and pain, it's our fault.

See the part I bolded?  Where did you get the idea that we are to blame for misery and pain?  And how would you back up that claim without using the Bible, or your personal religious beliefs?

Alzael: I'm a girl, as an administrator I think you should show some respect to people in the forum, specially to girls, even wondered why you feel forced to "attack"? about your arguments against the Bible, please take into consideration it was written by men, and twisted by the devil.

See the part I bolded?  That is unsubstantiated.  It is you, using your personal beliefs, to make a claim about something that your religion invented.  Can you show us that there is a devil?  What does it look like, and how do you know what it looks like?  What gender is the devil, and how do you know?  Where can we find this devil, so that we can know it is actually real?  If I told you I had a real alien spaceship in my garage, would you want to see it, or would you just believe me? 

Or do you just plan on continuing to say there is a devil, because that's what you believe based on your understanding of your religion, or your god?

[Revival]

Well, I dont know if he is omnipotent... by looking at the latest cientific discoveries and the ways he act in the Bible, I think he have a particular way of acting, pretty different of the idea of an omnipotent being, which is, by the way, an impossible term.

[hypagoga]

Well, I dont know if he is omnipotent... by looking at the latest cientific discoveries and the ways he act in the Bible, I think he have a particular way of acting, pretty different of the idea of an omnipotent being, which is, by the way, an impossible term.

You don't know if he's omnipotent, but it's an impossible term? And how does he act that is different from an omnipotent being?

[Revival]

Blaziken_rjcf: So, what do you think it's important? also, it's not God's fault that this world is so full of misery and pain, it's our fault.

See the part I bolded?  Where did you get the idea that we are to blame for misery and pain?  And how would you back up that claim without using the Bible, or your personal religious beliefs?

Mmm... who would you blame for all the sadness in the world if not people? let's try to explain a little bit about the devil: when someone hurts you, in this hypotetical situation, you get home and you hurt someone else if given the chance, someone inocent, this person would acumulate this evil and eventually even have fun hurting others, or enjoy when seeing someone in pain; think about cruelty at school... children being cruel with other children; would you call that rational? being lazy, using drugs... so, we believe this "evil" is a force that moves from people to people, during our childhood we are often defenseless against it, but there comes a time in which we can choose.

Alzael: I'm a girl, as an administrator I think you should show some respect to people in the forum, specially to girls, even wondered why you feel forced to "attack"? about your arguments against the Bible, please take into consideration it was written by men, and twisted by the devil.

See the part I bolded?  That is unsubstantiated.  It is you, using your personal beliefs, to make a claim about something that your religion invented.  Can you show us that there is a devil?  What does it look like, and how do you know what it looks like?  What gender is the devil, and how do you know?  Where can we find this devil, so that we can know it is actually real?  If I told you I had a real alien spaceship in my garage, would you want to see it, or would you just believe me? 

Or do you just plan on continuing to say there is a devil, because that's what you believe based on your understanding of your religion, or your god?

It's pretty much the same here, if you check certain chatolic books, you will find they are fake, how would you explain that people would porpously distort the Bible? unlike you, we believe Evil is not random but an entity, and we fight against it.

[Alzael]

Basically, you dont need to read the Bible to know what it's all about, because you have a notion of what's good and what's not. That's why you shouldn't care about what have been twisted and what have not, you will notice it yourself without much problem, for example:

- Job's suffering...?
- Jesus preaches...?
- Kill everyone...?
- You shall not kill...?

What do you think have been introduced by twisted men, satan, fake christians?

What do you think is pure and good?

If you read about Jesus, you could become fascinated by his words... some of that could just be something you would like to try, even being an atheist... now, for regular people is very hard to change, God helps people to change, you might have heard some stories, like a thief or a murderer... people in the street with any kind of bad habits that change when meet God, so... you might get interested in God once you start reading. From that point, you can do some researches on internet and find some information about what have been faked in the Bible, just know you cannot stop there, the best tool is to trust your judgement, because the good is inside you.

So.....basically you just made everything up. What a bolf defiance of established trends.

You know what is missing from this, evidence of any kind to support your claims. Which is exactly what they are, claims made in ignorance and devoid of reason or thought.

Take my advice, actually think about what you type before you type it. Saying stupid things like that just serves to embarrass yourself and your fellow christians who actually have put at least some thought into it.

[Revival]

hypagoga: Mmm... you're right, God is not omnipotent.

Alzael: I cannot write 1000 lines to explain you what have been included or excluded in the Bible so far we know, you wouldn't read it eitherway, and if you trully want to know, google it (even when there is a lot more and there are no proves of that). I just pointed what you could use to difenciate what is and what is not from God.

Really, if you're interested in knowing what have been introduced in the Bible, you dont need me. Let me know if you have any other question.

[jetson]

Mmm... who would you blame for all the sadness in the world if not people? let's try to explain a little bit about the devil: when someone hurts you, in this hypotetical situation, you get home and you hurt someone else if given the chance, someone inocent, this person would acumulate this evil and eventually even have fun hurting others, or enjoy when seeing someone in pain; think about cruelty at school... children being cruel with other children; would you call that rational? being lazy, using drugs... so, we believe this "evil" is a force that moves from people to people, during our childhood we are often defenseless against it, but there comes a time in which we can choose.

People don't always treat each other nicely.  For those people who choose to be mean, or nasty, I blame them, not "the devil".  Blaming the devil does not help, since there is no devil.

It's pretty much the same here, if you check certain chatolic books, you will find they are fake, how would you explain that people would porpously distort the Bible? unlike you, we believe Evil is not random but an entity, and we fight against it.

You are not fighting a random evil entity.  If you do anything to help alleviate pain and suffering, you are simply trying to combat some of the worst parts of the human condition.  We're stuck on this planet with each other, and we have all the tools we need to help each other, and get along.  Adding in superstition does nothing but divide people by their beliefs.

[Historicity]

Zankuu: I dont want to enter into a debate because my religion is not about that, instead, you could try to point your arguments as questions so I can reply, and you can get your debate.

So first you said you would answer our questions about God and now you say you won't?  You just said you won't debate.  Or are you saying that you won't answer a question that is difficult because that would be a debate?  Or maybe you said you will answer questions because then it will be a debate but you won't debate?

You surpass the Zen Buddhists' koans for contradiction.

[Avatar Of Belial]

hahaha, your post is pretty funny Avatar Of Belial...!

Yeah, I get that a lot from people who are unable to see that they have problems.

Let me know when you have some questions about God so we can discuss like human beings

MY post is funny? Strange, because here it seems you are making the joke. Isn't "debating" your god against your religion? You've repeatedly stated you aren't here to debate, but if you have any intention of discussing your god that is exactly what this will turn into. You are obviously dishonest, prideful, and ignorant - thus setting yourself up as an extremely poor spokesperson for your religion, as you don't even represent the values you espouse. You have provided no reason to believe your god exists. If you want to have any "discussion", debate or otherwise you will need to start there.

I think your post just proves atheists as non racional people.

Care to describe how my post shows any atheist to be "non racional", or are you simply reacting to being insulted for blindly wading in here with no clue as to what you would be getting into? (I'm betting it's the second one.) Don't make a claim like that if you can't back it up. It does not help your case.

Had you approached the subject in a clear and rational way, you wouldn't be having these problems, yet you jump in thinking you can speak for God when you can't even prove his existence.

You haven't gotten anywhere because you came in here and acted like a jackass. You got a much nicer response than you deserved. Sadly, I will continue to be nice by giving you some actual questions. If you can't answer these to start you have no reason to stay here.

What makes you think you can speak for a god?

What makes you think you're even speaking for the right one? What proof do you have that you shouldn't be worshiping Mithra, Odin, Allah, or Ra?

What makes you think you have any more knowledge or capability than all the previous Christians who came in here lacking any interest in logical debate to convince us you aren't delusional and you god actually exists?

Mmm... who would you blame for all the sadness in the world if not people?

All of it? Bit of a stretch. Do earthquakes, tornadoes, hurricanes, and other major natural disasters not cause pain, suffering, and sadness? Are you actually proposing that humans sent that hurricane that destroyed New Orleans? Are you seriously saying humans made the earthquake and tsunami that ravaged Japan? Did humans make the asteroid kill the dinosaurs too?

let's try to explain a little bit about the devil

How about giving us a reason to think it exists first. You aren't going to get anywhere if you can't give us a reason to actually think there's some chance of these things existing.

[Revival]

Well I'm only replying to Jetson, (and Historicity... I mean, please make short questions so I can see your point faster and reply, not to debate like I said before but to try to clear up some doubts or ideas about God).

Jetson: You should be able to realize there is not common sense in the way evil works inside of people and from one person to another, almost like one person acting with evil can "give to birth" evil into another person without logical reason. By looking at the way evil acts in people, you can almost see it acting like a virus... something "alive", it even grows and evolves, hurting the "host" over and over and well... let's say God used the "Devil" word as a way for us to understand it better, it's the same no matter how you see it:

The cure against evil is forgiving people that have caused pain in your life, fighting "evil" with love... it works! so, if you see someone in pain or angry, some nice words, a hugg or something like that would deal a huge difference. Think about it, and you see is not so important the way you look at it... but the actions you can take.