An Atheist's Moral Dilemma?

[Slartibartfast]

I think whatislife is a troll...

[jetson]

Here we go.  I capitalized everything and removed the spaces.  Now it looks like a more genuine attempt to communicate.

IMNOTTOSUREABOUTTHEBELIEVESOFTHERELIGIONOFTHEATHEISTBUTFROMWHATIGATHERTHEREISNOGODSOYOUWORSHIPY
OURSELFSOTHEONLYMORALSYOURBOUNDTOISWHATMAKESYOUFEELGOODSOWHYISTHEREAMORALDELIMMAIFTHEREISNOGODPEOPL
EARETHESAMEASABLADEOFGRASSANDWHENABLADEOFGRASSBUGSYOUYOUCUTITDOWNSOMETIMESATHIAISMISKINDOFAPEALINGT
HEFACTTHATTHEREISNOTHINGTOWORRYABOUTBUTYOUROWNCOMFORTSOIFYOUDONTWANTYOURBABYKILLITIFSOMTHINGOFFENDSY
OUKILLITYOUDONTHAVETOLOVEORFORGIVEYOUJUSTHAVETOWORRYABOUTHOWYOUFEELNOWBECAUSEWHENYOUDIEYOUJUSTTURNB
ACKTODIRTBUTIFTHEREISAGODTHENTHEREISAHEAVNANDAHELLANDLIVINGINAPLACEOFETERNALPAINANDANGERDOSNTSOUNDSOF
UNSOIWOULDSUGGESTGIVINGGODASECONDLOOKFORGODSOLOVEDTHEWORLDTHATHEGAVEHISONLYBEGOTTENSONTHATWHOSOEV
ERBELIEVITHINHIMWOULDNOTPARISHBUTHAVEEVERLASTINGLIFE.JOHN3:16SOWITHANOPENMINDIASKYOUTOREADTHEGOSPELOFJO
HNINTHEBIBLENOTFORMENOTFORGODBUTFORYOU

If you do some letter counting, and proper arithmetic, you will notice there is a message from Satan in the text.  The message is "Go back to school, you missed something very important."  I've always liked Satan, and now I know why!

Jetson

[Alzael]

I think whatislife is a troll...

Naturally. That;s why he only hang around lurking for a couple of hours after he made the post. Just another in a long, nearly undending line lately.

[mram]

Here we go.  I capitalized everything and removed the spaces.  Now it looks like a more genuine attempt to communicate.

IMNOTTOSUREABOUTTHEBELIEVESOFTHERELIGIONOFTHEATHEISTBUTFROMWHATIGATHERTHEREISNOGODSOYOUWORSHIPY
OURSELFSOTHEONLYMORALSYOURBOUNDTOISWHATMAKESYOUFEELGOODSOWHYISTHEREAMORALDELIMMAIFTHEREISNOGODPEOPL
EARETHESAMEASABLADEOFGRASSANDWHENABLADEOFGRASSBUGSYOUYOUCUTITDOWNSOMETIMESATHIAISMISKINDOFAPEALINGT
HEFACTTHATTHEREISNOTHINGTOWORRYABOUTBUTYOUROWNCOMFORTSOIFYOUDONTWANTYOURBABYKILLITIFSOMTHINGOFFENDSY
OUKILLITYOUDONTHAVETOLOVEORFORGIVEYOUJUSTHAVETOWORRYABOUTHOWYOUFEELNOWBECAUSEWHENYOUDIEYOUJUSTTURNB
ACKTODIRTBUTIFTHEREISAGODTHENTHEREISAHEAVNANDAHELLANDLIVINGINAPLACEOFETERNALPAINANDANGERDOSNTSOUNDSOF
UNSOIWOULDSUGGESTGIVINGGODASECONDLOOKFORGODSOLOVEDTHEWORLDTHATHEGAVEHISONLYBEGOTTENSONTHATWHOSOEV
ERBELIEVITHINHIMWOULDNOTPARISHBUTHAVEEVERLASTINGLIFE.JOHN3:16SOWITHANOPENMINDIASKYOUTOREADTHEGOSPELOFJO
HNINTHEBIBLENOTFORMENOTFORGODBUTFORYOU

If you do some letter counting, and proper arithmetic, you will notice there is a message from Satan in the text.  The message is "Go back to school, you missed something very important."  I've always liked Satan, and now I know why!

Jetson

Plus if you read it backwards it screws up your eyeballs! They work as ears and you can see out of the side of your head!

[Persephone]

xphobe, dang you're good. +1

Thanks for the laugh.

[xphobe]

Thanks, Pooz!   

[Death over Life]

From what I have seen, if Christians are allowed to flaunt their Christianity even though it goes against separation of Church and State, atheists should have every right to flaunt their atheism. If they decide to fire you because of it, you are 1 phone call away from the ACLU and as such, a lawsuit.

Even though atheism is a lack of belief and not a belief, atheism is still protected under the Constitution as if it were a belief.

[Sergio]

So we need to fear "God" so we can be good human beings? Haha. I choose to be a good person because I live amongst equals (even though some are dumber than others) and I believe we need to respect and care for each other.

These arguments always make laugh.

[Grimm]

All I know is that the internet is an amazing place, one in which all sorts of viewpoints get their opportunity to exist alongside their peers.   Unfortunately, not only does it give credence to stupid and woo, it also lets people think that half-literate, unpunctuated screeds are somehow 'communication'.

One day, the fundie Xtian fanbase is going to realize that you have to learn how to communicate to get your message across.  One day.  I hope.  I'd pray for it if it were possible.

How is it that people expect to be taken seriously when they don't even comprehend what a sentence is?

[mram]

All I know is that the internet is an amazing place, one in which all sorts of viewpoints get their opportunity to exist alongside their peers.   Unfortunately, not only does it give credence to stupid and woo, it also lets people think that half-literate, unpunctuated screeds are somehow 'communication'.

One day, the fundie Xtian fanbase is going to realize that you have to learn how to communicate to get your message across.  One day.  I hope.  I'd pray for it if it were possible.

How is it that people expect to be taken seriously when they don't even comprehend what a sentence is?

It's kind of amazing how the internet can make even the lamest ignoramus seem...almost credible isn't it?  I bet if my gold fish could type they could write something credible like... oops...oops..oops..oops..oops. Hey! Food! ..oops..oops..oops..   I once told someone their comments were almost as useful as snow tires on a gold fish, but hey..they get credit for their comments..

[LadyLucy]

@ whatislife:

Yuck, thanks for de-railing the thread with your... knowledge. Perhaps you should stop reading Conservapedia or Merriam Webster's wonderfully written [and Christian-approved - cough] definition of an atheist. Or is that all that you are willing to read, my "open-minded" friend? Hmm?

[gaiawrath]

1 post + no punctuation + no replies = troll.

Math is awesome.

[servantofgod]

Well, you're a liar.  Are you comfortable with being a liar?  If you're not, then tell him the truth.  Otherwise you're nothing but a hypocrite. 

The problem that atheists have, morality wise, is that they have no standard of good and evil.  It is only a subjective opinion, only what an individual thinks it is.  In the world of the atheist, there really is no such thing as good..for those things are completely transient and situational.  God on the other hand never changes.  His standard for good, which is perfection, has never changed and is completely dependable.

So here it is:

My boss at work is a Christian. He assumes I'm a Christian and I don't want to tell him otherwise, but I go further and play along with it.

For instance I pretended to be excited about Easter last week. When he said, "He is risen!" I replied "Risen indeed!" 

Is it wrong that I lie about my atheism to stay on my boss's good side and keep my job secure? I mean, I've delved into ethics and I'm still unsure of how to behave (too be perfectly honest). I feel pain, though, when I disown my intellectual integrity.

[Azdgari]

The problem that atheists have, morality wise, is that they have no standard of good and evil.

Sure we do.  Your prejudice is showing, by the way.

It is only a subjective opinion, only what an individual thinks it is.

Now you've contradicted yourself, becaust what you describe is a standard.  And it's no less subjective than any standard available to you as a theist, too.

In the world of the atheist, there really is no such thing as good..for those things are completely transient and situational.  God on the other hand never changes.  His standard for good, which is perfection, has never changed and is completely dependable.

What makes his standards good?  And what state or goal are they perfect at acheiving?

[Alzael]

Well, you're a liar.  Are you comfortable with being a liar?  If you're not, then tell him the truth.  Otherwise you're nothing but a hypocrite. 

The problem that atheists have, morality wise, is that they have no standard of good and evil.  It is only a subjective opinion, only what an individual thinks it is.  In the world of the atheist, there really is no such thing as good..for those things are completely transient and situational.  God on the other hand never changes.  His standard for good, which is perfection, has never changed and is completely dependable.

Well, you're a liar too. Because god does change.....constantly. Such as when he used to require human sacrifices. He doesn't now right? Such as when he used to wipe out humanity in floods, then decided he didn't want to do that anymore. So you're two posts into the forum and already you're a liar and a hypocrite. Or just possibly completely ignorant of your own religion.

As to the other thing, you do realize that your morality is equally as subjective. Your morality is determined by what god tells you to do. That makes your morality completely subjective. In order for morality to be objective morality would have to exist and be completely indepentant of god. If you're going to make statements of dishonesty and ignorance, at least read a book first and know what you're talking about.

His standard for good, which is perfection, has never changed and is completely dependable.

Which is it? Good or perfection, they aren't the same thing. And yes it has changed, once again, actually read your bible instead of thumping with it.

[jetson]

Well, you're a liar.  Are you comfortable with being a liar?  If you're not, then tell him the truth.  Otherwise you're nothing but a hypocrite. 

The problem that atheists have, morality wise, is that they have no standard of good and evil.  It is only a subjective opinion, only what an individual thinks it is.  In the world of the atheist, there really is no such thing as good..for those things are completely transient and situational.  God on the other hand never changes.  His standard for good, which is perfection, has never changed and is completely dependable.

WTF?  I can see you don't know the first thing about atheism.  While you're busy falling to your knees for a completely invisible, and very imaginary doofus named God, the rest of the world is trying to repair the damage done by such barbaric thinking as we find in your holey book.  You might want to peel your face out of the Bible for a moment, assuming you've even read the thing, and take a look a the world around you.  It is leaving your barely medieval thinking behind, and proving time and time again that the only thing religion seems to be good for is covering up the very worst acts of humanity in a warm blanket of "Christian goodness", which has turned out such great hits as Priest Pedophilia, and drug-addicted, gay bashing, gay pastors.  These people would turn Jesus over in his grave, and he's not even real!

If you had a clue, you could easily find direct evidence that the prisons in the U.S. are filled with Christians, not atheists.  It is interesting to see a "servant of god" running around making shit up about people he doesn't know.  It's a fairly standard approach to dealing with your personal delusion.  And another nail in the coffin of the truly worst god and religion ever invented - yours.

[servantofgod]

What do you mean, all of the damage religion has done?  Do you know that more people have died in the last century from the hands of atheists and atheist philosophies than all of the deaths from religious wars put together? 

If you live in America, for example, this country was built on Christian principles.  Those very same Christian principles are what give you your freedom to practice whatever religion, or lack there of, that you choose.  Seems like it has worked out for you pretty well. 

And I do know a thing or two about atheism.  If you have an objective standard for good, I am all ears.

[Alzael]

What do you mean, all of the damage religion has done?  Do you know that more people have died in the last century from the hands of atheists and atheist philosophies than all of the deaths from religious wars put together? 

There's no such thing as an atheist philosophy. So you're already showing your lack of education.

And I do know a thing or two about atheism.  If you have an objective standard for good, I am all ears.

Why? As pointed out in the other thread, you don't even have an objective standard for good.

If you live in America, for example, this country was built on Christian principles.  Those very same Christian principles are what give you your freedom to practice whatever religion, or lack there of, that you choose.  Seems like it has worked out for you pretty well. 

Show me one single Christian principle that places a value on freedom. Especially the freedom of others to pick their own religion. Seriously, go ahead, meanwhile I'll go back to the real world.

[jetson]

What do you mean, all of the damage religion has done?  Do you know that more people have died in the last century from the hands of atheists and atheist philosophies than all of the deaths from religious wars put together? 

If you live in America, for example, this country was built on Christian principles.  Those very same Christian principles are what give you your freedom to practice whatever religion, or lack there of, that you choose.  Seems like it has worked out for you pretty well. 

And I do know a thing or two about atheism.  If you have an objective standard for good, I am all ears.

You are not all ears.  You're all God.  You bring absolutely nothing intellectual to this forum.  Why are you even here?  Do you have a plan of some sort?  You are spewing out crap that has been splattered all over the place by Christians from every one of the 38,000 sects, and none of it turns out to be even remotely accurate.

Big deal, the country started out with a bunch of Christians, so what?  What the hell does that have to do with being a good person?  You bounce in here and assert that atheists have no standards for good, and you could not be more wrong.  You know nothing about us.  And honestly, you caught me in a bad mood, so I'm unloading a bit because I have heard this BS far too many times.

Maybe you're a nice person, I would like to think so.  But how can I begin to determine that when you start off making unfounded claims about atheists?  Nice people don't do that.  What are you trying to accomplish?

Do you have any "Jesus" advice for the person you called a liar?  Maybe something from the Sermon on the Mount, I don't know - something more "Jesus-ey"

[Alzael]

Kind of like a yappy little chihuahua isn't he.

[rev45]

Oh Flying Spaghetti Monster give me strength and a few more shots of Jameson.

[jetson]

Kind of like a yappy little chihuahua isn't he.

Yeah, I hate to be so terse, but for Christ sake, I feel like Bill Murray from the movie Groundhog Day

[Alzael]

Kind of like a yappy little chihuahua isn't he.

Yeah, I hate to be so terse, but for Christ sake, I feel like Bill Murray from the movie Groundhog Day

You could always try hitting him on the nose with a rolled up newspaper.

[jetson]

Kind of like a yappy little chihuahua isn't he.

Yeah, I hate to be so terse, but for Christ sake, I feel like Bill Murray from the movie Groundhog Day

You could always try hitting him on the nose with a rolled up newspaper.

Well, we do need a new chew toy.  I'm even willing to let the preaching slide a bit, should we convert him to atheist?

[Death over Life]

Kind of like a yappy little chihuahua isn't he.

Yeah, I hate to be so terse, but for Christ sake, I feel like Bill Murray from the movie Groundhog Day

You could always try hitting him on the nose with a rolled up newspaper.

Well, we do need a new chew toy.  I'm even willing to let the preaching slide a bit, should we convert him to atheist?

Look at the wonders it did for me. I say yes!

[rev45]

I don't know if he'd be willing to convert to our Atheist philosophies. 

[jetson]

Look at the wonders it did for me. I say yes!

Ha!  Indeed, but you didn't roll into the form calling atheists liars!  You gave us a chance...

[Alzael]

Well, we do need a new chew toy.  I'm even willing to let the preaching slide a bit, should we convert him to atheist?

If you want. Just promise to keep him off the furniture and make sure he doesn't urinate on HAL's favourite rug.

Then once the barking gets too annoying, we'll put him down.

[mram]

Hmmm... this freedom and religion thing.. What would god do?   OH! I know! Either love me and nobody else or I'll BURN and TORTURE you for EVER and EVER and EVER!
Nothing says freedom like burning and torturing people for eternity! 
God: But you're free to chose.. Love Me or torture and burning forever and ever.. That's only fair...right?