Author Topic: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth  (Read 368 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline The Gawd

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1534
  • Darwins +138/-6
  • Gender: Male
  • WWGHA Member
it said something to the effect of, "You all remember the myth of Abraham and his sons which represent..."

Anyone know where it is? I cannot find it now.

Offline Graybeard

  • Professor
  • ********
  • Posts: 8423
  • Darwins +881/-28
  • Gender: Male
  • Is this going somewhere?
Ga:4:22: For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
Ga:4:23: But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
Ga:4:24: Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
Ga:4:25: For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
Ga:4:26: But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
Nobody says “There are many things that we thought were natural processes, but now know that a god did them.”

Offline John 3 16

  • Postgraduate
  • *****
  • Posts: 681
  • Darwins +3/-18
  • Gender: Male
  • Darwins +0/-1,000,000,000
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #2 on: November 23, 2016, 09:25:42 AM »
I didn't know every allegorical stories are myths.
If I ever stop showing up here.
You know I am unjustly banned by Mods.

Offline velkyn

  • Laureate
  • *********
  • Posts: 16204
  • Darwins +258/-9
  • Gender: Female
  • You're wearing the juice, aren't you?"
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2016, 08:46:27 PM »
I didn't know every allegorical stories are myths.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegory

"As a literary device, an allegory is a metaphor whose vehicle may be a character, place or event, representing real-world issues and occurrences. Allegory has been used widely throughout history in all forms of art, largely because it can readily illustrate complex ideas and concepts in ways that are comprehensible or striking to its viewers, readers, or listeners."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth

"A myth is any traditional story consisting of events that are ostensibly historical, though often supernatural, explaining the origins of a cultural practice or natural phenomenon"

you can also have just-so stories, that were used by Kipling to give a reason for why animals are the way they are for his kids.  The concept has spread to any story that gives an explanation but isn't terribly well supported by reality. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-so_story 

"There is no use in arguing with a man who can multiply anything by the square root of minus 1" - Pirates of Venus, ERB

http://clubschadenfreude.wordpress.com/

Offline The Gawd

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1534
  • Darwins +138/-6
  • Gender: Male
  • WWGHA Member
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2016, 09:20:31 AM »
I didn't know every allegorical stories are myths.

Serious question. Now that you know this is an allegory because Jesus said so, does it change anything for you?

Offline John 3 16

  • Postgraduate
  • *****
  • Posts: 681
  • Darwins +3/-18
  • Gender: Male
  • Darwins +0/-1,000,000,000
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2016, 10:15:50 AM »
I believe real people can be included in an allegory.
It's been done many times.

Symbolic figures such as Hilter, Jesus, Mao,,,,

e,g, Santa and Scrooge in "Christmas Carol"
If I ever stop showing up here.
You know I am unjustly banned by Mods.

Offline The Gawd

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1534
  • Darwins +138/-6
  • Gender: Male
  • WWGHA Member
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2016, 11:23:22 AM »
I believe real people can be included in an allegory.
It's been done many times.

Symbolic figures such as Hilter, Jesus, Mao,,,,

e,g, Santa and Scrooge in "Christmas Carol"

No, as the definition provided states it is a metaphor. If the situation being described in the allegory is real then it is not an allegory, it is simply true. However, based on your answer it seems that your answer to my question is that it doesnt change anything for you.

Very well then. Not even Jesus' words in the bible is more powerful than a Christian's belief.

Offline John 3 16

  • Postgraduate
  • *****
  • Posts: 681
  • Darwins +3/-18
  • Gender: Male
  • Darwins +0/-1,000,000,000
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #7 on: November 25, 2016, 11:35:43 AM »
So real, symbolic people can not be used in an allegory?
If I ever stop showing up here.
You know I am unjustly banned by Mods.

Offline Foxy Freedom

  • Fellow
  • *******
  • Posts: 2703
  • Darwins +304/-14
  • Why is it so difficult to say you don't know?
    • Foxy Freedom on Doctor Who
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2016, 03:32:07 PM »
So real, symbolic people can not be used in an allegory?

Of course they can, but the allegory tells you about the author of the allegory not about the relation of the characters in allegory to reality.

Matthew's gospel is written as an allegory of Moses and the Pentateuch and is not supposed to be read as a biography of Jesus. Matthew used the OT to correct Mark who did not know that his stories about Jesus were really reworked OT miracles used to support contemporary ideology which had nothing to do with Jesus. Matthew's attitude to Mark shows that Matthew knew Mark was not a historical biography. Mark wrote that the women at the tomb said nothing, but Matthew purposely changed Mark's ideology and wrote an allegory of zombies roaming around Jerusalem with a physical resurrection of Jesus, based on Isaiah. No one had heard of a physical resurrection of Jesus before this. Jesus was only seen in visions and dreams.
The Foxy Freedom antitheist website is http://the6antitheist6guide6.blogspot.co.uk

The 2nd edition of the free ebook Devil or Delusion ? The danger of Christianity to Democracy Freedom and Science.       http://t.co/2d1KcJ9V

Offline velkyn

  • Laureate
  • *********
  • Posts: 16204
  • Darwins +258/-9
  • Gender: Female
  • You're wearing the juice, aren't you?"
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2016, 03:40:30 PM »
So real, symbolic people can not be used in an allegory?

what does "rea,l symbolic" mean, John?

Quote
Symbolic figures such as Hilter, Jesus, Mao,,,,
  Two of these are known to be real.  The other isn't.  But if you do wish to claim JC is just a symbol, that's fine with me. 

Quote
e,g, Santa and Scrooge in "Christmas Carol
  These aren't real people, John. They are characters in fiction. 


And really, this is your sig?  "If I ever stop showing up here. You know I am unjustly banned by Mods."  Why do Christians like you have to make false claims so often?   
"There is no use in arguing with a man who can multiply anything by the square root of minus 1" - Pirates of Venus, ERB

http://clubschadenfreude.wordpress.com/

Offline Nick

  • Laureate
  • *********
  • Posts: 12431
  • Darwins +322/-9
  • Gender: Male
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2016, 11:37:36 AM »
Gee, is that not the basis for all 3 current major religions?  And it is a myth???
Yo, put that in your pipe and smoke it.  Quit ragging on my Lord.

Tide goes in, tide goes out !!!

Offline The Gawd

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1534
  • Darwins +138/-6
  • Gender: Male
  • WWGHA Member
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #11 on: November 28, 2016, 12:28:37 AM »
Gee, is that not the basis for all 3 current major religions?  And it is a myth???

People losing lives by the thousands over it. Lives could be saved by simply reading their bible.

Offline Backspace

  • Reader
  • ******
  • Posts: 1598
  • Darwins +98/-1
  • Gender: Male
  • IXNAY
Re: There was a verse in the NT that admitted the Abraham story was a myth
« Reply #12 on: November 28, 2016, 03:48:38 PM »
People losing lives by the thousands over it. Lives could be saved by simply reading their bible.

Good luck with that...
There is no opinion so absurd that a preacher could not express it.
-- Bernie Katz