Author Topic: why I want to follow the Spirit  (Read 382 times)

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Online stuffin

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #29 on: March 03, 2017, 08:47:05 AM »
Hi Lilly.

1) Please define "Spirit."
2) please state, as if it is not obvious to anyone else, why it is "obvious to you" to want to follow it.

thanks!

Boots

1) That which ascends <human> reason and logic
2) It's obvious to me since I got to know it. The spirit is good, who doesn't want a little comfort in a world so cruel? It's transformational. I know a lot don't understand, I know a lot are vicious envious murderers. I chose not to be. I figured that way is beneficent.




Has this spirit made you into a Shape Shifter?
The Greatest Story Ever Told Was So Wrong

Been Two thousand Years and He Ain't Shown Yet,

We Kept His Seat Warm and The Table Set.

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Offline Boots

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2017, 12:06:05 PM »
Hi Lilly.

1) Please define "Spirit."
2) please state, as if it is not obvious to anyone else, why it is "obvious to you" to want to follow it.

thanks!

Boots

1) That which ascends <human> reason and logic

From, what, and to what?  Can *any*thing which does this be called "spirit" (like, say, meditation or martial arts--I've experienced what could be described as "ascendance" with one of these)?  Who decides how far human reason and logic "ascends" before it's this spirit that is doing it?

Quote
2) It's obvious to me since I got to know it. The spirit is good, who doesn't want a little comfort in a world so cruel? It's transformational. I know a lot don't understand, I know a lot are vicious envious murderers. I chose not to be. I figured that way is beneficient.

you didn't really answer my question.  You said "it's obvious to me."  My question was "WHY was it obvious?"  and your answer was "it's obvious to me."  Um, WHY IS IT OBVIOUS, please.

Also, if this thing you're calling "spirit" ascends human logic, how can human logic determine whether it is "good?"  What standard of "good" are you using?

Comfort: Um, okay.  "Comfort" is not necessarily "Good."  addictive drugs can give (temporary) comfort.  Sticking your head in the proverbial sand can also be comforting.  Neither of those are good.

For the record, I am not vicious, envious (of most things), or a murderer.  I eschew supernaturalism, though, as fluff and woo that is unnecessary to improve the human condition.  (read my Sam Harris quote in my sig)

thank you for taking my questions seriously.
...religion is simply tribalism with a side order of philosophical wankery, and occasionally a baseball bat to smash...anyone who doesn't show...deference to the tribe's chosen totem.

~Astreja

To not believe in god is to know that it falls to us to make the world a better place.

~Sam Harris

Offline Lilly Pool

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #31 on: March 03, 2017, 02:04:46 PM »
Hi Lilly.

1) Please define "Spirit."
2) please state, as if it is not obvious to anyone else, why it is "obvious to you" to want to follow it.

thanks!

Boots

1) That which ascends <human> reason and logic

From, what, and to what?  Can *any*thing which does this be called "spirit" (like, say, meditation or martial arts--I've experienced what could be described as "ascendance" with one of these)?  Who decides how far human reason and logic "ascends" before it's this spirit that is doing it?

It's not bringing logic and reason to another, in this case "higher" level, if that is what you're pointing out with your reply. Spirit is something existing on it's own beyond control of logic and reason. It's rather sensed and thought of than reasoned.

Quote
2) It's obvious to me since I got to know it. The spirit is good, who doesn't want a little comfort in a world so cruel? It's transformational. I know a lot don't understand, I know a lot are vicious envious murderers. I chose not to be. I figured that way is beneficient.

you didn't really answer my question.  You said "it's obvious to me."  My question was "WHY was it obvious?"  and your answer was "it's obvious to me."  Um, WHY IS IT OBVIOUS, please.

Also, if this thing you're calling "spirit" ascends human logic, how can human logic determine whether it is "good?"  What standard of "good" are you using?

Comfort: Um, okay.  "Comfort" is not necessarily "Good."  addictive drugs can give (temporary) comfort.  Sticking your head in the proverbial sand can also be comforting.  Neither of those are good.

For the record, I am not vicious, envious (of most things), or a murderer.  I eschew supernaturalism, though, as fluff and woo that is unnecessary to improve the human condition.  (read my Sam Harris quote in my sig)

thank you for taking my questions seriously.

it's not temporary comfort, I feel you're taking a walk with me here. You ask questions but I'm not sure you really want answers and you can say what you want on the internet about yourself whatever you like, it's for everybody the same.

So, what was your question? Is it still why it is obvious for myself to follow the Spirit? There are many reasons actually. I can depend on it without feeling dependent. It nurtures. I can be fully me with it. It makes me happy and I don't get withdrawal symptoms or need to go to rehab because of it. Fine, go reason me out of it now.

Offline Emma286

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2017, 02:37:48 PM »
Fine. If you're so certain of what you say (that you're right and we're dead wrong and nothing we can say can change your mind) what are you doing here raising the subject with people? Why don't you just go away?

Oh yeah (by your own admission) you've only just joined here to annoy others haven't you?

How sad.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 02:43:37 PM by Emma286 »

Offline Lilly Pool

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2017, 02:53:17 PM »
Fine. If you're so certain of what you say (that you're right and we're dead wrong and nothing we can say can change your mind) what are you doing here raising the subject with people? Why don't you just go away?

Oh yeah (by your own admission) you've only just joined here to annoy others haven't you?

How sad.

You're not dead wrong, you're just different than me as I am different than you. We don't think alike. As far as I can tell you sure are the spicey one around here  ;D

Offline jdawg70

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2017, 03:04:26 PM »
It's not bringing logic and reason to another, in this case "higher" level, if that is what you're pointing out with your reply. Spirit is something existing on it's own beyond control of logic and reason.
I'm not sure if I would agree that anything exists due to the control of logic and reason.  Is this you saying that the process of determining whether or not 'spirit' exists is something that is outside of the scope of logic and reason?

Quote
It's rather sensed
Elaborate on what you mean by 'sensed'.  Presumably this isn't 'being sensed' in the same way one tastes food, sees light, touches grimy surfaces, smells sulfur, or hears music.  Alternatively, if that is the manner of 'being sensed', please describe what you've tasted, or have seen, or have touched, or have smelled, or have heard of 'spirit'.

Quote
and thought of than reasoned.
Could you better explain what you mean by this?  This is different from just making stuff up in one's imagination, yes?

To you, does the process of reasoning involve the process of thinking?  If you thought of something that both you and I agree is not real, say, a giant gorilla at the top of the Empire State Building, in what way would you be able to conclude that the giant gorilla does not, in fact, exist, via thinking without reason?
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."

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Offline Lilly Pool

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2017, 03:15:55 PM »
It's not bringing logic and reason to another, in this case "higher" level, if that is what you're pointing out with your reply. Spirit is something existing on it's own beyond control of logic and reason.
I'm not sure if I would agree that anything exists due to the control of logic and reason.  Is this you saying that the process of determining whether or not 'spirit' exists is something that is outside of the scope of logic and reason?

Quote
It's rather sensed
Elaborate on what you mean by 'sensed'.  Presumably this isn't 'being sensed' in the same way one tastes food, sees light, touches grimy surfaces, smells sulfur, or hears music.  Alternatively, if that is the manner of 'being sensed', please describe what you've tasted, or have seen, or have touched, or have smelled, or have heard of 'spirit'.

Quote
and thought of than reasoned.
Could you better explain what you mean by this?  This is different from just making stuff up in one's imagination, yes?

To you, does the process of reasoning involve the process of thinking?  If you thought of something that both you and I agree is not real, say, a giant gorilla at the top of the Empire State Building, in what way would you be able to conclude that the giant gorilla does not, in fact, exist, via thinking without reason?

Do you draw a line between reason and intuition, or perhaps you don't believe in intuition at all?

Offline jdawg70

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2017, 03:37:33 PM »
It's not bringing logic and reason to another, in this case "higher" level, if that is what you're pointing out with your reply. Spirit is something existing on it's own beyond control of logic and reason.
I'm not sure if I would agree that anything exists due to the control of logic and reason.  Is this you saying that the process of determining whether or not 'spirit' exists is something that is outside of the scope of logic and reason?

Quote
It's rather sensed
Elaborate on what you mean by 'sensed'.  Presumably this isn't 'being sensed' in the same way one tastes food, sees light, touches grimy surfaces, smells sulfur, or hears music.  Alternatively, if that is the manner of 'being sensed', please describe what you've tasted, or have seen, or have touched, or have smelled, or have heard of 'spirit'.

Quote
and thought of than reasoned.
Could you better explain what you mean by this?  This is different from just making stuff up in one's imagination, yes?

To you, does the process of reasoning involve the process of thinking?  If you thought of something that both you and I agree is not real, say, a giant gorilla at the top of the Empire State Building, in what way would you be able to conclude that the giant gorilla does not, in fact, exist, via thinking without reason?

Do you draw a line between reason and intuition, or perhaps you don't believe in intuition at all?

Intuition is a great tool.

You didn't mention anything about intuition though.  So some things ought to be intuitively derived rather than through reason?  How do you know when to bring which one to bear?

Also, please address the request for elaboration on what you mean by 'sensed'.
"When we landed on the moon, that was the point where god should have come up and said 'hello'. Because if you invent some creatures, put them on the blue one and they make it to the grey one, you f**king turn up and say 'well done'."

- Eddie Izzard

http://deepaksducttape.wordpress.com/

Offline velkyn

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #37 on: March 04, 2017, 03:38:37 PM »
1) That which ascends <human> reason and logic
2) It's obvious to me since I got to know it. The spirit is good, who doesn't want a little comfort in a world so cruel? It's transformational. I know a lot don't understand, I know a lot are vicious envious murderers. I chose not to be. I figured that way is beneficient.

It appears you are trying to call anyone who disagrees with you an "vicious envious murder".  Are you?

Disagrees on what?

Amazing, but expected from someone who wants to pretend that they know some "spirit" and pretend that they are better than everyone else.  when your baseless claims are pointed out, you must play stupid to delay the inevitable. Again, LP, read your own post to know who disagrees with what.   You have seemed to claim that anyone who disagrees with you that there is some "spirit" is a "vicious envious murderer".   This is the typical claim by a theist that no one but them is a decent person.   
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Offline Boots

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Re: why I want to follow the Spirit
« Reply #38 on: March 06, 2017, 03:44:10 PM »
it's not temporary comfort, I feel you're taking a walk with me here. You ask questions but I'm not sure you really want answers and you can say what you want on the internet about yourself whatever you like, it's for everybody the same.

thank you for inferring that I'm a liar, twice.  That really goes far in showing what a decent person you are, and in engaging me/us in conversation.

I don't make a habit of asking questions that I don't care to know the answers to, particularly here.  And I also don't make a habit of misrepresenting myself (to the best of my knowledge).  I'll consider continuing the conversation if I get over being miffed at your slights.
...religion is simply tribalism with a side order of philosophical wankery, and occasionally a baseball bat to smash...anyone who doesn't show...deference to the tribe's chosen totem.

~Astreja

To not believe in god is to know that it falls to us to make the world a better place.

~Sam Harris